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Old 11-30-2011, 11:57 AM
 
Location: Texas
5,586 posts, read 11,831,318 times
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Quote:
Like this?
Classic! Absolutely classic!
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Minnysoda
8,014 posts, read 8,078,833 times
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Not me....I shoot lots of steel case wolf 223 even in my DPMS AR's without trouble as long as they are kept clean and my 223 Ak chews through it like crap through a goose even dirty......That stuff is still cheap and if you can pick it up you avoid the shipping costs...
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Old 11-30-2011, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,701,155 times
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It's true that reloaders spend more money on shooting than non-reloaders, but they do get a better price per round, and, you can load specific loads that are not commercially produced, sometimes you can develop a load that shoots better in your own rifle than any specific factory load (although sometimes you can't beat the factory match stuff - and if you do, not likely you will beat it by much...).

The advantage of reloading is that you can load exactly what you want, the same way you can cook what you want if you know what you are doing.

Back in the day, you could only get premium bullets like Noslers for hunting big game by handloading, and back then it was not all that tough to beat factory load accuracy either. The manufacturers have upped their game considerably and particularly in popular calibers you can buy ammo that is very much "good enough" over the counter.

But reloading, you re-use the brass case a few to several times, and it's the most expensive part of a centerfire round, so you save some money. You also take on the liability of assembling the load wrong and blowing up your gun and maybe injuring yourself badly, part of what you are paying for in factory ammo is liability insurance, and the factory boys' expertise, QA/QC, etc. which is pretty impressive know-how for a relatively small price.

I have to agree that the "speed demon" on that Dillon is nuts, on several levels. I have a Dillon and use it to make up good ammo in quantity - and there are no well-researched studies that indicate to me you can't make as accurate ammo on a Dillon as a single-station press - but I am just not interested in going that fast, you can't check your work. I would almost bet he has at least one round with no powder in it.
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Old 11-30-2011, 05:08 PM
 
Location: NC, USA
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I do reload slowly, but...I hand weigh each and every powder charge. I do not have fliers, my thing is accuracy and consistency.
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Old 11-30-2011, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,701,155 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dusty Rhodes View Post
I do reload slowly, but...I hand weigh each and every powder charge. I do not have fliers, my thing is accuracy and consistency.
Depending on the powder you are using, a powder measure may very well give you equal accuracy - if you are using one of the "big log" IMR powders, individually weighed charges may help - but most bench rest shooters who load at the range use a measure.

Ever try a Belding and Mull? I that's the one with the secondary chamber that shuttles back and forth and drop into an adjustable, removable tube. Antique looking things but I have several of them. Do a Google search for images of Belding and Mull and you will see what I am talking about. I am not certain if they are still in production, they were say 10 years ago. No matter, you can find them used at a gun show. These work VERY well with IMR type powders.

The measure that comes with a Dillon is not half bad. Works a bit better with a ball powder, or "small log" IMRs like 4895.

Don't take my word for it, load up 5 rounds with a specific charge of powder that works well for you, and 5 more with a half-grain or even full grain less powder, and see if they don't shoot to the same point of impact.

In my experience weighing and sorting the brass (for uniform internal volume) is more worthwhile than weighing each powder charge.

If you put a set of premium dies in a Dillon, and work the powder measure consistently, it may not be capable of loading ammo that will win a bench rest championship, but it will load ammo that's as good or better than commercial match ammo, more than good enough for varmint shooting or military-style rifle match shooting.
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Old 11-30-2011, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,586 posts, read 11,831,318 times
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Just to make this a little interesting M3 Mitch, I don't load using a scale as such. Many years back we had a smith in town by the name of Klein. Mr Klein had a target behind the counter that was signed by 3 witnesses to the group which appeared to be a 5 shot, one hole group.....at 1000 yds. Yeah, sounds impossible but I learned a lot from that ol' man. Scales can actually vary according to the actual powder weight due to humidity and the barometric pressure. Nope, it isn't much but if you've ever shot benchrest- the name of the game is the same. And a scale measured load is not going to be the same. I had a stem made for my RCBS powder measure that is calibrated. I use the measure to throw the powder into the scale when developing loads. Once I've found the right node, I use that measure calibration as the volume will not change. Considering everything is in the house, it's not subject to a lot of temperature changes and it's worked great for decades now. I've shot against and won against Roy Weatherbys Camp Perry team and I've got one of the recorded one hole groups from the Houston Warehouse. I used the same method of powder charging in all of the TNT BR rifles over the years too. Yet another shooter from yesterday years that used volume was Bob Pease. I still have and shoot occasionally the Remington 40X 30/338mag he built for me. There are quite a few of the long range guys that are now volume loaders.
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Old 12-01-2011, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Heading to the NW, 4 sure.
4,470 posts, read 6,612,560 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
^^^^Yeah, I'd say interesting too. Not once did that moron check to see if the powder actually fell in the case. And then folks wonder why they have bullets lodged in the barrels or worse, blow one up from these "quick" reloading presses. They can be safe to use, but this clown doesn't have a clue.

