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Old 12-17-2014, 02:44 PM
 
11,686 posts, read 13,118,377 times
Reputation: 30992

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwilliger View Post
I had a very interesting lunch today...

I was at a small fast food restaurant and was sitting towards the back eating my lunch when a man of middle-eastern descent came in. He had the full head dress on and I didn't think much about it at first...

It was a strange feeling accompanied by way too much adrenaline. I way over thought something and now I'm having a hard time accepting the fact that I might have an issue with middle-eastern people....
There is also the possibility that in a panic reaction you might have not only harmed an innocent man, but you might have harmed one who wasn't Middle Eastern or Muslim, much less dangerous. It takes more than a beard and/or a head dress to make a Muslim...and more than being Muslim to make a terrorist.

Congratulations on taking a hard second look at the day.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/07/us...ting.html?_r=0

Mistaken for Muslims, Sikhs hit by hate crimes - US news - Crime & courts | NBC News
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Old 12-18-2014, 02:03 PM
 
28,411 posts, read 14,183,798 times
Reputation: 19546
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife View Post
Actually, you were on track so don't drum down on yourself at all.

The fact is, and don't overlook or diminish it, is that you did not draw. That right there says that something kicked in and today you are here instead of there where "there" is some lockup.

Don't forget too, that the reaction if very different when you think you are the target vs someone else being the target and you just happen to be in proximity. The thoughts that went through your mind in those few seconds are the same that keep you safe.

Everything worked out right? You didn't draw or even give away your carry unless someone was real attentive. For all anyone else knew, you were reaching to scratch your ass right?

One of the best ways to deal with this type of situation it is remove all emotion from the situation.

You aren't the first one to go through this and won't be the last. Learn from it and drive on. You're already on the way to gaining the skills and knowledge to float through this kind of stuff.

Stay safe.
Agreed.

Sounds to me like he played it just right.
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Old 12-18-2014, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
30,616 posts, read 9,148,309 times
Reputation: 29156
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwilliger View Post
I had a very interesting lunch today...

All the news about the school bombing overseas and the fellow who help up the cafe in Australia got my mind going more than it should have been.

I was at a small fast food restaurant and was sitting towards the back eating my lunch when a man of middle-eastern descent came in. He had the full head dress on and I didn't think much about it at first.

Then he started walking towards me with a very blank look on his face. He made eye contact with me and was walking straight towards me. I looked down at my table and then back up again and he gave me an awkward smile while maintaining eye contact.
"Why didn't he order food?"
"Why is he walking towards the back of the restaurant? The bathrooms are on the other side."
"Why is he holding a can of Sprite?"
"Why is this guy looking at me rather than everyone else he is walking by?"
"There is no running away from this, I'm pinned in a booth, the only way is through him"

I slowly reached back to my gun that was on my hip at the 4 ish position and grabbed the grip. I was telling/thinking to myself that I can't draw unless he get's in my space and poses a threat where I know my life is in danger.

And then he turned sideways and set his Sprite on a table next to mine and walked back towards the register. He was just reserving his table it turns out.

I looked around and no one seemed to notice that I was reaching for my gun. I never unholstered it. I've only practiced sitting down and unholstering my gun a couple thousand times in that position, it was so smooth and natural. I can't decide if I made a huge mistake even reaching for it or if it was at all justified. My life wasn't in immediate danger or any danger for that matter.

I took a detour and dropped by my apartment and put my gun in my storage lockbox. Don't know if I'm going to be carrying anytime soon.

It was a strange feeling accompanied by way too much adrenaline. I way over thought something and now I'm having a hard time accepting the fact that I might have an issue with middle-eastern people.

Anyone have any similar stories about thinking about drawing/reaching for your gun before any action is really going down?





Nope. Neither DH nor I are in the least bit shaky around or conflicted about guns. Given that you even had to "make a detour" to ditch your gun, maybe you should turn in yours--along with your carry permit.
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Old 12-18-2014, 04:13 PM
 
Location: Cape Cod
9,885 posts, read 7,154,213 times
Reputation: 18082
You have to consider the "what if factor" what if that guy was set to do harm by robbing the place or blowing it up? If he was going to blow it up I don't think anything would have helped you. If he was there to rob it you would be better off to let him rob and run and let the Police track him down. In this day and age you do not want ot be a vigilante, you shoto the guy he sues you and you might go to jail even if his intent was to kill. if you kill him his family sues you.
If I was in a situation where a robbery was taking place I wouldn't pull my gun unless the situation escalated where people were being hurt.
Carrying a weapon that can take someones life including your own is something to take very seriously so you need to think carefully about how you will react.
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Old 12-19-2014, 11:13 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,838 posts, read 30,118,328 times
Reputation: 17714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd View Post
You have to consider the "what if factor" what if that guy was set to do harm by robbing the place or blowing it up? If he was going to blow it up I don't think anything would have helped you. If he was there to rob it you would be better off to let him rob and run and let the Police track him down. In this day and age you do not want ot be a vigilante, you shoto the guy he sues you and you might go to jail even if his intent was to kill. if you kill him his family sues you.
If I was in a situation where a robbery was taking place I wouldn't pull my gun unless the situation escalated where people were being hurt.
Carrying a weapon that can take someones life including your own is something to take very seriously so you need to think carefully about how you will react.
Then why carry at all?
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Old 12-19-2014, 06:20 PM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,749 posts, read 2,621,469 times
Reputation: 2659
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
Then why carry at all?
To defend your life and limb. It's not a shortcut through law enforcement academy. Too many people think it is...
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Old 12-19-2014, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Denver
3,139 posts, read 6,920,797 times
Reputation: 2913
I don't see what the problem here is or why you locked up your pistol afterwards?

