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Old 08-19-2015, 02:15 PM
 
722 posts, read 834,646 times
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after years of going to local ranges , something that has changed, it seems a lot of shooters think they are Special Ops, SEALs, Scout snipers, ex DELTA, SWAT?

plus when you go to a gun store 90% of the guns are some type of "tactical" style with rails, special optics, lasers, front pistol grips, folding stocks, like they are getting ready for a SEAL mission?

plus lots of self proclaimed MMA amateur fighters and that type of training

plus firearms training, everybody thinks they are Special Ops, ex Navy SEAL, etc at the local shooting ranges these days, and train like they are preparing for some type of fire fight or survival from a SHTF scenario? lots of fast shooting and emptying the magazines as fast as they can pull the trigger.

wearing tactical drop down holsters, and practicing quick draws

is it because of the video games? or recent conflicts in the Middle East?
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Old 08-19-2015, 02:31 PM
Status: "Gone hunting until December!" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Lost in Montana *recalculating*...
10,945 posts, read 14,584,566 times
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Don't really see that out here. Mostly guys shooting their hunting rifles, some at great distance.
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Old 08-19-2015, 04:07 PM
Status: "Gone hunting until December!" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Lost in Montana *recalculating*...
10,945 posts, read 14,584,566 times
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It sounds kinda like a lot of Harley owners. Some spend umpteen hundreds if not thousands on all the apparel- frilly chaps, patched jackets, studded boots, neckerchief scarf, goggles.. all geared to 'the look'. I guess the 'outlaw' look. I swear it takes them at least 1/2 hour just to get dressed to go for a ride.

Me? I grab my Shoei, armored jacket and gloves and I'm out the door in 2 minutes. I could give a rats butt about any 'look'.

Sounds a lot like the same phenomena to me. Somebody's making a lot of money on it, for sure!

And I hear you about the tactical rifles and firearms. Again- to each their choice I guess. I was raised on hunting rifles, and I loved my Marlin .22 lever action and 30-30. Plus I shot .22 competitively with a Winchester 75 bolt fitted with rear peep and hood front sights. Boy did those lever actions feel like a natural extension of my body. I would choke up on the stock where my eye was closer to that rear sight and just hammer cans and targets. Point and shoot, point and shoot.. Same thing with the 75 bolt- really close up to the peep.

Then I join the Army, get my first taste of a black plastic gun- the M16. What was this 'thing'? Pistol grip hanging down, triangular forearm.. But it did have the 'ol peep rear.. So out at the range I'm trying to get used to it, shooting prone, the thing is about as 'un-natural' to shoot (from my perspective).. So I wind up with my nose on the charging handle as the most 'comfortable' hold for me. Range instructor comes by, 'schools me' on the proper holding technique.. He leaves and I shoot- nose back on the charging handle.

I scored expert (even with several bloody jams), so he never bothered me again.

Last edited by Threerun; 08-19-2015 at 04:22 PM..
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Old 08-19-2015, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,701,155 times
Reputation: 11465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threerun View Post
It sounds kinda like a lot of Harley owners. Some spend umpteen hundreds if not thousands on all the apparel- frilly chaps, patched jackets, studded boots, neckerchief scarf, goggles.. all geared to 'the look'. I guess the 'outlaw' look. I swear it takes them at least 1/2 hour just to get dressed to go for a ride.

Me? I grab my Shoei, armored jacket and gloves and I'm out the door in 2 minutes. I could give a rats butt about any 'look'.

Sounds a lot like the same phenomena to me. Somebody's making a lot of money on it, for sure!

And I hear you about the tactical rifles and firearms. Again- to each their choice I guess. I was raised on hunting rifles, and I loved my Marlin .22 lever action and 30-30. Plus I shot .22 competitively with a Winchester 75 bolt fitted with rear peep and hood front sights. Boy did those lever actions feel like a natural extension of my body. I would choke up on the stock where my eye was closer to that rear sight and just hammer cans and targets. Point and shoot, point and shoot.. Same thing with the 75 bolt- really close up to the peep.

Then I join the Army, get my first taste of a black plastic gun- the M16. What was this 'thing'? Pistol grip hanging down, triangular forearm.. But it did have the 'ol peep rear.. So out at the range I'm trying to get used to it, shooting prone, the thing is about as 'un-natural' to shoot (from my perspective).. So I wind up with my nose on the charging handle as the most 'comfortable' hold for me. Range instructor comes by, 'schools me' on the proper holding technique.. He leaves and I shoot- nose back on the charging handle.

I scored expert (even with several bloody jams), so he never bothered me again.
I think this is most of it - both the Harley "dress up" crowd and the shooting "dress up" crowd - it's essentially "handbags and shoes" for guys. Not that there is anything wrong with that, of course!

Seriously, if they are having fun and not hurting anybody, it's not anybody's business. It would be great if everyone would train seriously, and try to develop some useful skill (with gun or bike alike) but the vast majority of hobbyists just can't be bothered to do anything that resembles work while they are busy playing.
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Old 08-19-2015, 07:20 PM
Status: "Gone hunting until December!" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Lost in Montana *recalculating*...
10,945 posts, read 14,584,566 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
I think this is most of it - both the Harley "dress up" crowd and the shooting "dress up" crowd - it's essentially "handbags and shoes" for guys. Not that there is anything wrong with that, of course!

Seriously, if they are having fun and not hurting anybody, it's not anybody's business. It would be great if everyone would train seriously, and try to develop some useful skill (with gun or bike alike) but the vast majority of hobbyists just can't be bothered to do anything that resembles work while they are busy playing.
Yeah I wouldn't care. I spend more money on my helmet than pants, but that's my choice. Ride and be free.

