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Old 08-28-2016, 01:26 PM
 
5,525 posts, read 1,947,601 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redraven View Post
1. I don't remember ever having any "glory days". I'm not even sure how to define the term.
2. My maternal grandparents had 9 children.They are all dead now. Grandparents, aunts, uncles, mother, many cousins, all dead. Add to that step-grandparents, stepfather, and many of the people I went to school with, and some time in Vietnam in 1966, and, yes, I CERTAINLY HAVE dealt with death!

I will soon achieve my 75th birthday. I have seen a lot of death in those years, both much-loved people and greatly loved pets.
I learned long ago to NOT dwell on those deaths, to get over the grief and get on with life.

bluemonday, to state my opinion of you and your quoted post would quite likely violate the C-D TOS, so I will make no further comment

Redraven, I understand about seeing so much death. My grandparents are all gone, my parents, stepdad as well as biological father, inlaws, all my aunts and uncles, dear friends. I'm 60. And I agree with you, about learning to move on. I'm sorry for all the losses you have suffered as well.
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Old 08-28-2016, 01:29 PM
 
5,525 posts, read 1,947,601 times
Reputation: 4000
Quote:
Originally Posted by melovescookies View Post
Years ago after I had a miscarriage a co-worker actually said those stupid words to me “God needed another angel" and I remember being really insulted by her comment. I don't think I said anything back to her because I know she was trying to be comforting but it's still a dumb thing to say to someone that just lost their baby. So God gave me this baby that I loved just so he could take him away from me for his own purpose? That's not very nice.

This would be the first of many “tests" that God apparently had in store for me. He thought I handed the loss of my baby so well he took two more to shake me up. Then he was kind enough to give me a healthy baby but he wasn't through with his “tests" so he took my husband just to see what I was made of.

Either God has a sick sense of humor or nothing happens for a reason. I have to believe that random horrible things happen to good people or this invisible all powerful being hates me and takes pleasure in my misery.

I haven't believed in a personal god in many years. It has served me well, as I no longer blame him/her when bad things happen. Otherwise, if there was a personal God, what a horrible being to let his loved ones suffer.
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Old 08-28-2016, 01:40 PM
 
Location: Mt Shasta , Ca.
1,806 posts, read 1,243,339 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melovescookies View Post
Years ago after I had a miscarriage a co-worker actually said those stupid words to me “God needed another angel" and I remember being really insulted by her comment. I don't think I said anything back to her because I know she was trying to be comforting but it's still a dumb thing to say to someone that just lost their baby. So God gave me this baby that I loved just so he could take him away from me for his own purpose? That's not very nice.

This would be the first of many “tests" that God apparently had in store for me. He thought I handed the loss of my baby so well he took two more to shake me up. Then he was kind enough to give me a healthy baby but he wasn't through with his “tests" so he took my husband just to see what I was made of.

Either God has a sick sense of humor or nothing happens for a reason. I have to believe that random horrible things happen to good people or this invisible all powerful being hates me and takes pleasure in my misery.
I feel the exact same way as you . Just exactly . I am sorry for your loss because it never goes away . 5 years ago I suffered the same thing in my 2nd trimester at age 49 after years of trying for one more we gave up and finally that was the result , my body shut down and it was over . It IS awful . I know I was 49, but still hurts like h*** and you never get over it you just try as best as you can to learn to live with it . Some people don't or CAN'T the loss is so great .Whatever it is... and those prayer chains on FB OMG PLEASE.

In my case people actually said YOU'RE SO OLD and You KNOW there was something wrong with IT .

I once told my counselor if this is how God is I wish he would leave me ALONE. I need a rest .
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Old 08-28-2016, 01:42 PM
 
3,962 posts, read 5,248,587 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trobesmom View Post
I haven't believed in a personal god in many years. It has served me well, as I no longer blame him/her when bad things happen. Otherwise, if there was a personal God, what a horrible being to let his loved ones suffer.
Believing in a personal god does not mean that you have to blame him for the bad things that happen. In fact, I had no anger at all at God when the worst thing in my life happened. We are given freedom, which comes with both positives and negatives. If God stepped in and prevented every bad thing, where would our choices in life be? Where would joy and creativity be if everything was controlled?
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Old 08-28-2016, 05:40 PM
 
16,785 posts, read 19,633,393 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redraven View Post
Let's turn that around: Who are YOU, to tell ME (or anybody else) how to grieve?
Personally, I have always been able to put the grief behind me and get on with living!
IF one is able to do that, I highly recommend it.
Of course, many people find that they can not do that.
I find that I am unable to help them cope.
If that makes me "insensitive", so be it. I am not, and do not pretend to be, a grief counselor!
To paraphrase a well known cartoon character, "I am what I am, and that is all that I am!"
If me being me offends you, that is YOUR problem, not mine!
Oh I don't think anyone would ever accuse you of being sensitive and kind.