I reload everything except rimfire. If you are looking for cheap, keep looking as reloading isn't it. Once you factor in the press, dies, calipers, trimmer, deburring tools, shell holders, tumbler, media, lubes, bench, powders, bullets, brass, and all the other crapola, it's not saving you anything. But if you like shooting the most accurate ammo possible in your gun, reloading is the best way to do that, especially if you get into wildcat cartridges. It opens up a variety of bullets that you can't get with factory ammo. In some cases, you can exceed the velocity of factory ammo but the primary reason for reloading is for accuracy, not cost savings because it just isn't there. While I probably have more equipment than most and certainly more than you would need to start, I'm sitting on over 10 grand worth of equipment, not counting any loaded ammo. But there's not much I can't do with reloading including forming cases. It can be interesting hobby but it's far from a money saver.

In regards to the bullet weights, unless you know the twist rate of the Bushy, it may not stabilize anything heavier than a 55gr. If it's a 1:9" twist of tighter, yer good to go on those. I'd suggest the 62gr pills. If you do get into reloading a near max load of Varget under a 62gr yields near one hole groups at 100 yds from my AR platforms. If you can get yer hands on some of the Lake City 62gr FMJ at a cheap price, they don't know it but they shoot with match bullets all day.
Thanks for the info:

I have reloaded for over , well a long time...I used to have a Hollywood turret press and it went the way of the X..
I now have RCBS and load for :
.257 roberts
.270
.44-40
.375 winc
.45 LC
30-30
and will add the .223

I like the slow, weight each rd, clean/inspect etc.
Will check the twist and have had some good placement w/remington factory 55gr, but like the idea of the 62 gr.
Thanks again, will keep u posted..
HW need to get busy as the dogs are thick as fleas out here.
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Old 12-04-2011, 10:31 PM
 
Location: Way on the outskirts of LA LA land.
3,040 posts, read 10,215,978 times
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There have been a lot of good points made by all here about the recklessness of speedloading as shown in the example video.

If I were to speedload as in the example posted (which I don't do, though), I would check a few to be sure the powder dropped in them, then be sure to weigh each round after loading to ensure they were all uniform.
Unfortunately, there is no indication that the person in the video checked the powder or weighed the finished rounds, though they may have.

Dillon also makes a powder alarm that will sound if a round has too little or too much powder, but it has to go into one of the stations on the press, providing one fewer station available for other purposes, such as crimping. On an RL-550B, this would be an issue for most handgun ammo, but it is generally less of an issue for most rifle ammo, since the bullet seating die also crimps the case.

I couldn't see if the powder checker was used in this example, but I don't believe it was.
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Old 12-08-2011, 04:24 PM
 
Location: The Shire !
369 posts, read 824,569 times
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Well since no one addressed the costs I'll offer my observation.
I have about 5,000 .223 casings, roughly half of which are once fired my myself and the rest are assorted range brass since I pick up after other folks who can't be bothered to clean up after themselves. So arguably I have 5,000 "free" cases.

If I search around a bit I can find 55gr fmj .223 for $350 / 1000 with free shipping, so each round works out to about .35 cents.

Buying components is akin to buying hot dogs and buns, there's always not enough of one and too much of another. I'm going to leave shipping out of the equation as costs vary.

Comparison: 5,000 rounds factory .223@ .35ea=$1750.00

2 -8 lb jugs of Varget powder = $300.
5,000 CCI small rifle primers = $150.
6,000 Hornandy 55gr FMJ boolets = 539.00
Average cost of reloading 5000 rounds = $989 or .20 cents each.

Savings equals $761.00

You don't have to order components for 5,000 rounds at once, I process small batches.
Amounts are for illustration only, cost will vary.
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Old 12-09-2011, 07:37 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,586 posts, read 11,831,318 times
Reputation: 10545
Quote:
Savings equals $761.00
And some one might assume that all you have to do is buy this stuff, throw it in a closet and Viola!, you have ammo. It's not that simple as I know you are aware. The costs of a press, dies, calipers, trimmers, deburring tools, priming tools, powder measure, scale, funnels, lubes, etc are not in your figures. Some are items that are used up, some you can use many times but you still have to spend the money on these items BEFORE any of the other items can be used to make ammo. It still goes back to, if you are reloading to save money, you're only fooling yerself. You reload to tailor a load to each individual weapon for a particular need. What I load for a 308 may vary a lot. I can load heavier hunting bullets for large game animals or I can load bullets designed for small game like varmints. I can load a 3006 up to military specs or I can load down enough that a child can shoot one, like I do for the Boy Scouts who enjoy shooting 03A3's. It's about being able to load what works best for the conditions, not saving any money. And if you do reload, probabilities are real high yer shooting more. So there is no money saved.....but don't tell the other half that.
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