U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Green Living
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-17-2011, 12:04 PM
 
15,924 posts, read 17,389,401 times
Reputation: 7641

Advertisements

This is the side of electric automobiles that many people fail to consider, the lifetime emissions of electric cars that include the manufacturing, driving and disposal of the vehicle.

Once all the above factors are figured in the electric automobile is worse than a gasoline powered car when it comes to lifetime CO2 pollution.

Electric cars may not be so green after all, says British study | The Australian

This is just another example of the public being mislead when it comes to green products.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-18-2011, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
30,652 posts, read 49,340,540 times
Reputation: 19085
The same can be said for photo-voltaic cells.

Solar panels are horribly polluting, and they require massive amounts of electricity for their manufacture.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-18-2011, 08:36 AM
 
39,298 posts, read 40,653,121 times
Reputation: 16134
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
and they require massive amounts of electricity for their manufacture.
Produced in China and powered by coal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-18-2011, 08:43 AM
 
20,978 posts, read 16,233,515 times
Reputation: 10270
I never look at research results, as their data outcome is only as honest as the people doing the research.

That being said, batteries are not the answer.

Think about your power tools, cell phones and other battery operated things.

How was the battery life when new?

How about a year later?

Besides, electricity is mainly produced by burning fossil fuels anyway.

The answer my friend, is Hybrid.....CNG and batteries.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-19-2011, 10:11 PM
 
Location: Holly Neighborhood, AUSTINtx
3,577 posts, read 5,298,417 times
Reputation: 2193
So the break even point is 129KM or about 80,000 miles. EVs should have no problem doing that since there are many 10 year old plus Priuses with their original batteries. The article did not state where the electricity was coming from either and what would happen if Nuclear or renewables were used.

And what about the other benefits such as reduced CO, SO, and particulate emissions? And the lack of motor oil in parking lots running into our streams and rivers? And please give me proof of this:

"Many electric cars are expected to need a replacement battery after a few years."

I have not heard of Teslas needing new batteries so what are they referring to?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2011, 02:08 PM
 
Location: Nort Seid
5,288 posts, read 7,594,761 times
Reputation: 2453
Quote:
Originally Posted by verybadgnome View Post
So the break even point is 129KM or about 80,000 miles. EVs should have no problem doing that since there are many 10 year old plus Priuses with their original batteries. The article did not state where the electricity was coming from either and what would happen if Nuclear or renewables were used.

And what about the other benefits such as reduced CO, SO, and particulate emissions? And the lack of motor oil in parking lots running into our streams and rivers? And please give me proof of this:

"Many electric cars are expected to need a replacement battery after a few years."

I have not heard of Teslas needing new batteries so what are they referring to?
This sounds suspiciously like that debunked "study" that showed how much more environmentally friendly the Hummer was than the Prius.

That unsurprisingly turned out to be total bunk, due to their assumption a Prius would simply be scrapped after 100K miles, while a Hummer would get 250K.

And while it is true coal has emissions issues, at least America can regulate our own coal factories - the problem with gas is it comes from crazy-unstable parts of the world like Saudi Arabia, Iraq, etc.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2011, 05:04 PM
 
5,090 posts, read 9,835,700 times
Reputation: 3955
You are both correct.

The story is a farce, with so much false assumptions and false claims it is not even worth the response.

Sort of the OP's M.O. on posting anything related to electric vehicles.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2011, 07:52 PM
 
15,924 posts, read 17,389,401 times
Reputation: 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip T View Post
Sort of the OP's M.O. on posting anything related to electric vehicles.
Sorry I post items that don't agree with the green halo that surrounds electric cars, I figured since others do nothing but praise electric cars I'd post some facts that show the downside to them.

I don't subscribe to the green bobbing heads lobby where anything that is branded "environmentally friendly" is OK.

I am certain you have gone over all the data collected in this study to determine it's a total waste

Obviously you know more than the professionals who conducted this study

Are all studies to be believed 100%? no. But to dismiss one as totally false without reviewing the data is ludicrous.

Last edited by plwhit; 06-20-2011 at 08:05 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-21-2011, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Nort Seid
5,288 posts, read 7,594,761 times
Reputation: 2453
Quote:
Originally Posted by plwhit View Post
Are all studies to be believed 100%? no. But to dismiss one as totally false without reviewing the data is ludicrous.
I tried exactly that with the Hummer/Prius one, and guess what? The company refused to publish it. Want a link for more info?

As far as the nonsense about how EVs use all this coal, you might want to get up to speed on the reality of the refinery industry:

How much electricity is used refine a gallon of Gasoline?-video added! « Gateway Electric Vehicle Club

About 4 - 7.5 kWh per gallon of Gas.

2.77 miles per kWh for an EV (based on 36kWh per 100mi) Refining a single gallon of gas could move an EV 11 miles (assuming 4 kWh and 19 miles assuming 7kWh).

This does not take into account how much energy was used to:
-Search for the Oil
-Drill for the Oil
-Transport the Oil
-Transport the Gasoline
-The engergy contained in the fuel itself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-21-2011, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Like, Everywhere
9 posts, read 16,294 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chi-town Native View Post
I tried exactly that with the Hummer/Prius one, and guess what? The company refused to publish it. Want a link for more info?

As far as the nonsense about how EVs use all this coal, you might want to get up to speed on the reality of the refinery industry:

[URL="http://gatewayev.org/how-much-electricity-is-used-refine-a-gallon-of-gasoline"]How much electricity is used refine a gallon of Gasoline?-video added! « Gateway Electric Vehicle Club[/URL]

About 4 - 7.5 kWh per gallon of Gas.

2.77 miles per kWh for an EV (based on 36kWh per 100mi) Refining a single gallon of gas could move an EV 11 miles (assuming 4 kWh and 19 miles assuming 7kWh).

This does not take into account how much energy was used to:
-Search for the Oil
-Drill for the Oil
-Transport the Oil
-Transport the Gasoline
-The engergy contained in the fuel itself.
Great post. It's amazing that people who set out to debunk the benefits of reducing our dependence on fossil fuels always neglect to consider these key factors.

Then again, it's this attitude that has likely lead to a dependence on oil all these years in the first place.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Green Living
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:03 AM.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top