Why I would like to see them try.
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Old 08-29-2016, 06:36 AM
 
3,070 posts, read 1,625,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G Grasshopper View Post
Believing in a personal god does not mean that you have to blame him for the bad things that happen. In fact, I had no anger at all at God when the worst thing in my life happened. We are given freedom, which comes with both positives and negatives. If God stepped in and prevented every bad thing, where would our choices in life be? Where would joy and creativity be if everything was controlled?
Where would joy and creativity be if there was no meaningless suffering? Are you kidding?

We aren't GIVEN freedom, freedom is our natural state, just like it is for everything else in nature.

Having your children miscarried or young people put through horrible fatal diseases is hardly a trade-off for this 'freedom' and 'joy'. Innocent people suffer on a daily basis through no fault or choice of ANY corporeal being, not to counterbalance 'joy and creativity'.

Only a fool or a masochist believes that we must suffer to be happy. That's like saying we must be destitute to appreciate enough money to pay the bills, or have spent time starving to appreciate having food.

It's not a sin to live a good life filled with happiness.
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Old 08-29-2016, 07:25 AM
 
Location: PA
839 posts, read 958,108 times
Reputation: 1753
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redraven View Post
Let's turn that around: Who are YOU, to tell ME (or anybody else) how to grieve?
Personally, I have always been able to put the grief behind me and get on with living!
IF one is able to do that, I highly recommend it.
Of course, many people find that they can not do that.
I find that I am unable to help them cope.
If that makes me "insensitive", so be it. I am not, and do not pretend to be, a grief counselor!
To paraphrase a well known cartoon character, "I am what I am, and that is all that I am!"
If me being me offends you, that is YOUR problem, not mine!
I suspect your loved ones will be able to put the grief behind them VERY VERY QUICKLY when you die...
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Old 08-29-2016, 11:28 AM
 
3,962 posts, read 5,248,587 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rugrats2001 View Post
Where would joy and creativity be if there was no meaningless suffering? Are you kidding?

We aren't GIVEN freedom, freedom is our natural state, just like it is for everything else in nature.

Having your children miscarried or young people put through horrible fatal diseases is hardly a trade-off for this 'freedom' and 'joy'. Innocent people suffer on a daily basis through no fault or choice of ANY corporeal being, not to counterbalance 'joy and creativity'.

Only a fool or a masochist believes that we must suffer to be happy. That's like saying we must be destitute to appreciate enough money to pay the bills, or have spent time starving to appreciate having food.

It's not a sin to live a good life filled with happiness.
You missed my meaning entirely, (I don't think we have to suffer to be happy) or perhaps I didn't explain it well. But I don't think I really can in this context, so I'm going to stop at this point. I don't think I'm up for having religious and philosophical debates on CD. Sharing is one thing, debating is another.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,448 posts, read 17,629,902 times
Reputation: 39933
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
I suspect your loved ones will be able to put the grief behind them VERY VERY QUICKLY when you die...


What a horrid thing to say.

I don't know the history of that poster, but no matter how bad, you are down there in the mud with him.


What this thread should have shown is that there is no RIGHT thing to say, and everyone is different. What's the point of getting upset at someone trying to offer comfort even if it's not the way you would want it?
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:44 PM
 
472 posts, read 175,780 times
Reputation: 1537
I have to agree that many of the platitudes discussed here are annoying and can be hurtful. I try to recognize most people can't stand to see others hurt and are just trying to help.

One thing that really peeves me is the blame game.

My young niece (in her 20's and a mother to a 3 year old) was recently diagnosed with Stage 3 Melanoma. I cannot begin to tell you how many people asked me "was she in the sun a lot?" (no) "did she use tanning beds?" (no) "did she ......? etc" It is so hurtful. It implies her behavior caused it. Well, it didn't. And even if it did .... sometimes the consequences of our actions are far greater than we deserve.

I keep thinking about how, 6 months prior to her diagnosis, I insisted she get the mole on her back checked. It looked bad. She refused because she had no insurance at the time. I offered to pay the bill. I offered to drive her to my doctor to have it checked. She didn't want to. I let it go because she is an adult and she tends to pull back if you mother her.

I was a teenager when she was born. My sister was finishing college and I babysat often. I would take my niece to the beach, the pool, or the park. I wonder if constantly slathering her in sunscreen could be a cause. It's full of chemicals. It's interesting to note a large increase in incidence of Melanoma in the 20-29 age range.

If everything happens for a reason, I sure don't know the reason for her Melanoma or the trauma she has faced with surgeries and treatments.

My sister vents to me all the time. I feel like all I can do is listen and support her.

Thanks for allowing me to vent.
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