Planning to Relocate to Chesapeake/VA Beach Area (Virginia Beach, Richmond: oceanfront, crime)

[Rita Mordio]

Originally Posted by Randomdude

1. You show me a 20 something on their own, and Ill show you someone who is spending over 50% of their gross income on housing.

2. Manual labor pays dirt, and there actually is little demand for college degreed people, hence the brain drain of the area. Oh by the way, why dont you go to Monster, Careerbuilder, or the Virginia Pilot, and count up how many jobs have been posted in the last month in the accounting/finance field that pay over 35k, and require less then 5 years of experience. I bet you that you dont even need two hands. Guess how many people graduated with bachelors degrees concentrating in Finance or Accounting in the ODU Spring '04 class? Over 100. I bet, even given all of them stayed here to this day, all 100 of them would not even be able to find an accounting job, forget about one that pays remotely close to a living wage. It took me until 2 years after I graduated to find a job in accounting, and thats only because I accepted such a low salary that they couldnt refuse.

3. Id gladly move, like Ive posted numerous times, Im currently taking donations for the help Randomdude move to a real city fund. If you arent willing to contribute, then you can either listen to me complain about the area, or ignore my complaining, until I can save up enough to leave on my own. Thats completely up to you.


4. Lets see, what beach isnt dirty? Certainly not the whole of the Virginia Beach ocean front. Maybe its cleaner down by Sandbridge? I certainly know you arent talking about any of the public beaches along the Chesapeake Bay or in Hampton or Newport News.

In response:

1. It is entirely possible for the first few years, a new person in the "real work world" would be paying out the ying-yang (50% or more) on a place to call home. However, most apartment complexes have the 2.5 or 3 times rule. Your income cannot be any less than 2.5 or 3 times the rent. So if you are looking at an $800/month place, you must make somewhere between 2000 and 2400 a month to be considered.

2. For this, I would definitely have to say that the current state of the economy is making it worse. However, to my knowledge, entry level positions never truly pay well. That's why some of us do the entry level work while attending college. Studies show that those who do entry level work in their field while still in college tend to do better than those who do no work or an unrelated job.

Like if you want to become a radio manager, getting an internship at the radio station while in school gets you experience and your foot in the door.

3. I will have to agree with you on the "pack up and move" attitude. It's very expensive to do so. I'll happily debate you on the issues until you have the money to move to a real city.

4. I forgot to mention that. All beaches are dirty. Seeing as how I spent many, many summers in Florida - even the beaches down in Miami and Daytona can be quite the dirties. The sand is different, and the water feels different... but without proper maintenance 24/7 and the abundance of ill-mannered tourists and locals, any beach can be disgusting.

But one of my favorites has to be over in Huntington Park - Newport News.


And to the poster who mentioned the list of activities, the "list" persay is a sticky right on the front page. The very top thread. Mr. Williamsburg, myself, and several other posters contribute to that thread. As of late, I've been a little busy with my day-to-day activities... but will do my best to keep it updated. Also, right now, there's not too much buzz about events in the area. It should truly start picking back up somewhere around the 20th of March (First day of Spring).

In fact, I have a few hours to burn... so I shall go check with my sources on some events for the bored this weekend.

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by Kuharai

In response:

1. It is entirely possible for the first few years, a new person in the "real work world" would be paying out the ying-yang (50% or more) on a place to call home. However, most apartment complexes have the 2.5 or 3 times rule. Your income cannot be any less than 2.5 or 3 times the rent. So if you are looking at an $800/month place, you must make somewhere between 2000 and 2400 a month to be considered.

2. For this, I would definitely have to say that the current state of the economy is making it worse. However, to my knowledge, entry level positions never truly pay well. That's why some of us do the entry level work while attending college. Studies show that those who do entry level work in their field while still in college tend to do better than those who do no work or an unrelated job.

Like if you want to become a radio manager, getting an internship at the radio station while in school gets you experience and your foot in the door.

3. I will have to agree with you on the "pack up and move" attitude. It's very expensive to do so. I'll happily debate you on the issues until you have the money to move to a real city.

4. I forgot to mention that. All beaches are dirty. Seeing as how I spent many, many summers in Florida - even the beaches down in Miami and Daytona can be quite the dirties. The sand is different, and the water feels different... but without proper maintenance 24/7 and the abundance of ill-mannered tourists and locals, any beach can be disgusting.

1. It really depends how desperate a property is to keep up its occupancy rate, now doesnt it? I know of a number of people in apartments who are shelling out way more then 30% of their income on rent. Additionally, they always measure "gross income", which is way different then net.

