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Old 04-19-2018, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,586 posts, read 11,837,023 times
Reputation: 10545

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Might consider buying rather than casting bullets. At 8 cents a piece, it's hard to cast a bullet for that unless you consider your labor and energy used to heat the lead as a nothing. American Reloading has the 380 95gr Leatherheads on sale for 42 bucks for 500, delivered to your door. For the 9mm, might take a real close look at the 124gr V Crowns. Remember the Black Talons? This bullet opens up just like a Talon only it loses less than 5% of it weight in ballistic gel. They come out of my Kimbers and Jerichos real good with a stiff load of Power Pistol. If you've never dealt with American reloading, they sell mostly pulled bullets. Some will have mixed bullet weights of the same style bullet. Some is new stock that they bought a HUGE quantity of so they could sell it cheap. They occasionally have some extreme bullets for sale like copper solids for pistols, twin cavity hollow points, etc. I get a lot of my plinking stuff from them and sometimes buy their premium bullets, like the 10mm HST 180gr Fusion bullet. Prices are delivered.
https://americanreloading.com/en/9mm...ead-500ct.html
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Old 04-19-2018, 09:31 PM
 
Location: Metro Seattle Area - Born and Raised
412 posts, read 201,181 times
Reputation: 1254
I have two Beretta 84 pistols, a 84BB and a 84FS. I love them and yes, they're big by today's standards for a .380 ACP, but without any doubt, superior pistols by even today's standards... Without any question!!

As you stated and backed up by others, its all about the ammunition... As long as you're using quality/premium JHP rounds, you'll be good to go. Also, with the low recoil, your follow up shots will be far quicker and I rather hit a target with two JHP .380 rounds than say a single .40 S&W round.

"AND" to be honest, they're simply sexy with those classic lines from yesteryear!! Heck, I also love my 1970s 8-shot Smith & Wesson Model 39-2 9mm pistol too.

Last edited by bergun; 04-19-2018 at 09:40 PM..
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Old 05-19-2018, 08:02 PM
 
Location: Southwest
1,533 posts, read 942,403 times
Reputation: 1079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Lee View Post
A friend of mine shot a rather large man who was robbing him multiple times with his .380, the perp had a 9mm, both men emptied their firearms and around a minute or so later the perp fell, trouble was that in the meantime he had hit my friend a few times and emptied his firearm of 9 rounds and was still pulling the trigger before finally falling, luckily the perp was using weakly loaded reloads and only had a 8 shot firearm or my friend would have likely been killed, he survived and the perp died, moral of the story is that my friend from that day forward carried a .357. IMO 9mm is the minimum caliber a person should carry, I had told my friend that months before the shooting, it took seeing how little damage a .380 did to a man in real life to convince him.
If your friend had hollow points loaded in his .380 and placed 1 or more shots well, things would have gone better if he had used round nose fmj ammo. Hollow point ammo just not penetrate enough in that caliber.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy in Wyoming View Post
Bayard made a vest pocket model in .380 over a hundred years ago. No one wanted it. Most people considered the .380 to be too heavy for the PPK; the .32 was far more popular. At the other end of the scale, few PPK buyers selected the .25.
The .32 with European ammo should provide sufficient penetration. American ammo, no.
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Old 05-20-2018, 01:58 AM
 
Location: Florida & Cebu, Philippines
2,808 posts, read 2,235,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curiousgeorge5 View Post
If your friend had hollow points loaded in his .380 and placed 1 or more shots well, things would have gone better if he had used round nose fmj ammo. Hollow point ammo just not penetrate enough in that caliber.
My friend had the best hollow point bullets of the time in his Walther PPK/S and the kill shot that eventually killed the perp hit the perps liver and tore it up, so more than deep enough, and several other shots hit the perp deep enough to kill him, the problem I was pointing out is, it is not whether the bad guy will die or not, it is about how fast the bad guy stops his attack, does he die or fall before he gets to kill us, or drop to the ground as close to immediately as possible, the larger and heavier the bullet that is traveling at a decent speed is, the more blood loss, thus the faster the person hit with it will cease his or her attack.

An ice pick will kill a person, only problem is that they may have plenty of time to kill the person who stabbed them with the ice pick before they die.
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Old 05-20-2018, 12:32 PM
 
4,756 posts, read 8,381,946 times
Reputation: 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Lee View Post
My friend had the best hollow point bullets of the time in his Walther PPK/S and the kill shot that eventually killed the perp hit the perps liver and tore it up, so more than deep enough, and several other shots hit the perp deep enough to kill him, the problem I was pointing out is, it is not whether the bad guy will die or not, it is about how fast the bad guy stops his attack, does he die or fall before he gets to kill us, or drop to the ground as close to immediately as possible, the larger and heavier the bullet that is traveling at a decent speed is, the more blood loss, thus the faster the person hit with it will cease his or her attack.

An ice pick will kill a person, only problem is that they may have plenty of time to kill the person who stabbed them with the ice pick before they die.
An excellent point made here. There’s a difference between “killing “ versus “stopping” someone.

A .22LR will kill, it almost killed Reagan and undoubtedly will if it was fired from a rifle. But we’re not interested in “killing” someone, instead; we want to stop our adversary from aggression toward us. This is an important legal difference in the court of laws.

