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Old 11-15-2009, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Brusssels
1,933 posts, read 3,408,912 times
Reputation: 1895

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
It's simple.

1. You don't know what you're talking about. This sentence proves that.
2. You think you're better than people who aren't vegan.


That pretty much sums it up.
Wow, the "I'm right and you're wrong" method. And here I thought people stopped using that after 5th grade.


Looks like you've been watching too much Glenn Beck these days...just don't start crrying, OK?
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,379 posts, read 37,662,325 times
Reputation: 22500
Omaha Rocks, elsewhere it was stated that that was a slaughterhouse for veal.

Xpat, the "I'm right and you're wrong" technique is one that is routinely used by the kind of vegetarians/vegans (fortunately a small, if very loud, part of the group vegetarians/vegans as a whole) who think that if everyone else doesn't come to the same conclusion they do, well, that's just WRONG and everyone must be enlightened and forced to come to the same conclusions. (Part and parcel, feeling threatened if not everyone thinks the same thing that you do - likewise childish.)
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:41 AM
 
Location: Brusssels
1,933 posts, read 3,408,912 times
Reputation: 1895
Take this quote and apply it to women's right to vote, slavery, the right to bear arms, equal opportunity, child labor laws, environmental protection, etc. All of these issues went through these stages of resistance described below. The end result is the America we have today with the freedoms many on this board are enjoying.

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."
--Arthur Schopenhauer

Now take this quote below and apply it to those same things. You'd have an America where only men can vote, where 12 year olds still work in factories and don't go to school, no National parks and industrial chemicals dumped just anywhere, open discrimination against minorities (if not having them still in chains), and no Constitutional right to bear arms (an extremely radical idea for its time), etc.


"All BS passes through three stages. First it is accepted, Second it is dissected and examined by reasonable thinkers. Third it is dismissed as bull doodoo"
-- Rickers

I know which place I'd rather live in.
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Old 11-15-2009, 07:45 AM
 
Location: Brusssels
1,933 posts, read 3,408,912 times
Reputation: 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
Omaha Rocks, elsewhere it was stated that that was a slaughterhouse for veal.

Xpat, the "I'm right and you're wrong" technique is one that is routinely used by the kind of vegetarians/vegans (fortunately a small, if very loud, part of the group vegetarians/vegans as a whole) who think that if everyone else doesn't come to the same conclusion they do, well, that's just WRONG and everyone must be enlightened and forced to come to the same conclusions. (Part and parcel, feeling threatened if not everyone thinks the same thing that you do - likewise childish.)

Others may use it but I haven't used it here.

Part of being able to have an adult conversation is to address the ideas put across by the other person, not just reaching out for what others have said and trying to clamp it onto that person's argument so you can claim its what they've said. Just twisting someone's words and throwing in a little extra does give you a cogent argument. Its the method of the intellectually lazy.
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Old 11-15-2009, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,379 posts, read 37,662,325 times
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Xpat, I stated earlier, forgive me if I don't consider Schopenhauer as someone to be emulated or taken as an authority on such things as how life should be lived. I'd consider him the exact opposite, in fact.

By the way, if you go by him, you'd also have a country where only men can vote. To quote, from his essay, "On Women":

"One need only look at a woman’s shape to discover that she is not intended for either too much mental or too much physical work. She pays the debt of life not by what she does but by what she suffers—by the pains of child-bearing, care for the child, and by subjection to man, to whom she should be a patient and cheerful companion."

"Women are directly adapted to act as the nurses and educators of our early childhood, for the simple reason that they themselves are childish, foolish, and short-sighted—in a word, are big children all their lives, something intermediate between the child and the man, who is a man in the strict sense of the word."
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Old 11-15-2009, 09:30 PM
 
Location: Brusssels
1,933 posts, read 3,408,912 times
Reputation: 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
Xpat, I stated earlier, forgive me if I don't consider Schopenhauer as someone to be emulated or taken as an authority on such things as how life should be lived. I'd consider him the exact opposite, in fact.

