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Old 10-02-2009, 05:10 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,756,720 times
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rlc post #318 - I cannot send any reps, your post outlines the long range energy planning we need. Now how do we get our financiers and politicians behind the deal.

Nuclear plants to meet the base load, wind, hydro, solar, tidal to collect energy and coal to be reformed into synthetic gas and oil. We can meet future our needs.
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Old 10-02-2009, 07:19 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,062,788 times
Reputation: 954
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
rlc post #318 - I cannot send any reps, your post outlines the long range energy planning we need. Now how do we get our financiers and politicians behind the deal.

Nuclear plants to meet the base load, wind, hydro, solar, tidal to collect energy and coal to be reformed into synthetic gas and oil. We can meet future our needs.
The current administration has energy people who get it. Of course in 1980 we had people in government who "got it." When Reagan came in with the Republicans, all that was dismantled.

Looks who's fighting the current energy legislation. Republicans love oil and coal companies. They make BIG campaign contributions. Under Bush energy policy was crafted by Cheney and friends in secret. Elections have consequences.
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Old 10-02-2009, 07:43 AM
 
41,813 posts, read 51,023,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
Germany consumes on a per capita basis 1/4 or the liquid fuel that we do and the Germans are as car crazy as we.
Apples and oranges, the US is 25X the land area of Germany. According to Wikipedia 596 people sq. mile in Germany compared to 80 people a sq. mile in the US.

If you want to start to solve the use of fuel in this country you need to first get all the long haul cross country freight off the roads onto trains. That will actually kill many birds with one stone because the highways will last much longer. Less petroleum product need to replace them, more funding to fix existing roads from the existing taxes, less fuel moving the freight, less congested highways, less new roads needed.... etc.
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Old 10-02-2009, 07:57 AM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,292 posts, read 26,664,764 times
Reputation: 3925
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
The current administration has energy people who get it. Of course in 1980 we had people in government who "got it." When Reagan came in with the Republicans, all that was dismantled.

Looks who's fighting the current energy legislation. Republicans love oil and coal companies. They make BIG campaign contributions. Under Bush energy policy was crafted by Cheney and friends in secret. Elections have consequences.
That's not necessarily true. Republicans and Democrats are just flip sides of the same coin.
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Old 10-02-2009, 08:12 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,062,788 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
That's not necessarily true. Republicans and Democrats are just flip sides of the same coin.
One side of the coin is king coal and big oil with the other side is conservation, environmentalism, green jobs, and renewable energy.
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Old 10-02-2009, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,062,788 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
Apples and oranges, the US is 25X the land area of Germany. According to Wikipedia 596 people sq. mile in Germany compared to 80 people a sq. mile in the US.

If you want to start to solve the use of fuel in this country you need to first get all the long haul cross country freight off the roads onto trains. That will actually kill many birds with one stone because the highways will last much longer. Less petroleum product need to replace them, more funding to fix existing roads from the existing taxes, less fuel moving the freight, less congested highways, less new roads needed.... etc.
When trying to present an analytical argument one needs to avoid simplistic comparisons because you get silly answers. The United States has large tracks of territory where few people live. The population is not homogeneously spread out across the country. It is clustered around urban centers. It's the urban areas that consume resources like gasoline and the United States is more urbanized than Germany.
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Old 10-02-2009, 09:07 AM
 
41,813 posts, read 51,023,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
When trying to present an analytical argument one needs to avoid simplistic comparisons because you get silly answers. The United States has large tracks of territory where few people live. The population is not homogeneously spread out across the country. It is clustered around urban centers. It's the urban areas that consume resources like gasoline and the United States is more urbanized than Germany.
You should try getting out of the office some time, you might be surprised what you find. Certainly there is some very large areas out West that are very unpopulated but try this. Type in Tunkhannock Pennsylvania on Google maps, keep moving north up 29 and find me a place where you don't find a house within .2 mile of another. You could proabaly not find that until you get into upstate NY somewhere. Most of Pennsylvania is like that except out in the Northwestern section around the Allegheny National forest.
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Old 10-02-2009, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,922 posts, read 8,062,788 times
Reputation: 954
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
You should try getting out of the office some time, you might be surprised what you find. Certainly there is some very large areas out West that are very unpopulated but try this. Type in Tunkhannock Pennsylvania on Google maps, keep moving north up 29 and find me a place where you don't find a house within .2 mile of another. You could proabaly not find that until you get into upstate NY somewhere. Most of Pennsylvania is like that except out in the Northwestern section around the Allegheny National forest.
I'm sure I've seen much more of the United States than you have. And I've also seen Germany. Germany is more rural than the United States. Americans live in cities. The space between the cities has few people.
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Old 10-02-2009, 09:48 AM
 
41,813 posts, read 51,023,289 times
Reputation: 17864
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
I'm sure I've seen much more of the United States than you have. And I've also seen Germany. Germany is more rural than the
Well we could certainly compare notes. I was probably in half the US states by the time I was 13 or so. Between the ages of 20 and 25 I traveled extensively around the country doing multiple cross country trips. I was in every state except about 8 in the Northwest. We did a 2600 mile ride from Phoenix >> Show Low>> Petrified Forest >> Corner in Winslow Arizona >> Canyon De Chelly >> North rim of the GC >> Las Vegas >> Death Valley >> Yosemite >> Pacific Coat Highway and then back to Phoenix from just above LA where about 400 miles was interstate... so yes I've been around.

Been quite fortunate, we had friend that moved to Phoenix and my cousin would go out there every fall. I'd drive out with him then hop a plane home. Fly back out in the spring for the ride home, we'd take a different way each time and try and avoid the interstate.

I almost made it to Germany, I took German in HS and they had trip planned but there was bunch of hijackings and they canceled it.
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Old 10-02-2009, 02:09 PM
 
19 posts, read 60,107 times
Reputation: 18
Based on evolutionary theory, only the birds who can avoid these windmills will reproduce. Bird problem solved. Based on market theory, if the windmills aren't making any money, then windmill owners will stop building them. If they are making money, then that means that they are working, and we'll have more windmills.
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