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Old 11-07-2009, 04:55 PM
 
Location: South FL
9,444 posts, read 9,679,642 times
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Oh, on unrelated note, why in the world Americans work so many freaking hours a year? Every European country gets a lot more vacation time. Yeah, I know, I know, at this time anyone should just thank their lucky stars for having work, but seriously, come on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Freaking Italians are off almost the entire month of august!!!
Yeah - just made up my mind. Network Marketing is the way to go.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:00 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
12,832 posts, read 10,017,737 times
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I've also read that it's not just technology, but the prevalence of air conditioning, suburbia, and everyone having a car that contributes as well. Pre AC, people would sit out on their front porches in the evening or go for a walk, and end up chatting with each other and waving at neighbors but now people are holed up in their homes. Lots of subdivisions are being built that have no sidewalks, or aren't near public transportation, so they don't interact with people in that way, either.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:17 PM
 
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My best guess is because socialism didn't impact our politics as much as it did most European nations back in the day (1880s - 1940s). It had some impact, but the fact that we were a multiracial society kept it from gaining as much traction as it did in more racially homogenous nations. It was harder for working people of different races to identify with each other along class boundaries, and it was easier for bosses of working people to divide them along racial ones.

So, unions were never as strong. Cooperation was never as strong. Capitalism had more reign .. the balance of capitalism and socialism is prevelant in American society too of course, but there is a healthier dose of socialism in most European (and even non European .. aka Canadian, Australian and New Zealand) societies. The GDP isn't as high in these nations, but people are happier over all.

Whatever happiness is .. the Finns seem to have found the magic formula.

Anyways, sorry for the digression .. again, that's all my best guess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by max's mama View Post
Oh, on unrelated note, why in the world Americans work so many freaking hours a year? Every European country gets a lot more vacation time. Yeah, I know, I know, at this time anyone should just thank their lucky stars for having work, but seriously, come on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Freaking Italians are off almost the entire month of august!!!
Yeah - just made up my mind. Network Marketing is the way to go.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Tucson
42,846 posts, read 52,786,902 times
Reputation: 22742
Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetiebelle View Post
I've also read that it's not just technology, but the prevalence of air conditioning, suburbia, and everyone having a car that contributes as well. Pre AC, people would sit out on their front porches in the evening or go for a walk, and end up chatting with each other and waving at neighbors but now people are holed up in their homes. Lots of subdivisions are being built that have no sidewalks, or aren't near public transportation, so they don't interact with people in that way, either.
Of course. It's not about HAVING a car. There's nothing wrong with having a car. Being dependent on a car and being in it all the time and having your life revolving around it is wrong and that's the case in most of the country. How can you NOT be overweight when your as* is planted in a seat all day long?!

There are no sidewalks in most of Tucson. Why would we have them? It's not like anybody's walking! Businesses next door to one another are DELIBERATELY separated by walls, so you have to get in the car to get to the next one! Occasionally I'd leave my car in one strip mall and walk somewhere next door. Everybody looks at me as if I have 2 heads! You're either poor or a street walker to be walking on the streets... Sometimes it'd be so uncomfortable, I end up dangling my car key in hand!

Most of the houses here have front-loaded garages overwhelming the whole house! They look like palaces built for the cars and the little space left for their slaves is just an afterthought... Here's an example:



http://activerain.com/image_store/up...2775049734.jpg

My house happens to be an exception as I have a back-loaded garage. Ask me how often I see the front of my house, though! Less often than the others, I can tell you that! My neighborhood was built in a way supposed to promote walking, socializing, etc. extinct activities. Yes, you can see people walking and jogging, but other than that we just lack privacy and all you can see is garage doors opening and closing...
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:34 PM
 
7,824 posts, read 4,703,746 times
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Oh my god, Sierra .. this house looks exactly like the ones in the town I grew up in .. San Bernardino, CA. And I know all about the impossible to walk in feeling. I love to walk, but some places .. wow .. they make it difficult. Unfortunately, many of the suburbs in Atlanta (I live in one now) make it difficult to walk in too.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:38 PM
 
5,004 posts, read 5,062,246 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
Oh my god, Sierra .. this house looks exactly like the ones in the town I grew up in .. San Bernardino, CA. And I know all about the impossible to walk in feeling. I love to walk, but some places .. wow .. they make it difficult. Unfortunately, many of the suburbs in Atlanta (I live in one now) make it difficult to walk in too.
And the Antelope Valley in the high desert in California...

They say the demise of interaction of people in a neighborhood has to do with there being no porches, either. In these cookie-cutter suburbs everyone goes in their house or parks their car and automatically closes their garage doors, cutting them off from the rest of the world.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:43 PM
 
7,824 posts, read 4,703,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cricket_factor View Post
And the Antelope Valley in the high desert in California...

They say the demise of interaction of people in a neighborhood has to do with there being no porches, either. In these cookie-cutter suburbs everyone goes in their house or parks their car and automatically closes their garage doors, cutting them off from the rest of the world.
My brother in law is from Morroco. He married my sister, and they live in a neighborhood of houses exactly like this one in the north end of San Bernardino (really the only habitable part left for non gang bangers, criminals, etc.). His brother went to France instead of America as a young man. They both grew up in Morroco and lived there until their 20s. His brother came out to visit him a few years ago. He was just shaking his head and laughing at how his brother was living. His main comments were a) he works waaaaay too much and too hard and b) his neighborhood is soooo boring. Nothing ever happens in the street. Where are the people?