In your opinion you thought you had a threat to deal with. You prepared to act quickly but upon further judgment you backed off.

So what?

Your judgment prevented you from foolishly drawing.
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Old 12-20-2014, 12:56 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,749 posts, read 2,621,469 times
Reputation: 2659
Quote:
Originally Posted by wankel7 View Post
I don't see what the problem here is or why you locked up your pistol afterwards?

In your opinion you thought you had a threat to deal with. You prepared to act quickly but upon further judgment you backed off.

So what?

Your judgment prevented you from foolishly drawing.
I think OP had one of those moments similar to when you're about to pull out into the street and take one last glance and that 18-wheeler blasts by and you think of what almost happened.
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Old 12-20-2014, 10:11 PM
 
Location: Ohio
13,951 posts, read 10,334,523 times
Reputation: 7232
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwilliger View Post
I had a very interesting lunch today...

All the news about the school bombing overseas and the fellow who help up the cafe in Australia got my mind going more than it should have been.

I was at a small fast food restaurant and was sitting towards the back eating my lunch when a man of middle-eastern descent came in. He had the full head dress on and I didn't think much about it at first.

Then he started walking towards me with a very blank look on his face. He made eye contact with me and was walking straight towards me. I looked down at my table and then back up again and he gave me an awkward smile while maintaining eye contact.
"Why didn't he order food?"
"Why is he walking towards the back of the restaurant? The bathrooms are on the other side."
"Why is he holding a can of Sprite?"
"Why is this guy looking at me rather than everyone else he is walking by?"
"There is no running away from this, I'm pinned in a booth, the only way is through him"

I slowly reached back to my gun that was on my hip at the 4 ish position and grabbed the grip. I was telling/thinking to myself that I can't draw unless he get's in my space and poses a threat where I know my life is in danger.

And then he turned sideways and set his Sprite on a table next to mine and walked back towards the register. He was just reserving his table it turns out.

I looked around and no one seemed to notice that I was reaching for my gun. I never unholstered it. I've only practiced sitting down and unholstering my gun a couple thousand times in that position, it was so smooth and natural. I can't decide if I made a huge mistake even reaching for it or if it was at all justified. My life wasn't in immediate danger or any danger for that matter.

I took a detour and dropped by my apartment and put my gun in my storage lockbox. Don't know if I'm going to be carrying anytime soon.

It was a strange feeling accompanied by way too much adrenaline. I way over thought something and now I'm having a hard time accepting the fact that I might have an issue with middle-eastern people.

Anyone have any similar stories about thinking about drawing/reaching for your gun before any action is really going down?

There's a fine line between being aware of your surroundings, and being over reactive, or even looking for an opportunity to draw. As scary as that last thought is, yes, there are people who seek out an opportunity to draw. You can find them all over the internet in the right forums.

Not to mention, that from your description, it sounds like YOU were the one who was acting out of place. I mean think about it, according to you, YOU were the one who noticed him. You were the one looking at him. As he noticed you looking at him, and gave you an "awkward smile", it wouldn't surprise me one bit to learn that he was probably thinking "oh man, am I gonna have to throw my Sprite in this guy's face if he makes a move?"

You have to decide whether or not carrying a gun is the right decision for your mental state. Some people don't have the mental fortitude to carry around deadly force with them wherever they go. I'm not saying that you don't, I'm saying that you have to decide that for yourself. As others have said, once you draw your weapon, ( you don't even have to fire it, only draw it ) you're life as you know it can change forever, and possibly someone elses life as well.

Last edited by WhipperSnapper 88; 12-20-2014 at 10:35 PM..
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Old 12-20-2014, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Ohio
13,951 posts, read 10,334,523 times
Reputation: 7232
Quote:
Originally Posted by wankel7 View Post
I don't see what the problem here is or why you locked up your pistol afterwards?

In your opinion you thought you had a threat to deal with. You prepared to act quickly but upon further judgment you backed off.

So what?

Your judgment prevented you from foolishly drawing.
According to his description, his judgement wasn't in play. He didn't even realize he was going for his gun until his hand was on it. That's a scary thought. I can see why it shook him enough to disarm himself after that.
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