2. Internships arent available to everyone. First thing, they actually have to exist and exist in your field. Second thing you actually have to have the free time or ability to be low paid or not paid at all. Some people must work full time while in school, they do not have the option to mess with an internship. Third, the internship actually has to have some play on anything. For instance, if the job requires a bachelors degree, and equates that to 30k, you likely arent getting any more then that simply by having some intern experience, although, you may actually get the job over someone who doesnt, which is the largest benefit of internships.


3. Well, Im getting pretty close to there. Im hopeful to have Virginia in the rear view no later then Spring 2010.

[naomisday]

Randomdude,

Sounds like the VB area just really isn't the place for you...I have learned a lot
reading your posts...

I know it is your opinion....

Where are you trying to move to?

[naomisday]

SiestaBay,

How is it in Charlottesville?

The beaches are dirty? Too bad....

[Freefreq]

Saying the government data, the average salary for jobs in Norfolk, Virginia is $32,692, and the median income of households in Norfolk was $36,920. You expect to walk out of college make 30K in Norfolk ??

Not a good chance there Randomdude and the thing is if you know while your in college its going to suck being here for what you went to college for you do have the choice to pack up and move.

People dont go and get an underwater ocean basketweaving degree and then expect to find a good paying job for that field in Kansas.............Come on

You know what pays good before you go to school and you know what fields are stable so why go and get a degree for something you know sucks once you get out ????????????

Its like teachers.............LOL They know the pay isnt all that Great but they do it anyways and then complain about the pay which they knew before they went to school for that type of job.

In reality a teachers pay is pretty good though many say it isnt. Look at all the time they have off. Christmas/Spring Break and then the summer but with a couple years under their belt they are making 30K easy and are off 4 months out of the year.

Teacher salaries in Norfolk

minimum: $27,640 this is right out of school and they are OFF for 4 months of the year.

maximum: $73,731


If you go to get a degree just to say you have one like say a Bachlors of Science what exactly do you expect to get when you get out ?? Whats does that degree have to do with anything other then the fact you can say you have a 4 year degree in NOTHING.

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by naomisday

Randomdude,

Sounds like the VB area just really isn't the place for you...I have learned a lot
reading your posts...

I know it is your opinion....

Where are you trying to move to?

Well, I really want to go to Indianapolis, IN......however, Cincinnati, OH has now become a possibility due to some concerns my g/f, who probably will end up my wife, who will be moving with me, has about Indianapolis.

Likely, one of the two will end up our destination.

[naomisday]

Randomdude,

I had a co-worker from Indy..she liked it, but she liked the Bay Area better...

I am considering possibly moving South..if I do most likely it will be Nashville....I thought of
VA as well..., and at one time I considered NC...I decided against that after visiting numerous
times...

I met a of people from Cincinnati,OH in Nashville.... Sounds like the Military is the Force in
the Hampton Roads Area...if you aren't in that in general its hard to live there....

Good luck on wherever you end up....nothing is worse then living where you don't like....

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by Freefreq

Saying the government data, the average salary for jobs in Norfolk, Virginia is $32,692, and the median income of households in Norfolk was $36,920. You expect to walk out of college make 30K in Norfolk ??

No, I didnt expect to make 30k walking out of college. Thats my argument though. Here, with houses averaging over 200k, recent college grads are making 20-25k. What is that? The national average salary for a fresh accounting graduate is over 45k. In the Nofolk area, you are looking at half of that. Why would anyone want to stay for that? I can go to a place like Indianapolis or Cincinnati, automatically get a 15-20% raise, have plenty of room for career growth, AND have a bigger house in a better neighborhood for half the price.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

Not a good chance there Randomdude and the thing is if you know while your in college its going to suck being here for what you went to college for you do have the choice to pack up and move.

Actually, things developed while I was in my last years of college that harmed me greatly. My original intention WAS to move to Charlotte as soon as I graduated. Unfortunatley, I became ill, lost my job because of it, and went through most of my savings. This pretty much left me stuck here in the Norfolk area.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

People dont go and get an underwater ocean basketweaving degree and then expect to find a good paying job for that field in Kansas.............Come on

Finance and Accounting is hardly basket weaving, in fact, accountant is one of the most in demand positions in the nation. Every single business needs accountants, I dont care what they are in the business of.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

You know what pays good before you go to school and you know what fields are stable so why go and get a degree for something you know sucks once you get out ????????????

Because I wasnt planning my whole life around staying in Norfolk, VA, which I wasnt thrilled with BEFORE I graduated college and entered the "real world". Unfortunate circumstances trapped me here for longer then I expected.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

Its like teachers.............LOL They know the pay isnt all that Great but they do it anyways and then complain about the pay which they knew before they went to school for that type of job.

