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Old 11-11-2014, 08:17 PM
 
Location: Spots Wyoming
18,696 posts, read 35,498,579 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWG223 View Post
No, they have not, and it's not my opinion. They are happily using the 9mm, by and large, officially. But honestly, they have used most everything. You understand that a SEAL team gets its equipment based on its mission, correct? That might be an AK47, or an M4, or a 416, or...They let the mission drive the gear train.

What was this guy's name who told you a 9mm won't penetrate a rib? Because the leading wound ballistics forensics person on the West Coast is my contact Dr. Gary K. Roberts. He does not hold that opinion.

The FBI has switched from .40 to 9mm, as well, just recently.

The FBI is Going 9mm: Here Comes the Science | The Loadout Room
My brother, in San Diego, is the FFL that did the transfers of 168, .40 cals distributed too three seal teams. What do you think, they going to use them for hammers?

Evidentially you didn't read it. I don't remember the guys name but he was the forensic expert for gunshot wounds from LA County's Forensic team. I'll take his knowledge seedings how he investigates hundreds of gunshot wounds every year and has been investigating them for some 20 odd years.
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Old 11-11-2014, 10:33 PM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,749 posts, read 2,626,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElkHunter View Post
My brother, in San Diego, is the FFL that did the transfers of 168, .40 cals distributed too three seal teams. What do you think, they going to use them for hammers?

Evidentially you didn't read it. I don't remember the guys name but he was the forensic expert for gunshot wounds from LA County's Forensic team. I'll take his knowledge seedings how he investigates hundreds of gunshot wounds every year and has been investigating them for some 20 odd years.
I'll take the leading forensic scientist's word for it, personally. The one currently doing work for FBI/DoD.
http://www.handguncombatives.com/res...efing_6_13.pdf

Everyone has a brother who...but I'll presume you're both being honest and accurate. You do recall me saying "the mission drives the gear", right? Do you really think they still use those? They go through weapons like water.
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Old 11-11-2014, 10:36 PM
 
Location: Spots Wyoming
18,696 posts, read 35,498,579 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWG223 View Post
I'll take the leading forensic scientist's word for it, personally. The one currently doing work for FBI/DoD.
http://www.handguncombatives.com/res...efing_6_13.pdf

Everyone has a brother who...but I'll presume you're both being honest and accurate. You do recall me saying "the mission drives the gear", right? Do you really think they still use those? They go through weapons like water.
The buy was in June and they haven't ordered the next allotment, so yes, I assume they are still using them. By the way, there were also 38 9mm's in the same purchase, but this went to a particular team.
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Old 11-12-2014, 01:06 AM
 
Location: OC, CA
9,863 posts, read 13,252,526 times
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I am coming in late, but 2 real experts I know of in SD, suggest Wasp Spray for people that aren't comfortable with guns. Shoots straight 30 feet, cheap, burns like hell, and will blind someone. Non lethal and legal in all states.
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Old 11-12-2014, 02:28 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,749 posts, read 2,626,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElkHunter View Post
The buy was in June and they haven't ordered the next allotment, so yes, I assume they are still using them. By the way, there were also 38 9mm's in the same purchase, but this went to a particular team.
Understandable, but you have to understand that your brother is not their sole source of firearms. I won't argue with you about whether they bought them for use or not or whatever...because neither of us can prove they did, or didn't. What I will say is that justifying a piece of kit because "SEAL TEAM so and so" used it, is pointless. They have used and will use anything that best suites their mission.
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Old 11-12-2014, 02:29 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teckeeee View Post
I am coming in late, but 2 real experts I know of in SD, suggest Wasp Spray for people that aren't comfortable with guns. Shoots straight 30 feet, cheap, burns like hell, and will blind someone. Non lethal and legal in all states.
Oklahoma Personal Defense - The Myth of Wasp Spray
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:47 AM
 
