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Old 06-07-2015, 11:56 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
30,408 posts, read 9,086,867 times
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So having a carry permit to carry is what's behind all of those confrontations leading to death in Chicago and NYC.

The things you learn on these boards!
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Old 06-08-2015, 03:10 AM
 
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
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I had the misfortune of having to draw my firearm more than once. Three times against dogs, one of which was to protect my kid. Sounds silly but it was for just in case. The dog going for my kid - now that dog was in mortal danger but it ran from my hurried approach and shouting. One time was in defence of a woman I thought was being attacked by a crazed man carrying a large bush knife. He melted at my warning shot. Mind you, I thought he would turn his attack on me and I had prepared to kill him. Wow! But then I thought I was in mortal danger after running to the aid of this woman after she had run toward the blood curdling screams of her young daughter and found myself faced with this enraged and crazed man - her bloody boyfriend. Tried to rape this young kid! Anyway, the other times were when I thought I would come under attack by a mob. I was going to take some of them with me before they killed me! That's why I left that country. Now a gun is a hobby to be enjoyed and respected and there is no such thing as a concealed weapons permit. There is no such thing as a self defence firearm, period. Call it paradise if you will.
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Old 06-08-2015, 04:11 AM
 
Location: Earth
4,506 posts, read 5,256,024 times
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Quote:
ESPECIALLY at Chuckie Cheese!

My god have you seen the terror a gang of three year olds can cause?
REALLY?

Chuck E. Cheese shooting caught on camera | WWLP.com

Aurora's Other Massacre Victims' 20-Year Wait for Justice - ABC News

The 7 Most Horrific Crimes to Occur at Chuck E. Cheese's - Mandatory
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Old 06-08-2015, 09:51 AM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,773 posts, read 3,678,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by green papaya View Post
From my observation over the years hearing about or reading about shootings in the news, it seems a large percentage of confrontations that happen could have been avoided just by backing down or not arguing or talking back with the other person? everybody is taught to never back down, dont be afraid, dont let somebody tell you what to do, etc, everybody thinks they are so macho, everybody has to be a tough guy?

since I dont carry a personal defense firearm, I always back down, I never try to be the tough guy, I dont give people the bird, or argue with strangers, this prevents 90% of any type of confrontation or violence, dont butt heads with people and most of the time they will leave you alone.
As others have stated, you have it exactly backwards. People who go to the trouble to fill out paperwork and/or take classes to get a legal CCW are the ones who know enough to know how serious it is to carry a firearm. It's the yay-hoos who "constitutional carry" without bothering to learn anything about self-defense law that I worry about. I'm amazed at the number of people who fully believe they have the right to shoot when doing so would send them straight to jail.

I don't carry all the time (limitations because of my job and kid's school), but when I do I find I'm almost always more polite and willing to ignore the idiot passing everyone on the shoulder instead of merging in heavy traffic or the other idiot who pulled out in front of me. I rarely go to places where face-to-face confrontations occur (bars, high crime areas, large gatherings of rednecks, etc.), but if I did go on occasion I'd be doubly polite if I were armed.

And no, this does not mean I would back down from some thug trying to rob me.
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Old 06-08-2015, 02:37 PM
 
17,907 posts, read 9,836,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson View Post
Actually, I find that when I carry my firearm (and since I'm so used to it, even when I'm not carrying), I end up avoiding situations that I used to get irritated over.

I used to flip people off on the road and give nasty looks when they would pull up beside me. Now, I just let it go and pretend it never happened. I pretty much lose every argument or altercation (though they rarely, if ever happen).

It's made me a better person.

If everyone carried legally, I think society would be much more polite. Thinking "I've got a gun, he's got a gun, we all have guns" keeps everyone in line.
I feel the same way.

Here is the deal: If either party is armed, every fight is likely to turn into a gunfight. That's because the person with the gun cannot afford to lose it in a fistfight.

