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Old 04-16-2015, 05:26 AM
 
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Been wanting to get my first AR for a while. A guy I used to work with at Sig, who is now a dealer, has a small number of police trade Bushmaster AR-15's. Probably a number of years old and wear associated with PD use. Just wondering if this would be a good option for a first rifle? Cost is $475 with one 30 rnd mag, fixed carry handle, collapsible stock and flash hider.
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Old 04-16-2015, 06:27 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,747 posts, read 2,611,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NHDave View Post
Been wanting to get my first AR for a while. A guy I used to work with at Sig, who is now a dealer, has a small number of police trade Bushmaster AR-15's. Probably a number of years old and wear associated with PD use. Just wondering if this would be a good option for a first rifle? Cost is $475 with one 30 rnd mag, fixed carry handle, collapsible stock and flash hider.
Bushmaster really doesn't do well stacked up to some other brands because of the myriad of out of spec dimensions (short throats), poor QA/QC, etc.

However, at $475, that stuff can almost be overlooked, except you said "fixed carry handle", which means no optics are going to work reasonably. That really really sucks. In conjunction with you not knowing what my/may not be messed up from prior use.

It's not a BAD deal, but it's just not a rifle I'd want. If you're bored and have $500 to waste, why not? You can probably get your money back out of it anyway.
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Old 04-16-2015, 06:39 AM
 
Location: Texas Hill Country
8,860 posts, read 4,826,319 times
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Originally Posted by JWG223 View Post
.........except you said "fixed carry handle", which means no optics are going to work reasonably. That really really sucks...........
No slash against the sayer but this does rather demonstrate that it would probably help if we knew how the OP shoots, among other things.

Both my AR's (-15, -10 (which is another point in that realize that there is more than just the -15 out there)) are fixed carry handles and are fine with me. I've never used a scope, have done all my shooting over iron posts (now) and peep sights (back in JROTC rifle team). It works for me.

Equally, I don't use a forward post but rather shoot with a sling and I have a preference for carbines.

So if we are to advise, it would help to know more about what the shooter is after.
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:00 AM
 
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This would basically be an indoor/outdoor range gun, a never had one, want to own one without spending a grand plus gun. So the fixed handle will prevent the use of any optics? I would like something simple like a red dot, I suppose I could go with a laser if an optic isn't possible, or live with the iron sights if need be.

Last edited by NHDave; 04-16-2015 at 07:22 AM..
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Old 04-16-2015, 09:15 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
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Originally Posted by TamaraSavannah View Post
No slash against the sayer but this does rather demonstrate that it would probably help if we knew how the OP shoots, among other things.

Both my AR's (-15, -10 (which is another point in that realize that there is more than just the -15 out there)) are fixed carry handles and are fine with me. I've never used a scope, have done all my shooting over iron posts (now) and peep sights (back in JROTC rifle team). It works for me.

Equally, I don't use a forward post but rather shoot with a sling and I have a preference for carbines.

So if we are to advise, it would help to know more about what the shooter is after.
I was looking at that from a resale/value standpoint. Noone wants a fixed handle, much less a fixed handle used BM. At least, that's what the open market will show.
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Old 04-16-2015, 09:17 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NHDave View Post
This would basically be an indoor/outdoor range gun, a never had one, want to own one without spending a grand plus gun. So the fixed handle will prevent the use of any optics? I would like something simple like a red dot, I suppose I could go with a laser if an optic isn't possible, or live with the iron sights if need be.
Honestly? Here:

It's not perfect, but you will be happy with it I'm betting.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/36_763_977/products_id/71969/S%26W+M%26P15+Sport+30%2B1+223REM5.56NATO+16%22

$125 more gets you a warranty, flat-top, and a new rifle. The rifles are both "plinker grade" in my book, but plinking is what you state your plan is, so I'd recommend paying the money and getting the rifle that has a warranty and will allow you to add that red dot later on.
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Old 04-16-2015, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,773 posts, read 3,678,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NHDave View Post
This would basically be an indoor/outdoor range gun, a never had one, want to own one without spending a grand plus gun. So the fixed handle will prevent the use of any optics? I would like something simple like a red dot, I suppose I could go with a laser if an optic isn't possible, or live with the iron sights if need be.
You can mount an adapter to the top of the carry handle, but that puts the optic extremely high above the bore. Adequate for longer ranges, but you'll have a time trying to hit the bull's eye on anything close in... say, the 25-yd line at an indoor range. And your cheek weld will be non-existent. If you are simply working on "minute of bad guy" shooting where precision isn't required and anything within 3-4" is acceptable, then this will work fine.

A better option (IMO) is to mount a long-eye-relief scope or red-dot forward of the carry handle. You can replace the forward grip with a quad rail, but it would need to be a free-float version for decent accuracy. Or, much cheaper, use a "drop front mount" sometimes called a "co-witness mount". A drop-front-mount attaches to the top of the carry handle then extends a rail forward and down so the optic is lower. If you do it right, you can get a holographic optic to co-witness with the iron sights for the best of both worlds. You get the speedy acquisition of a red-dot, or if the batteries die you can just aim with the iron sights by looking through the clear panel of the red-dot. The better mounts are vertically adjustable for this very reason.

All this said, you can put a carry handle on a flat top but you can't go to a flat top if you have a fixed carry handle. Honestly, it sounds like a somewhat decent deal, but only if it is exactly what you want and was a model that sat in the trunk of a cruiser for a few years. If it was used for extensive practice with several thousand rounds down the pipe you could have to replace the barrel soon which will negate anything you saved.

https://www.google.com/search?q=opti...B0QsAQ#imgrc=_

Last edited by jwkilgore; 04-16-2015 at 10:11 AM..
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Old 04-16-2015, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,773 posts, read 3,678,723 times
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Incidentally, you can get a stripped flat-top upper relatively cheap. The registration is on the lower, so the upper is just a replaceable part: PSA Stripped Blemished AR-15 Upper Receiver

Swapping it out requires some basic knowledge of firearms, but most people can do it at home with basic tools. There are countless YouTube videos talking about gunsmithing on ARs.
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:00 PM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,747 posts, read 2,611,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwkilgore View Post
Incidentally, you can get a stripped flat-top upper relatively cheap. The registration is on the lower, so the upper is just a replaceable part: PSA Stripped Blemished AR-15 Upper Receiver

Swapping it out requires some basic knowledge of firearms, but most people can do it at home with basic tools. There are countless YouTube videos talking about gunsmithing on ARs.
Takes about $150 in tools to do it correctly.
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Old 04-16-2015, 08:56 PM
 
Location: Texas Hill Country
8,860 posts, read 4,826,319 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWG223 View Post
I was looking at that from a resale/value standpoint. Noone wants a fixed handle, much less a fixed handle used BM. At least, that's what the open market will show.
To each their own. I don't buy mine as flat tops. Probably because as older, I stay with what I was trained and conditioned with when I was younger. (that said, where is this dealer in topic--said partly in jest)
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