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Old 08-06-2018, 03:41 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,037,800 times
Reputation: 5940

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Quote:
Originally Posted by waltcolorado View Post
Im not a climate scientist myself so I have to find a resource that appears trustworthy and am liking this one RealClimate

What sets it apart is that the information is from real climate scientist and they give their credentials Contributors « RealClimate

Check out the list of major contributors, then search "Climategate" and "hide the decline."


That roster is a rogues gallery of unethical political agents claiming to be scientists. Michael Mann's famous "hockey stick" paper was research based on one lousy tree. He actively conspired to eliminate all evidence of a Medieval Warm Period from his records and the computer program he used, finally forced by the courts to be jreleased to the public, was found to render a "hockey stick pattern" even when fed random numbers. Look it up.


ps/ I don't have time right now to view your posted videos. I will soon and critique them for you. I'm guessing they give the usual drivel without addressing two major problems in AGW theory: the concepts of extinction of absorption and any discussion of the limited absorption spectrum of co2 vs the extensive one for h2o and the dual infulence of h20 on temps.

Last edited by guidoLaMoto; 08-06-2018 at 03:57 AM..
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Old 08-06-2018, 04:05 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,769 posts, read 1,037,800 times
Reputation: 5940
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsuperfly View Post
Do you have any data/sources that aren't "some guy's wordpress blog" or sites listed as being either "heavily right-wing with questionable facts" or listed as "conspiracy-pseudoscience."

It would seem that the liberal media deems anyone with a dissenting opinion a radical or conspirator. The questionable facts are all from the people providing the facts-- see posts above about adjustments of data, Climategate, "hide the decline" etc etc.
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Old 08-06-2018, 05:01 AM
 
Location: DC
6,509 posts, read 6,430,643 times
Reputation: 3112
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
That's the big lie. I've posted the graphs around here previously. They're easy to search for yourself:


The correlation between [co2] and global temps is exactly ZERO. No correlation = no cause/effect.


One more time: [co2] levels have been rising steadily since early 19th century, but temps have been cycling up AND down during that time span. The theoretical GHG effect of co2 is overwhelmed by other factors when it comes to determining weather & climate. (Just like you can ignore aerodynamic effects when dropping a bowling ball from the leaning Tower of Pisa. They're there, but they don't make a measurable difference.)


On longer, geologic times scales, [co2] lags behind changing temps-- a warming ocean releases co2-- (careful when you open that warm bottle of beer, right?) and a cooling ocean soaks it up. The changing [co2] is the result of temp changes, not the cause.
Another excuse for the big lie. The scientific community at large in engaged in a vast conspiracy to trick us? You expect posters on here to believe that? You are a piece of work.
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:15 AM
 
8,199 posts, read 6,100,841 times
Reputation: 11730
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
Another excuse for the big lie. The scientific community at large in engaged in a vast conspiracy to trick us? You expect posters on here to believe that? You are a piece of work.
Scientists have about 125 years of real data about weather/climate out of however old the earth is (4 billion?). Everything else is conjecture or modeling. 125 years on a planet of 4 billion is no better than a single data point.

Too much of climate science is based on modeling and not empirical data collection. I have serious doubts about any"science" that has such a low amount of empirical evidence and such a strong political component.
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:25 AM
 
388 posts, read 552,774 times
Reputation: 558
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by waltcolorado View Post
Im not a climate scientist myself so I have to find a resource that appears trustworthy and am liking this one RealClimate

What sets it apart is that the information is from real climate scientist and they give their credentials Contributors « RealClimate

Check out the list of major contributors, then search "Climategate" and "hide the decline."


That roster is a rogues gallery of unethical political agents claiming to be scientists. Michael Mann's famous "hockey stick" paper was research based on one lousy tree. He actively conspired to eliminate all evidence of a Medieval Warm Period from his records and the computer program he used, finally forced by the courts to be jreleased to the public, was found to render a "hockey stick pattern" even when fed random numbers. Look it up.


ps/ I don't have time right now to view your posted videos. I will soon and critique them for you. I'm guessing they give the usual drivel without addressing two major problems in AGW theory: the concepts of extinction of absorption and any discussion of the limited absorption spectrum of co2 vs the extensive one for h2o and the dual infulence of h20 on temps.


Well.. I did check out climategate and hide from a source. Here is a summary that I trust

Fake news, hacked mail, alternative facts
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:34 AM
 
Location: DC
6,509 posts, read 6,430,643 times
Reputation: 3112
Quote:
Originally Posted by War Beagle View Post
Scientists have about 125 years of real data about weather/climate out of however old the earth is (4 billion?). Everything else is conjecture or modeling. 125 years on a planet of 4 billion is no better than a single data point.

Too much of climate science is based on modeling and not empirical data collection. I have serious doubts about any"science" that has such a low amount of empirical evidence and such a strong political component.
The industrial age is what is causing the problem and we have temperature readings for that period. What happened in the Jurassic is interesting but not very relevant to today's climate.