Knowing that, the man with the gun needs to avoid even fistfights. "Do I really want to end up shooting this alpha-hotel over this silly carp? Nah, I'll just frack it and drive on."
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Old 06-08-2015, 02:42 PM
 
Location: West Madison^WMHT
3,174 posts, read 2,743,911 times
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Post Permit holders are more law-abiding than average citizen

Every reputable study done on American permit holders has shown they are much less likely than the average citizen to be arrested for any crime. Carry permit holders are less likely to commit firearms offenses than even police officers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurst 4 View Post
If and only "IF" you are lucky enough to have a valid CCW in Chi-town or NYC after jumping through rolls and rolls of red tap and hoops. The criminals are doing the shooting in most cases.
At least Chicago, Illinois actually issues permits, assuming you are willing to wait several months and rich enough to spend a grand and several days on the training and paperwork.

There have been 3 shootings by a CCL holder in Chicago area since Illinois started issuing carry licenses, each of which was, by all accounts, a good shooting, legal self-defense. Really, very few incidents involving permit holders, the worst being somebody who should never have been issued a license.
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Old 06-10-2015, 11:06 AM
 
4,756 posts, read 8,383,950 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson View Post

If everyone carried legally, I think society would be much more polite. Thinking "I've got a gun, he's got a gun, we all have guns" keeps everyone in line.
We call this "Southern Hospitality" !
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Old 06-10-2015, 11:14 AM
 
4,756 posts, read 8,383,950 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurst 4 View Post
Two ways to look at it. Unless you qualify pistol expert or above, I wouldn't want just any old guy who shoots 50 rounds a year firing in a building full of small children. Even at expert and above levels of proficiency, it's a dangerous move doing so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurst 4 View Post
No one is attacking your rights. If you are the type of CCW who wants to draw and fire in a crowded room full of small children, please take the necessary steps to ensure you can indeed actually hit something with it beforehand. That is all!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurst 4 View Post
The last time I was in Chuck E. Cheese's I was carrying a GLOCK G19 9mm 15+1 with Speer Gold Dot 124 grain JHPs and a Benchmade 9052BK AFO II auto. It was a hot summer day that day. ALL was concealed and no one was the wiser.
Funny how you do not want anyone to tell you if you are "qualified" to carry, but when it comes to an "old guy", you'll want him to be able to "actually hit something with it beforehand". This is a slippery slope to CCW regulations. One needs to be able to prove that he/ she can do this and that under a stressful situation, in a crowded room full of screaming children, etc. Where does this "proof of gun handling" stop?
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Old 06-10-2015, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Billings, MT
8,990 posts, read 7,083,311 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurst 4 View Post
Two ways to look at it. Unless you qualify pistol expert or above, I wouldn't want just any old guy who shoots 50 rounds a year firing in a building full of small children. Even at expert and above levels of proficiency, it's a dangerous move doing so.
"...just any old guy who shoots 50 rounds a year..."
That describes a sizable portion of the law enforcement personnel nationwide!
Including "School Resource Officers"!
It also describes a sizable portion of the military forces, both in CONUS and overseas.
A few members of the military might shoot 100 or more rounds once a year for "qualification".
I have fired more rounds in my back yard than I ever did in the military!
A Deputy Sheriff joins me in such shooting, quite frequently.
I don't have a CCP (Concealed Carry Permit). But then, in this state, outside the City Limits, the Law says I don't need one. We can carry open or concealed, outside of towns, whenever we want.
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Old 06-10-2015, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Chattanooga, TN
2,773 posts, read 3,678,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HB2HSV View Post
Funny how you do not want anyone to tell you if you are "qualified" to carry, but when it comes to an "old guy", you'll want him to be able to "actually hit something with it beforehand". This is a slippery slope to CCW regulations. One needs to be able to prove that he/ she can do this and that under a stressful situation, in a crowded room full of screaming children, etc. Where does this "proof of gun handling" stop?
IMHO, the goal of CCW regulations and classes IS NOT to teach people how to shoot in a room crowded with children/innocents (or similar high-risk-of-failure shooting situation).

Instead, the goal is to teach wanna-be heroes what would happen if they decide to shoot in a crowded room and miss the bad guy. In the words of the instructor of my permit class, "If you don't KNOW where the bullet is going when you pull the trigger, assume it will ALWAYS land in a police evidence bag."

With that knowledge in mind the potential hero can assess his/her personal skill level and make an informed decision instead of just thinking, "Imma gonna be-a HERO!! [PEW PEW PEW PEW]"

Last edited by jwkilgore; 06-10-2015 at 04:58 PM..
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