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Old 08-05-2008, 07:52 AM
 
2,775 posts, read 2,818,279 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domergurl View Post
People shellacked Al Gore over his house not being green and nit picking him, pointing out his hypocrisys, why don't they do the same to Boone Pickens??? At least Gore wasn't pitching his plan on behalf of an energy company. The whole, put our heads in the sand and not see the big picture because he's talking a good talk is what has gotten us into this mess. Sorry, but T. Boone Pickens is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Great points.

I feel like one significant difference between them is that Gore and Pickens came out with their plans and insights at completely different times.

Time is of the essence right now (rather obvious), and Pickens can take advantage of the near panic happening due to the oil/gas price increases. In contrast, when Gore first came out with all his facts and figures, a lot of what he was talking about seemed distant or irrelevant to many Americans.

Overall, I have a healthy skepticism regarding Pickens as well. I don't think his plan is a bad one. However, it has a significant flaw, as it surely doesn't address a big part of the longer-term equation of the US going green. It is just flat out inefficient to enable/facilitate/encourage every American family to have in their possession two or more cars (fuel-powered or natural gas-powered, or other-powered) when real public transportation and infrastructure solutions could instead be put into place. If suburban sprawl could be tamed and better city planning developed, we would obviously have a much more viable energy consumption solution for the larger populations of the future.
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Old 08-05-2008, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Heartland Florida
9,324 posts, read 23,750,093 times
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And I am confused by people who use initials to describe their names. Exactly what is a T. Boone, is that related to a T-bone?
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Old 08-05-2008, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Boise, ID
1,356 posts, read 5,458,198 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domergurl View Post
I'm taking a wait and see attitude with TBP. He laid low for many years. Many don't realize what a shark he is. It's kind of like in 2000 ... when the oil people took over ... not to get all conspiracy-ey. But I can guarantee you, T Boone Pickens is NOT doing this to save the planet. He works for BP ... he himself won't go green ... come on. People shellacked Al Gore over his house not being green and nit picking him, pointing out his hypocrisys, why don't they do the same to Boone Pickens??? At least Gore wasn't pitching his plan on behalf of an energy company. The whole, put our heads in the sand and not see the big picture because he's talking a good talk is what has gotten us into this mess. Sorry, but T. Boone Pickens is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Al Gore is heavily invested in solar energy and he is out talking it up all the time. Gore's motives are no more pure or greedy than Pickens'. In fact I am more wary of Gore, et. al's proposals because they invariably involve taxes and regulations. Pickens might stand to make money on this but he doesn't have the power to coerce us. The power to tax is the power to destroy.

Last edited by Niners fan; 08-05-2008 at 10:27 AM.. Reason: typo
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Old 08-05-2008, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Venice Florida
1,380 posts, read 5,230,481 times
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The issue with wind and solar is that while they both generate electricity, you can't count on either to generate power at the same time there is a demand for power. There is no technology available today that can store megawatts of power. Without storage we need "on demand" power generation. "On demand" means coal, natgas, nuke, diesel. All the bad stuff. Clean green power must be augmented with the proven technology.
Transportation using natgas is viable technology today. Domestic production of natgas has increased rapidly over the past couple of years. Natgas is a cleaner fuel than gasoline. Not a perfect solution but moving in the right direction.
Nukes have the issue of rod disposal. Most of the world have built a recycling facilities to process spent fuel rods.
Electric cars are viable transportation choices for in town but because of limited range and extended refueling (recharging) are not practical for most people. Reworking the Hybrid concept to be more of an electric car with a small natgas engine for backup makes sense to me.
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Old 08-05-2008, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Turn Left at Greenland
17,700 posts, read 35,554,434 times
Reputation: 7951
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan View Post
Al Gore is heavily invested in solar energy and he is out talking it up all the time. Gore's motives are no more pure or greedy than Pickens'. In fact I am more wary of Gore, et. al's proposals because they invariably involve taxes and regulations. Pickens might stand to make money on this but he doesn't have the power to coerce us. The power to tax is the power to destroy.
Then why doesn't Thomas Boone Pickens spend some of his ka-jillions to practice what he's preaching????
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Old 08-05-2008, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Venice Florida
1,380 posts, read 5,230,481 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domergurl View Post
Then why doesn't Thomas Boone Pickens spend some of his ka-jillions to practice what he's preaching????
TBP is spending millions of his own money. His current add campaign is self funded. He's wants us to do just what were doing here, talk about the solutions to importing trillions of dollars of oil from the middle east, Nigeria, Russia, and Venezuela. We need to move to domestic energy.
While Al Gore and TBP don't have the same plan they are having the effect of getting Americans talking about our options.
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Old 08-05-2008, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Turn Left at Greenland
17,700 posts, read 35,554,434 times
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No, you're missing my point. Why doesn't he practice what he preaches by using some of these eye-dee-ers that he's pushing in his plan??? Sheeeeooooot, any old rich cowboy that chuck money into an ad campaign!
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Old 08-05-2008, 07:24 PM
 
955 posts, read 1,952,092 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbuszu View Post
Overall, I have a healthy skepticism regarding Pickens as well. I don't think his plan is a bad one. However, it has a significant flaw, as it surely doesn't address a big part of the longer-term equation of the US going green.

It is just flat out inefficient to enable/facilitate/encourage every American family to have in their possession two or more cars (fuel-powered or natural gas-powered, or other-powered) when real public transportation and infrastructure solutions could instead be put into place.

If suburban sprawl could be tamed and better city planning developed, we would obviously have a much more viable energy consumption solution for the larger populations of the future.
I do not doubt your sincerity in your beliefs and concepts for the future. However, my problem with your thought process is twofold. First, the drilling is not a solution side always brings up the time that it would take in their opinion to get product to the marketplace. When you talk about city planning and public transportation options, you are talking in multiples of time greater than it would take to get oil to the market. What about the here and now?

And second, does it not bother you like it does me that you are comfortable in dictating where I can live (eliminate suburban sprawl, whatever that is), what I can drive (posession of two or more cars), and how I get to the market (public transportation). If that is your view of the world - fine. But why must others be forced to follow your thought process?
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Old 08-06-2008, 12:43 AM
 
2,775 posts, read 2,818,279 times
Reputation: 2979
Quote:
Originally Posted by Niners fan View Post
Al Gore is heavily invested in solar energy and he is out talking it up all the time. Gore's motives are no more pure or greedy than Pickens'. In fact I am more wary of Gore, et. al's proposals because they invariably involve taxes and regulations. Pickens might stand to make money on this but he doesn't have the power to coerce us. The power to tax is the power to destroy.
Al Gore isn't a member of Congress, he has no power to tax or regulate. His influence is exactly as Pickens except that Gore has much more credibility to his name considering he's been pro-environment for 35+ years, with 25+ of those being when he was relatively unwealthy by political standards.

Lastly, talking up solar-energy isn't a rocket-science thing to do... it's a smart thing to do (as is investing in the technology involved). Along with wind power it is the most sensible natural resource for the entire human race to develop and invest within.
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Old 08-06-2008, 10:24 AM
 
Location: Turn Left at Greenland
17,700 posts, read 35,554,434 times
Reputation: 7951
I remember back in the 70's the new fangled thing to do was to put solar panels on your house. I think that Jimmy Carter put them on the White House too ... unfortunately, people, in general, don't have the cash to put up for the expensive startups to do this to most homes. I would love to have it done, but I can't wait 5 years to have it pay off. Someone needs to make solar more economically viable if they want it to be a reality.


Yea, Gore has been a private citizen for many years now.
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