Contrary to your assertion, science is heavily focused on data acquisition, but the climate of the entire earth is a complicated enough phenomenon that one must use models. We have hundreds of thousands of years of proxy data that indicate global climate. Your serious doubts reflect an uninformed perspective. Some people have serious doubt that the earth is spherical.

Other people just lie. Why they lie is not clear, but there is no real doubt that man made warming is happening.
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Old 08-06-2018, 08:35 AM
 
388 posts, read 552,774 times
Reputation: 558
Quote:
extinction of absorption and any discussion of the limited absorption spectrum of co2 vs the extensive one for h2o and the dual infulence of h20 on temps.
fYI, this is discussed in those videos. The presenters credentials are below. May I ask for your credentials for giving a review please.. Otherwise, Im going with what in the video. Seems now the rebutals are along the lines of "That roster is a rogues gallery of unethical political agents claiming to be scientists" which I consider inaccurate and worthless.

Myles R. Allen is head of the Climate Dynamics group at the University of Oxford's Atmospheric, Oceanic and Planetary Physics Department.[1] He is the Principal Investigator of the distributed computing project Climateprediction.net (which makes use of computing resources provided voluntarily by the general public), and was principally responsible for starting this project.[2][3] He is Professor of Geosystem Science in the School of Geography and the Environment, and a Fellow of Linacre College, Oxford.[4
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:10 AM
 
388 posts, read 552,774 times
Reputation: 558
Just to make it easy to find this tutorial from 2018, here it is again.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=CqjbTMz5Hro



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqx99ea-DrM



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Hh8iurCvcA



https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=QFlcmsFOv6Y



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMjzpaNLQ0Y


Myles R. Allen is head of the Climate Dynamics group at the University of Oxford's Atmospheric, Oceanic and Planetary Physics Department.[1] He is the Principal Investigator of the distributed computing project Climateprediction.net (which makes use of computing resources provided voluntarily by the general public), and was principally responsible for starting this project.[2][3] He is Professor of Geosystem Science in the School of Geography and the Environment, and a Fellow of Linacre College, Oxford.[4]
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:11 AM
 
Location: Northern NJ
7,947 posts, read 7,877,938 times
Reputation: 11164
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
The industrial age is what is causing the problem and we have temperature readings for that period. What happened in the Jurassic is interesting but not very relevant to today's climate.

Contrary to your assertion, science is heavily focused on data acquisition, but the climate of the entire earth is a complicated enough phenomenon that one must use models. We have hundreds of thousands of years of proxy data that indicate global climate. Your serious doubts reflect an uninformed perspective. Some people have serious doubt that the earth is spherical.

Other people just lie. Why they lie is not clear, but there is no real doubt that man made warming is happening.

I do think the whole argument is academic and irrelevant. The fact is, we are not rolling back the industrial revolution. The fact is, we are going to INCREASE industrial revolutions in areas that have not yet benefitted from the fabulous wealth creation that industrialization enables.

This is simply going to happen. And no, we are NEVER going to stop using oil, and we are not going to carbon tax ourselves into oblivion.

So with these absolute certainties recognized, the time has come to forget about climate change from the standpoint of Man doing something about climate. It doesn't matter what's causing it, or if we think it's happening. We need to simply OBSERVE reality and ADAPT to what comes. Not what we think is coming through the use of a bad tool (modelling). What we actually see happen. So we need to actually see Manhattan get flooded lots and lots, and then we will react and move inland. We need to SEE islands flooded over and over, and then react by moving off of them to higher ground. We need to SEE much higher temperatures all the time, and then we can design buildings to overcome the heat. We need to SEE repeated and demonstrable crop failure. Then we can adapt our agriculture to the new OBSERVED, not SPECULATED, not HYPOTHESIZED, reality.


So the bottom line: No rollback, no decrease in oil use, no environmentally motivated programs to redistribute our wealth. The wealth that we EARNED and OWN.


Watchful waiting, live as we are now with full exploitation of all energy sources to further our lives to the maximum, and react when we see stuff actually happen.


Public welfare recipients talking to each other in rooms with high ceilings paid for by public grants ARE NOT REALITY. We don't to react to these silly protected pampered idle people. We need only to react to observed reality.
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Old 08-06-2018, 09:22 AM
BMI
 
Location: Ontario
7,243 posts, read 4,449,013 times
Reputation: 5578
Quote:
Originally Posted by duke944 View Post
People will be living in denial all the way till the end. "but it's just a normal weather pattern...." -croaks-
But seriously, it's not like anything can be done about the situation. People got to have their suvs and their 1st world comfort and boredom issues solved, so just enjoy the time we all have left.
Problem is other places are now getting a taste for SUV’s ....like China....
if 1.4 billion all buy automobiles ...
and other big countries like India...the World could eventially be doomed.
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