Physically this is best accomplished if you can immobilized his central nervous system (CNS) by hitting adversary center of mass (COM) with deep penetration and as wide diameter as possible to have the highest probability of causing massive blood loss thereby inducing a lack of supply of oxygen to his brain. A wide diameter can be achieved with either a large caliber bullet, or a effective hollow point expansion, or a combination of both. Penetration can be achieved by a combination of bullet mass and velocity. A higher mass retains its momentum when encountering resistance in body muscles and will break bones instead of being deflected. Of course, shot placement is key to all these. You gotta hit where you aim.

For example, a .357 magnum is an excellent round based on above criteria. But if you can not hit where you aim, then none of these matter. You’re better off carrying something you can hit where you aim.

A .380, .38 spcl, 9mm, .357 magnum, and a .357 Sig all have same bullet diameter, but very different “thumping” power. I intentionally avoid using the word “stopping” power as there are people who argue there is no such thing in a handgun. I believe there is but that’s a debate in a separate thread.

Don’t want to start a caliber war here but know the strengths & limitations of the gun/ caliber you choose to carry. It’s only a tool and how you use that tool can determine the outcome.

Last edited by HB2HSV; 05-20-2018 at 01:00 PM..
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Old 05-21-2018, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,713,043 times
Reputation: 11470
Quote:
Originally Posted by curiousgeorge5 View Post
If your friend had hollow points loaded in his .380 and placed 1 or more shots well, things would have gone better if he had used round nose fmj ammo. Hollow point ammo just not penetrate enough in that caliber.



The .32 with European ammo should provide sufficient penetration. American ammo, no.
The older European made .32 ACP pistols will not function reliably with most American ammo, particularly stuff like the Winchester Silvertip - Silvertip is excellent ammo and it's exactly what the doctor ordered for guns like the Seecamp.

But, look at the slide of a PP or PPK, then look at the slide of a Beretta Tomcat. See how much heavier and bigger the PP/PPK slide is?

European ammo is loaded to a different spec, and is a good bit hotter than American ammo.
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Old 05-21-2018, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Southwest
1,533 posts, read 942,403 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
But, look at the slide of a PP or PPK, then look at the slide of a Beretta Tomcat. See how much heavier and bigger the PP/PPK slide is?

European ammo is loaded to a different spec, and is a good bit hotter than American ammo.

Yeppers about the slides of the mentioned models.

If my memory is accurate or semi-accurate, American .32 is worth about 130 ft./lbs. One European brand makes about 160 ft./lbs., another 175 ft./lbs!
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Old 05-22-2018, 11:29 AM
 
Location: East Helena, MT
763 posts, read 478,609 times
Reputation: 2003
The first pistol I ever purchased on my own was a Walther PK380. I have shot the crap out of that gun, and it has never failed with quality ammo. I have had some fail to chamber with cheap blazer brass for target practice, but never a failure to eject. A quick tap on the slide gets the round in and off I go. My wife loves to shoot the pistol and is very accurate with it. I wouldn't hesitate to use this caliber to defend myself.


I'm not a caliber snob. Eventually, I would love to have one pistol in just about every caliber made. My next purchase will be a Kel-Tec P32. I have always wanted to own a .32 ACP and I have seen many reviews that really like the P32. I also think that this will be a good step up from a .22 for my kids.
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:10 AM
 
Location: Round Rock, Texas
7,824 posts, read 7,816,354 times
Reputation: 6230
I had a KT P32 (early model with hard chrome slide). It was a reliable gun, soft shooting and really tiny. I regret trading it off.
Didn't care much for my P3AT - replaced it with an LCP.


Here is my latest .32..... the 6 shot Ruger SP101 in .327 Federal Magnum. According to the ballistics tables it has a stopping power somewhere between the 9mm & .357 Magnum. I like it.


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Old 05-24-2018, 05:41 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,388 posts, read 42,713,043 times
Reputation: 11470
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
Might consider buying rather than casting bullets. At 8 cents a piece, it's hard to cast a bullet for that unless you consider your labor and energy used to heat the lead as a nothing. American Reloading has the 380 95gr Leatherheads on sale for 42 bucks for 500, delivered to your door. For the 9mm, might take a real close look at the 124gr V Crowns. Remember the Black Talons? This bullet opens up just like a Talon only it loses less than 5% of it weight in ballistic gel. They come out of my Kimbers and Jerichos real good with a stiff load of Power Pistol. If you've never dealt with American reloading, they sell mostly pulled bullets. Some will have mixed bullet weights of the same style bullet. Some is new stock that they bought a HUGE quantity of so they could sell it cheap. They occasionally have some extreme bullets for sale like copper solids for pistols, twin cavity hollow points, etc. I get a lot of my plinking stuff from them and sometimes buy their premium bullets, like the 10mm HST 180gr Fusion bullet. Prices are delivered.
https://americanreloading.com/en/9mm...ead-500ct.html

Thanks for the link. Usually I end up casting my own to get the correct diameter to fit the chamber throat, that can be critical to cast bullet success. That and, yeah, I actually like making my own.

Anymore you can get custom molds for little more than cherry-cut ones, outfits like Accurate will lathe-bore the diameter you want, usually it ends up within a half-thousandth or so, if you use the alloy you told them you intended to use (Linotype for example casts bigger than wheel weight alloy)
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