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Old 06-06-2012, 09:35 PM
 
Location: Beautiful place in Virginia
2,658 posts, read 10,445,187 times
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I tend to see this question raised quite a bit. I have shot many calibers of many firearms. I don't tend to be recoil sensitive, though there is discomfort depending upon the style/design of a grip. For me, wider grips dissipate the recoil to a significant degree. Empty gun weight is a good guide to determine what works best for a particular caliber.

For me, the Glock has minimal recoil in my chosen models, the 40 cal G23 Compact and G27 Subcompact and my 45 ACP G30 compact and G36 single stack subcompact. They tend to have less snap than my conventional 1911.

The heavier the gun, the less recoil, to a degree, in my personal experience. For me, a 17 ounce snubby works for 38+P for me. A 24 oz 357 snubby, does too. A 13 oz Snubby (i.e. my Ruger LCR 38) is a bit too light for 38+P to be pleasant but I still shoot it with 100 rounds per outing; it's outright painful.

The Sig P238 is easily manageable with standard 380 loads but gets a little snappier with +P. follow up shots can be a fraction slower due to a little bit more muzzle flip.

My Colt Python, Pro Series 627, Coonan 357 Magnum 1911, and GP100 are tanks. They weigh 40+ oz and 357 magnum is no issue.

Anyways, I tend to see some people concerned about recoil. There are certainly viable points. However, bear in mind, many have aftermarket sights that minimize or reduce recoil, such as Hogue Rugger grips or Hogue wood grips with finger grooves. If you're shooting a Magnum, it's best to have a thick and wider grip to dissipate force. A narrower grip, like a Ruger LCP or a two finger wood grip like my performance center 627 are too small to be comfortable shooting.

Aftermarket parts are always available to reduce perceived recoil.

Why do you think the question of recoil in a particular gun is so common? Is it the experience level of the shooter? Was there a bad prior experience? Do you have room in your technique to mitigate some or most of the recoil?
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:48 PM
 
Location: Visitation between Wal-Mart & Home Depot
8,309 posts, read 34,233,349 times
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Here...


Girl Snaps Wrist Shooting Huge Pistol - YouTube
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:50 PM
 
Location: SWUS
5,421 posts, read 7,852,670 times
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People generally dislike recoil, and flinching because one is expecting recoil makes people worse shooters by jerking right or left. Right?

I don't think that just grips reduce recoil. I think it has more to do with the weight of the gun, the cartridge being fired (There's a big difference between subsonic, standard, +P, and +P+), barrel length, and most importantly, the WAY the gun is being gripped. A poor grip is not only bad for accuracy, felt recoil may be greater AND it could also cause certain failures to happen in semi-autos (which would otherwise RARELY happen, which is why I generally dislike revolver vs. semi questions.)
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Old 06-07-2012, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Beautiful place in Virginia
2,658 posts, read 10,445,187 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanJP View Post
People generally dislike recoil, and flinching because one is expecting recoil makes people worse shooters by jerking right or left. Right?

I don't think that just grips reduce recoil. I think it has more to do with the weight of the gun, the cartridge being fired (There's a big difference between subsonic, standard, +P, and +P+), barrel length, and most importantly, the WAY the gun is being gripped. A poor grip is not only bad for accuracy, felt recoil may be greater AND it could also cause certain failures to happen in semi-autos (which would otherwise RARELY happen, which is why I generally dislike revolver vs. semi questions.)
True. Definitely a combination of factors.

I was watching a young college student shooting and the gun was going all over the place. I showed him how to grip and stand, and he had more control. I don't recall the caliber that he shot. It may have only been a 9mm.

I was referring to perceived recoil. Thinner grips (less wide) dissipate recoil. However, barrel length, weight of gun and loads are all intertwined. Absolutely. Thanks.
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Old 06-07-2012, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Texas
5,619 posts, read 12,862,125 times
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Recoil is probably the most misunderstood thing in shooting. Ever wonder how that little bullet can produce so much recoil energy? Well, it doesn't. The largest percentage of recoil is generated not by the forward acceleration of the bullet, action yields reaction, but from the jetting of the exhaust gases. Think of the barrel as the exhaust end of a rocket engine and you just got the idea correctly. Hornadys new Performance ammo that is reduced recoil yet yields more velocity even over normal max loads is a prime example of the jetting action. They use a custom tailored powder that spikes pressures quickly, holds it for the nanosecond necessary, and then drops like a rock before the bullet exits the barrel. With a revolver you have 2 areas of recoil generated. One at the barrel and one at the forcing cone. With a semiauto you also have 2 areas of recoil. There's the barrel and then you have the recoil of the fast moving slide.
If you've never read Hatchers Notebook, you need to. I'm not necessarily a total fan of his as he is the poster boy for plagiarism. Most of his writings are findings of others but he takes credit for it. Here's a linky to the book but generally these links don't last long. This is a large book, over 600 pages and storing this online is a costly project. Some where in this book he addresses recoil and gives a full explanation. You needed something to do this week anyway. Enjoy.
hatchers notebook
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:53 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,143 posts, read 19,100,631 times
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flinching is the problem with accuracy, not necessarily recoil. More recoil tends to equal more flinch.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:25 PM
 
12,094 posts, read 18,272,000 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chango View Post
flinching is the problem with accuracy, not necessarily recoil. More recoil tends to equal more flinch.
Yes true. Recoil does not effect accuracy really, but the problem with most people is they try to anticipate the recoil and thus flinch, subconsciously, when pulling the trigger.
But lets face it, recoil makes shooting a gun not a pleasurable experience. And it makes it hard to re-aquire the target and get a follow-up shot.
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Old 06-07-2012, 06:26 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
14,105 posts, read 44,604,766 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titaniummd View Post
I tend to see this question raised quite a bit. I have shot many calibers of many firearms. I don't tend to be recoil sensitive, though there is discomfort depending upon the style/design of a grip. For me, wider grips dissipate the recoil to a significant degree. Empty gun weight is a good guide to determine what works best for a particular caliber.