Consequently, his brother, in his 40s, is now retired and travels the world. My brother in law is a working stiff and will be until he dies, I'm sure. So you go ahead and rag on the French all you want, they must be doing something right, right?
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:50 PM
 
Location: South FL
9,444 posts, read 9,679,642 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sierraAZ View Post
Of course. It's not about HAVING a car. There's nothing wrong with having a car. Being dependent on a car and being in it all the time and having your life revolving around it is wrong and that's the case in most of the country. How can you NOT be overweight when your as* is planted in a seat all day long?!

There are no sidewalks in most of Tucson. Why would we have them? It's not like anybody's walking! Businesses next door to one another are DELIBERATELY separated by walls, so you have to get in the car to get to the next one! Occasionally I'd leave my car in one strip mall and walk somewhere next door. Everybody looks at me as if I have 2 heads! You're either poor or a street walker to be walking on the streets... Sometimes it'd be so uncomfortable, I end up dangling my car key in hand!

Most of the houses here have front-loaded garages overwhelming the whole house! They look like palaces built for the cars and the little space left for their slaves is just an afterthought... Here's an example:



http://activerain.com/image_store/up...2775049734.jpg

My house happens to be an exception as I have a back-loaded garage. Ask me how often I see the front of my house, though! Less often than the others, I can tell you that! My neighborhood was built in a way supposed to promote walking, socializing, etc. extinct activities. Yes, you can see people walking and jogging, but other than that we just lack privacy and all you can see is garage doors opening and closing...
You hit a nail in the head here.

I live in a gated community in a sunshine state. When I moved here from New York, I imagined that a lot of people get together in a club house, playing cards, getting together for dinner etc... It is SO not the case. Most people are closed-in, stay kind of to themselves, even when they are out at the pool. Nobody is reaching out to each other. Part of the reasons is the way the houses are designed. There are no front porches!!! In Brooklyn, most houses have porches, people sit outside, hang out, throw block parties. Granted, it is not like the old days, even in Brooklyn, people became more closed-in...but here, it's worse. People get in their cars and drive out of their garages to work and drive-in back into their garages when they come back from work. No "hello" to the neighbor, they don't even know who their neighbor is.
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:55 PM
 
Location: South FL
9,444 posts, read 9,679,642 times
Reputation: 7865
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
My brother in law is from Morroco. He married my sister, and they live in a neighborhood of houses exactly like this one in the north end of San Bernardino (really the only habitable part left for non gang bangers, criminals, etc.). His brother went to France instead of America as a young man. They both grew up in Morroco and lived there until their 20s. His brother came out to visit him a few years ago. He was just shaking his head and laughing at how his brother was living. His main comments were a) he works waaaaay too much and too hard and b) his neighborhood is soooo boring. Nothing ever happens in the street. Where are the people?

Consequently, his brother, in his 40s, is now retired and travels the world. My brother in law is a working stiff and will be until he dies, I'm sure. So you go ahead and rag on the French all you want, they must be doing something right, right?
Right.
Which brings me back to my original point that Americans know how to work, but don't know how to enjoy the money they are making. They work and work like slaves all their lives and some of them are lucky enough not to get cancer and survive until their retirement and enjoy their money.

People need to come out of their shells, come out of their houses and start having fun!!! My friend visited her relatives in Israel and she said that with all the terrorism and fear, people know how to live and enjoy life in that country. Hell, everywhere, but here.
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Old 11-07-2009, 06:12 PM
 
Location: Tucson
42,846 posts, read 52,786,902 times
Reputation: 22742
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
Oh my god, Sierra .. this house looks exactly like the ones in the town I grew up in .. San Bernardino, CA. And I know all about the impossible to walk in feeling. I love to walk, but some places .. wow .. they make it difficult. Unfortunately, many of the suburbs in Atlanta (I live in one now) make it difficult to walk in too.
Well, the "lifestyle" in CA is the same crap and worse...

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCobb View Post
He was just shaking his head and laughing at how his brother was living. His main comments were a) he works waaaaay too much and too hard and b) his neighborhood is soooo boring. Nothing ever happens in the street. Where are the people?

Consequently, his brother, in his 40s, is now retired and travels the world. My brother in law is a working stiff and will be until he dies, I'm sure. So you go ahead and rag on the French all you want, they must be doing something right, right?
I'll never forgive myself for wasting my life away here... Could've had some patience and found some other solutions - like staying in Europe or going some place else. It's just that Canada is so cold and Australia so far from Europe and I spoke only English...

Quote:
Originally Posted by max's mama View Post
You hit a nail in the head here.

I live in a gated community in a sunshine state. When I moved here from New York, I imagined that a lot of people get together in a club house, playing cards, getting together for dinner etc... It is SO not the case. Most people are closed-in, stay kind of to themselves, even when they are out at the pool. Nobody is reaching out to each other. Part of the reasons is the way the houses are designed. There are no front porches!!! In Brooklyn, most houses have porches, people sit outside, hang out, throw block parties. Granted, it is not like the old days, even in Brooklyn, people became more closed-in...but here, it's worse. People get in their cars and drive out of their garages to work and drive-in back into their garages when they come back from work. No "hello" to the neighbor, they don't even know who their neighbor is.
To be fair, the neighborhood next door which we're sort of part of (long and complicated story) does do all of the above and invites us all the time. As unusual as it sounds, they happen to be the other extreme and I'm a little hesitant to get too involved with them... Besides, they're mostly much older couples and I don't believe I'll fit in...

Many of my neighbors are single and around my age. You would think we can have a great neighborly life, but we don't... And it's not just me being excluded or anything... Just nobody feels the need for it, I guess! I have tried some - not much, but some...
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