By the way, if you go by him, you'd also have a country where only men can vote. To quote, from his essay, "On Women":

"One need only look at a woman’s shape to discover that she is not intended for either too much mental or too much physical work. She pays the debt of life not by what she does but by what she suffers—by the pains of child-bearing, care for the child, and by subjection to man, to whom she should be a patient and cheerful companion."

"Women are directly adapted to act as the nurses and educators of our early childhood, for the simple reason that they themselves are childish, foolish, and short-sighted—in a word, are big children all their lives, something intermediate between the child and the man, who is a man in the strict sense of the word."

Once again, you are ignoring the merits of what is said in the quote I provided and now fixating on other things he has said/written...while not addressing the quote itself. Once again, part of being able to have an adult conversation is to address the ideas put across by the other person.

If you deep down disagree with Schopenhauer's idea that:

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

...then make a cogent argument which contends this concept is not valid. Attacking the person who said it indicates you are unable to address the idea itself.

BTW, here are few more ideas and beliefs which were ridiculed and violently opposed before they were widely accepted:

Christianity
The idea that the earth is round (and not flat)
The idea that the earth revolves around the sun
Freeing slaves
Ending the Vietnam War
De-segregation
Declaring independence from England
The laws of physics

Vegetarians and vegans are less than 5% of the population which leaves me puzzled why you feel so threatened...
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Old 11-15-2009, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,379 posts, read 37,662,325 times
Reputation: 22500
Okay, I'll play. The quote itself is simplistic (as are his views on women in the quotes I provided as an example of the way the authority you quoted thinks) and paints with a broad brush. MANY ideas are ridiculed, some are violently opposed, few are accepted as being self-evident.

You can't state that something is Truth with a Capitol T based on the fact that many people disagree with it (or even that they ridicule it). It doesn't follow.

And I'm not threatened by vegans or vegetarians at all. Merely curious as to why they (some of them, not all, simply the ones who feel compelled to try to get the rest of the world to agree with them that Meat Is Evil and Vegetarianism Is The Only Way) feel so threatened by the idea that many people do not agree with their point of view, while being perfectly happy to allow them to eat whatever they want (more for us!). It's an interesting point of human nature, that's all.
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Old 11-16-2009, 06:40 AM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,084,810 times
Reputation: 3888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xpat View Post
Wow, the "I'm right and you're wrong" method. And here I thought people stopped using that after 5th grade.


Looks like you've been watching too much Glenn Beck these days...just don't start crrying, OK?
I never watch Glen Beck, but your allusion to it evidences that you have absolutely nothing of substance to say, and are not just taking silly little pot shots.

Avoidance noted...
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Old 11-16-2009, 06:43 AM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,293 posts, read 23,084,810 times
Reputation: 3888
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
Okay, I'll play. The quote itself is simplistic (as are his views on women in the quotes I provided as an example of the way the authority you quoted thinks) and paints with a broad brush. MANY ideas are ridiculed, some are violently opposed, few are accepted as being self-evident.

You can't state that something is Truth with a Capitol T based on the fact that many people disagree with it (or even that they ridicule it). It doesn't follow.

And I'm not threatened by vegans or vegetarians at all. Merely curious as to why they (some of them, not all, simply the ones who feel compelled to try to get the rest of the world to agree with them that Meat Is Evil and Vegetarianism Is The Only Way) feel so threatened by the idea that many people do not agree with their point of view, while being perfectly happy to allow them to eat whatever they want (more for us!). It's an interesting point of human nature, that's all.
Zealots of all religious persuasions - including atheism, vegans, etc. - are never content to "live and let live." They are always trying to force others to accept their religion as the only way to live.
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Old 11-16-2009, 06:49 AM
 
9,807 posts, read 13,396,028 times
Reputation: 8158
Schapenhauer says---" All truth passes through three stages. First,it is ridiculed,
. Second,it is violently opposed. Third it is accepted as being self-evident "

I'll agree with Adolf Hitler's quote instead----" If you repeat a lie often enough, people will accept it as truth "
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