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Old 10-24-2017, 07:25 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,035,829 times
Reputation: 5940

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
...something that still needs to be done ...

.
An assumption on your part without any data & analysis to support it.
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Old 10-24-2017, 09:30 AM
 
Location: NH
2,228 posts, read 2,281,639 times
Reputation: 2920
If there are facilities in place (recycle centers, transfer stations, etc..), for the specific purpose of trash disposal, that tells me that if trash is floating around anywhere other than those places, it should be cleaned up and brought to where it belongs, otherwise its called pollution. Swimming in garbage is not something I would want to do, nevermind what its doing for the habitat of all the creatures that live in it. Do we really need data and analysis when we have common sense?
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Old 10-24-2017, 11:20 AM
 
Location: British Columbia ♥ 🍁 ♥
7,098 posts, read 6,507,733 times
Reputation: 13855
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
An assumption on your part without any data & analysis to support it.

That's just your oblivious opinion, being land-locked in the middle of a barely populated nowhere the way you are and not seeing for yourself the state of the oceans. I'm not required to produce data and analysis for anyone and I'm not your google mommy. I've lived over 70 years on the islands and 700 miles of western coastline and the evidence before my eyes provides me with all the data and analysis I need to know that there's an increasingly serious problem with plastic pollution in the oceans. Humans put it there and it's humans' responsibility to remove it and put it to practical use where it can't pollute.


.
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Old 10-24-2017, 05:26 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,035,829 times
Reputation: 5940
The OP's original citation states that they're going to build barricades in the oceans to capture floating debris. Do they think they're going to get more than one bottle a week? When was the last time anyone here was in a boat on the open sea and even saw a plastic bottle floating about? And how many bottles do they need to collect just to get to the break even point on recouping the cost of building barricades?

Get real.
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Old 10-24-2017, 06:20 PM
 
Location: British Columbia ♥ 🍁 ♥
7,098 posts, read 6,507,733 times
Reputation: 13855
There's other plastic garbage besides bottles floating around out there.


https://www.bing.com/images/search?q...7D574691DB5175


The cost of collecting it is irrelevant. It has to be collected.


.
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Old 10-25-2017, 04:43 AM
 
Location: DC
6,509 posts, read 6,427,712 times
Reputation: 3112
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
The OP's original citation states that they're going to build barricades in the oceans to capture floating debris. Do they think they're going to get more than one bottle a week? When was the last time anyone here was in a boat on the open sea and even saw a plastic bottle floating about? And how many bottles do they need to collect just to get to the break even point on recouping the cost of building barricades?

Get real.
From his home in Wisconsin Guido can't see any problem with plastic trash in the ocean.
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Old 10-25-2017, 04:50 AM
 
Location: NH
2,228 posts, read 2,281,639 times
Reputation: 2920
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
The OP's original citation states that they're going to build barricades in the oceans to capture floating debris. Do they think they're going to get more than one bottle a week? When was the last time anyone here was in a boat on the open sea and even saw a plastic bottle floating about? And how many bottles do they need to collect just to get to the break even point on recouping the cost of building barricades?

Get real.
In my opinion, cost should not be an issue; if you were dying of cancer, would you refuse treatment because of cost? Its no different with pollution as its slowly killing the environment (and we are part of the environment). My son and I went deep sea fishing earlier this year and I was amazed at how many bottles and cans were floating around out there. I also went on vacation to the Dominican Republic this year and the number of bottles and trash floating around were truly horrifying. As nice as the water looked, it wasn't that relaxing to be swimming though bottles. It truly is a problem. Science is great and all but sometimes it takes the personal experience of some to get a true picture of the situation. I know you for one don't believe about the floating garbage island even though I posted a link from Wikipedia on another thread but what sort of proof do you need that pollution is a problem?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_..._garbage_patch
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Old 10-25-2017, 05:06 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,035,829 times
Reputation: 5940
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post

The cost of collecting it is irrelevant.


.
??? With that philosophy, then it's logical to start a war with N. Korea immediately. Who cares if the cost would involve the certain annihilation of 25 M people in Seoul? The outcome would justify the cost. Right?

I'm not questioning that pollution of any sort is deplorable.. I'm questioning this particular action. It's well known that floating debris (natural or man made) tends to collect in certain areas over time due to natural wind/ocean current actions. https://response.restoration.noaa.go...e-vs-myth.html

L’isola di plastica del Pacifico che potrebbe diventare uno Stato - Corriere.it

But even in these famous cases, these "islands" represent the accumulation of decades of world-wide irresponsible handling of refuse. If someone would scoop them clean, it would probably amount to no more than a few days or weeks of production from a large metropolitan area's re-cycling center. And then to get another load of plastic for their road project, it would take another set of decades to re-accumulate.

And these genii are proposing barricades (? unintended consequences) in relatively local places to collect debris. Probably little collection over time but large construction costs. Then on the back end-- how much improvement on roadway characteristic do they hope to accrue? It may not be worth the cost there either.

You gotta know when to hold 'em and know when to fold 'em. That's why lions only go after the very young or the cripples: the energy cost of chasing a healthy adult gazelle ain't worth it.

This certainly seems to be another grandstand play not well thought out merely seeking approval for their "environmental concern." Maybe they should redirect their excess capital to buying & preserving some rain forest if they're really want to help.
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Old 10-25-2017, 10:38 AM
 
Location: British Columbia ♥ 🍁 ♥
7,098 posts, read 6,507,733 times
Reputation: 13855
Sorry kiddo, the only message I'm hearing from you and your cohort is your refusal to comprehend or accept the quantity of garbage floating just beneath the surface. If you can't see it bobbing on the surface, if it isn't jumping up and smacking you in the face where you are then it can't possibly be there in the oceans and everything else is all lies, right?

And there's the excuse that if there's no profit to be made from removing plastic pollution then it's a waste of time and should be left where it is to continue accumulating. To hell with the environment and the animals that it's killing. To hell with the consequences of poisoning the oceans, and the detriment to humans and all other living things on earth.

No appreciative attaboys or kudos and slaps on the back, no benefit of the doubt to the Dutch company who are at least attempting to do something to clean up somebody else's mess at the company's own expense. Just turn a blind eye and show the Dutch discouragement, contempt, condescension and patronizing accusations of grand standing, virtue signalling and of having a guilty conscience about other careless peoples' sins.

I think excuses and accusations is what people in blinkers throw out to cover up their own guilty consciences when other people (like these Dutch) demonstrate that they're better people and more conscientious and responsible than their accusers.

Why even bother to spend time in the Green Living forum?

.
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Old 10-25-2017, 05:18 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,035,829 times
Reputation: 5940
Alright. Let's argue it this way: if it's so important and cost is no concern, why aren't you out there in a rented rowboat and net, scooping it up? Apparently it's only important enough for someone else to spend the time and money on. You have too many other obligations in your busy life.
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