9,371 posts, read 15,888,250 times
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In an effort to get this thread back on track and answer the OP's question, I second the double action revolver. Even people with firearms training sometimes struggle with misfeeds and stove pipes, so you need to take those out of the equation.
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:41 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe from dayton View Post
In an effort to get this thread back on track and answer the OP's question, I second the double action revolver. Even people with firearms training sometimes struggle with misfeeds and stove pipes, so you need to take those out of the equation.
The issue with a revolver is that sometimes junk gets caught between the cylinder face and the forcing cone/barrel, they are less durable if dropped (can bend the pawl, etc.), so on and so forth. Couple that with them having only half the capacity of similarly sized 9mm semi-autos, and it's something that should definitely be taken into account. Clearing a malfunction in a semi-auto is not difficult nearly so much as fixing a jammed cylinder in a revolver (game-stopper, typically).

I honestly cannot see a single advantage to a revolver unless you want to fire it from your pocket repeatedly, which has a place, but that is a very small place.

My question about firearms is this, when the "what weapon should a woman use" question gets popped...

-Are women dumber?
-Are women less capable of learning?
-Is the woman you are discussing much weaker than other women, as a general rule?

I ask this because it seems people want women to be our equals as men, well, some people, but a firearm comes up, and women are considered mouthbreathing weaklings who should just stay in the kitchen. Really, though, a woman can handle effectively and efficiently any service-caliber side-arm that a man can handle. It takes training just like it would for a man.


So maybe the question should be: "Is this important enough to the person I am discussing for them to obtain the proper training and skillset to employ a weapon effectively?"

Men...women...it doesn't matter a darn hill of beans. What firearm should a "person" use is a much safer and better question.

I dated a girl years ago who was the epitome of "kept". She couldn't do anything for herself, or so she thought. She constantly threw the "I'm just a girl" and "I can't do that" lines out there. Well, I finally convinced her she COULD do something for herself, and she found out she loved shooting my roommate's 357SIG, and she was quite proficient at it, as well, to boot.

I think we do our women a great disservice by considering them vastly inferior to us at tasks which are equally mastered by both sexes. Shooting a .45 is not carrying a 240# body out of a burning building at a run. I promise your girl can do it, barring medical situations (arthritis, etc.)

Last edited by JWG223; 11-12-2014 at 10:56 AM..
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,775 posts, read 3,695,334 times
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Yes, a revolver can malfunction. But under the same conditions (dirt, gunk, rust, etc.) any revolver will continue to function long after a similar-quality semi-auto will start malfunctioning. The same junk that stops a revolver by getting caught between the forcing cone and cylinder can interfere with the slide on a semi much more easily.

The advantages to a modern double-action revolver (for a beginning shooter, or one who doesn't practice) include:
1) no safeties to fiddle with;
2) no slide to rack;
3) no need to remember if a round is chambered or not;
4) no chance of a common "limp-wrist" caused failure.

Yes, I am aware of videos where someone buries a Glock for "n" years, digs it up, cleans it, and shoots it. A good revolver will work the same way.

Yes, I'm aware of videos where people demonstrate how quickly they can swap magazines or clear jams. This advice is to a new gunowner, not a wanna-be Rambo who practices regularly.

My advice is the same as always. If, and only if, you:
- buy a quality, reliable semi-auto firearm;
- use quality, reliable defense ammunition;
- train regularly and practice failure drills; and
- are confident enough to leave the weapon loaded and chambered so you don't have to fiddle with loading it;
then you should consider trusting a semi-auto to defend your life. Otherwise, get a good DA revolver.

With that said, I'm not dissing semi-auto's; I carry a semi-auto. I am saying that there is no such thing as a one-size-fits all with firearms. Each person, each situation, is different. A semi-auto is best for you or me. But based on the criteria we know about the OP's daughter, a good DA hammerless revolver is the way to go.
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Traverse City, MI
166 posts, read 408,533 times
Reputation: 171
My wife just traded in her Walther PK380 for a Glock 19 gen 4. She likes it because she has greater accuracy, larger capacity and it has less recoil. She tries to shoot at the gun range every 7 - 10 days to keep herself in practice.
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