I did happen upon a group of OH, KY, MI, WV militia guys back in the 90's in the Ntl Forest in WV. They tried to restrict my access to their 'drill' area. Bunch of fat, old, beer gutted guys walking around with semi-auto's and I had to laugh. They could barely walk around, let alone carry out serious drills. I was very polite to tell them I was in the Ntl forest and scoping out my hunting areas, showed them my sticker on the windshield they 'waved me on'.

I drove on kinda chuckling to myself, lol. I found it rather amusing to say the least.
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Old 08-19-2015, 09:35 PM
 
793 posts, read 1,061,488 times
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Local range, crowded day. This is a bit of a sleepy town, we don't get a lot of the tacti-cool folk.

Four guys with earpieces show up, camo pants, tactical jackets... each with rolling luggage. They share two benches. Both benches are COMPLETELY covered in fireams, takes them an entire shooting session just to lay out (some) their guns.

They put up human targets (not allowed at that range) out about 10 yards or so. Get into a row with the range master about it, and replace it.

Then they have to roll their luggage back out, because apparently, there are still a lot more guns in it and not enough room on the bench. (Which are large.)

Finally they got ready to shoot. I didn't pay attention, but I looked at their targets at the end. There was maybe 3-5 holes in one target, none in the other. They took an entire session to pack up and leave.

wtf.
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:31 PM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,747 posts, read 2,611,020 times
Reputation: 2654
Quote:
Originally Posted by green papaya View Post
after years of going to local ranges , something that has changed, it seems a lot of shooters think they are Special Ops, SEALs, Scout snipers, ex DELTA, SWAT?

plus when you go to a gun store 90% of the guns are some type of "tactical" style with rails, special optics, lasers, front pistol grips, folding stocks, like they are getting ready for a SEAL mission?

plus lots of self proclaimed MMA amateur fighters and that type of training

plus firearms training, everybody thinks they are Special Ops, ex Navy SEAL, etc at the local shooting ranges these days, and train like they are preparing for some type of fire fight or survival from a SHTF scenario? lots of fast shooting and emptying the magazines as fast as they can pull the trigger.

wearing tactical drop down holsters, and practicing quick draws

is it because of the video games? or recent conflicts in the Middle East?
I agree, it's like air-bags in a car, what's up with 9 or 10 of them? It's like people are getting ready to wreck on that thar Audiobawn!

Seriously though, let me address it 1 point at a time, as applies to me, and maybe it can give further insight along with the other replies...

Why does my M4 have a rail? So that I can position my hand further toward the muzzle so I can get better leverage to shoot it more accurately and transition between targets faster.

Why does this rail...have rails? Mine actually doesn't, I went over to M-LOK because I don't NEED 1913 all over the place. However, before, yeah, it was just un-used, but it was a price I paid for the leverage above.

Why do I have "special optics"? Well, it's a red-dot, and it makes shooting in low light MUCH! easier.

Why doe I have a laser? I don't, some people do though, if they run NODS, again, night-time pest control and other uses.

Why do I have a pistol grip? Because the M4 is made like that.

Why do I have a vertical front grip? Because it provides a reference point for my hand, as well as giving me another control surface to manipulate the weapon with. It enhances function.

Folding stock? Not me, but some people do so they can stow the weapon much easier in their vehicle, etc.

Self proclaimed MMA fighter? No, but I did formerly practice multiple martial arts as well as currently working out 5-7 days a week. Why? You only get one body. Care for it. As to the martial arts, I enjoyed it, and it taught me a lot of life lessons as well as how to defend myself. It has come in handy at work as well as in my personal life.

As to the training...why do you think the 2nd Amendment exists? It's not for sports or hunting. It's for defense of life and liberty. I train to the highest standards I can find. That doesn't mean "pulling the trigger as fast as I can", but it DOES mean rapid engagement with accountability. What do you think a firearm is for? Looking at? NO. It's for using, and all the cool gear (see above) in the world won't make up for some 300# out of shape pud who chicken-wings their arm out and takes 5 minutes aiming when the chips are down and you have to shoot that charging boar, or home invader, or IPSC target, or whatever your real-world application is.

Here are two examples of me properly using my gear, as outlined above:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9beSeCvRMlk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ue9GogT7Bs
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Old 08-19-2015, 11:46 PM
 
1,247 posts, read 1,034,927 times
Reputation: 630
I don't know. I do admit I see tons of people, dressed in camouflage type clothing. Maybe they are soo proud of the genocide the United States committed to itself. Remember we have 2001 and these days are not the 1990's.
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Old 08-20-2015, 12:28 AM
Status: "Gone hunting until December!" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Lost in Montana *recalculating*...
10,945 posts, read 14,584,566 times
Reputation: 11404
I wonder how many tactical dress guys actually served in the military. I for one am a veteran, and am friends with a lot of vets, and we typically don't dress up and pretend. We just shoot. In fact- 3-4 of the guys I hang out with are vet's- we talk more about reloading data and long range shooting (with hunting in mind) than anything else.

Of course not saying it's bad- but it does make me wonder. Lot's of vet's out here- the only camo you see is usually during archery season.

There are some guys I know that are serving in law enforcement roles- and of course they have their gear at work, but other than that- nah.

Last edited by Threerun; 08-20-2015 at 12:40 AM..
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Old 08-20-2015, 01:39 AM
 
Location: In a state of mind
5,998 posts, read 6,357,816 times
Reputation: 11253
I am an instructor. I am a vet. I don't wear tacticool or cammo gear. I do wear a professional shirt and levis, sometimes shorts (it's hot in AZ). I wear a belt holster, usually kydex Bladetech or similar. I don't own a thigh holster. I do own a tac vest for carrying AR mags in a tac class, but I've only used it a couple of times. I usually just shove extra mags in my hip pocket.

I shoot human targets. The poster kind, not live... . At least I hope not live.
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