For me, the Glock has minimal recoil in my chosen models, the 40 cal G23 Compact and G27 Subcompact and my 45 ACP G30 compact and G36 single stack subcompact. They tend to have less snap than my conventional 1911.

The heavier the gun, the less recoil, to a degree, in my personal experience. For me, a 17 ounce snubby works for 38+P for me. A 24 oz 357 snubby, does too. A 13 oz Snubby (i.e. my Ruger LCR 38) is a bit too light for 38+P to be pleasant but I still shoot it with 100 rounds per outing; it's outright painful.

The Sig P238 is easily manageable with standard 380 loads but gets a little snappier with +P. follow up shots can be a fraction slower due to a little bit more muzzle flip.

My Colt Python, Pro Series 627, Coonan 357 Magnum 1911, and GP100 are tanks. They weigh 40+ oz and 357 magnum is no issue.

Anyways, I tend to see some people concerned about recoil. There are certainly viable points. However, bear in mind, many have aftermarket sights that minimize or reduce recoil, such as Hogue Rugger grips or Hogue wood grips with finger grooves. If you're shooting a Magnum, it's best to have a thick and wider grip to dissipate force. A narrower grip, like a Ruger LCP or a two finger wood grip like my performance center 627 are too small to be comfortable shooting.

Aftermarket parts are always available to reduce perceived recoil.

Why do you think the question of recoil in a particular gun is so common? Is it the experience level of the shooter? Was there a bad prior experience? Do you have room in your technique to mitigate some or most of the recoil?
Uncle Jeff thought it was because we are living in "the age of the wimp". I have and do shoot up to 44 Mag, all sorts of 12 gauge, and rifle up to 375 H&H, and while the 375 did move me around noticably, it didn't *hurt*, so I really didn't worry about it. This is probably a related phenomenon to when you notice some guy sweating bullets as you prepare to give him an injection. People need to get a grip, consider what a real pain or real hardship is, and try to conduct themselves as if, for example, they knew George Patton could see how they were behaving themselves. Or George Washington. Or Chief Sitting Bull. You get the idea.

That and I think a lot of people don't shoot much as kids, are unfamiliar with guns in general, so are wondering if they can handle a particular gat. Some "Dutch uncle" types like to spin tall tales about how hard this and that kicks, to build up their "legend in their own mind" status, this does not help either.

If you hold the gun appropriately, with proper dynamic tension on handguns and rifles, and avoid using the wrong position with the wrong gun - one does not use the prone position with a 600 NE, for example, nor does one shoot it from the bench like it was a .222, putting the weak hand under the butt stock - if you are holding right, using an appropriate position, and are concentrating properly on the shooting task, you hardly notice recoil. At least that's my experience.
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Old 06-08-2012, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Visitation between Wal-Mart & Home Depot
8,309 posts, read 34,233,349 times
Reputation: 7067
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
Uncle Jeff thought it was because we are living in "the age of the wimp". I have and do shoot up to 44 Mag, all sorts of 12 gauge, and rifle up to 375 H&H, and while the 375 did move me around noticably, it didn't *hurt*, so I really didn't worry about it. This is probably a related phenomenon to when you notice some guy sweating bullets as you prepare to give him an injection. People need to get a grip, consider what a real pain or real hardship is, and try to conduct themselves as if, for example, they knew George Patton could see how they were behaving themselves. Or George Washington. Or Chief Sitting Bull. You get the idea.

That and I think a lot of people don't shoot much as kids, are unfamiliar with guns in general, so are wondering if they can handle a particular gat. Some "Dutch uncle" types like to spin tall tales about how hard this and that kicks, to build up their "legend in their own mind" status, this does not help either.

If you hold the gun appropriately, with proper dynamic tension on handguns and rifles, and avoid using the wrong position with the wrong gun - one does not use the prone position with a 600 NE, for example, nor does one shoot it from the bench like it was a .222, putting the weak hand under the butt stock - if you are holding right, using an appropriate position, and are concentrating properly on the shooting task, you hardly notice recoil. At least that's my experience.
I've never felt any recoil when hunting. If you do, you may want to get your glands checked out.

I sometimes waterfowl with a 10 guage BPS and always thought it was actually pleasant to shoot... Until I patterned a turkey load. That surprised the hell out of me.
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Old 06-09-2012, 03:21 PM
 
716 posts, read 431,620 times
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The truth be told, any firearm can be mastered with the right stance, grip and technique. I've never worried all that much about recoil in any of my firearms. Interesting enough, the gun that I thought kicked the hardest was a Bryco .380. It belonged to a friend for a junk handgun he kept in his tacklebox that he didn't care if it got wet or went overboard should the boat or canoe roll over, thus losing the junker. That's over and above the .44 Mags... S&W and Rugers (mostly S&W model 29s), .410 ga revolvers, .500 S&W revolvers, .50 AE Desert Eagles, and any and all kinds of rifles and shotguns. Your stance and grip make all the difference in the world. Take a look at this video and watch man after man being knocked on their butts. The last man to shoot it, who appears short and stocky "MAN HANDLES" with ease. Any firearm can be mastered with the proper technique. I bet the other fellas wondered how he did it. Well, let's say this...some fairies shouldn't be allowed to shoot!




T-Rex Rifle cal. 577 - YouTube
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