Its not exactly the same. Teachers, universally, arent paid great. Its not a regional or local phenomenon. In most major cities, accountants are heavily in demand. Virginia Beach is very unique amongst this group because it has no corporate presence, and a majority of the business is small mom and pops or government related.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

In reality a teachers pay is pretty good though many say it isnt. Look at all the time they have off. Christmas/Spring Break and then the summer but with a couple years under their belt they are making 30K easy and are off 4 months out of the year.

Teacher salaries in Norfolk

minimum: $27,640 this is right out of school and they are OFF for 4 months of the year.

maximum: $73,731

I agree teachers dont have it too bad in some locales. In some areas, like Virginia Beach, they make more then a good many other degree fields. However, in a place like say, NYC, or Los Angeles, teachers are outright buried by other fields. Additionally, teacher salary tends to get bogged down, while in general, other fields compensation exponentially grows with experience.

Originally Posted by Freefreq

If you go to get a degree just to say you have one like say a Bachlors of Science what exactly do you expect to get when you get out ?? Whats does that degree have to do with anything other then the fact you can say you have a 4 year degree in NOTHING.

You wont get an argument from me there. If I had a bachelors degree in pencil shaving, I wouldnt have anything to say, because, the employment outlook for that is the same every where. However, my complaint is that a number of nationally VERY employable degree fields, here, have no demand, and are poorly compensated.

That gets magnified by the high cost of living. It kind of makes it almost impossible for younger people to get by. Is that really a place we should aspire to have? A place that has run its newest crop of bright minds off to other cities?

How is it dispite being an inland city, and only half the physical size of Virginia Beach, and only having 60k more people then Virginia Beach in 1970, Charlotte, NC now has about 200k more people?

How is it that Raleigh, NC, dispite having 1/3 of Norfolks population and roughly the same land space 3 decades ago, now has close to twice Norfolks population?

Ill tell you why

1. They both have the foresight to construct a viable downtown. Norfolk has an imitation one, and Virginia Beach didnt bother.

2. They both spent large amounts of money in fostering education and have constructed top shelf local universities across the state. The Hampton Roads area has a bunch of commuter schools that dump out students that are largely ignored regionally, and often even rediculed locally for their average quality. ODU has made some steps in recent years, but dispite having a high number of schools, and a huge metro area, only William and Mary has the remotest of prestige.

3. They both, primarily Charlotte, have invested heavily in public transportation, including light rail and street car/trolley systems. They also have excellent intercity train service. What does Virginia have? A broken down fleet of buses, gridlock and constant protest of rail.

4. They have actively pursued business. Charlotte and Raleigh are able to fill their sky scrapers with actual legit business. What is towncenter in Virginia Beach filled with? You guessed it, retail, restaurants, hotels, and overpriced housing. It really is a joke. The Hampton Roads area has made little to no effort to pursue legit civilian business. Instead, they depend on, and foster, government investment and tourism. Thats great. I wonder what happens to the area if Norfolk Naval Base ever moved, or work dried up for Northrop Gruman.......


5. Both have maintained a viable supply of affordable housing. Hampton Roads leadership largely could not care less about affordable housing, and prefers the high tax revenue from ever increasing property taxes. In fact, Norfolk has been actively destroying low income housing and replacing it with completely unaffordable luxury housing. Virginia Beach has continously gave favor to builders of McMansions.

Hampton Roads is an exact blue print of what a growing area should NOT do.

[Randomdude]

Originally Posted by naomisday

Randomdude,

I had a co-worker from Indy..she liked it, but she liked the Bay Area better...

I am considering possibly moving South..if I do most likely it will be Nashville....I thought of
VA as well..., and at one time I considered NC...I decided against that after visiting numerous
times...

I met a of people from Cincinnati,OH in Nashville.... Sounds like the Military is the Force in
the Hampton Roads Area...if you aren't in that in general its hard to live there....

Good luck on wherever you end up....nothing is worse then living where you don't like....

I visited Raleigh once and thought it was nice. My girlfriend does not want to go any further south though. She has had bad experiences in rural North Florida and in West Virginia (which is technically north, but she equates it with the south). So her opinion has been completely destroyed.

[naomisday]

Randomdude,

I don't know if you would like living in NC---more jobs in NC probably, but it is
still pretty slow there....

I haven't been to Charlotte in 5 years, but I have been multiple times.....it might be better
then Hampton Roads for you..BUT I don't think you would be really satisfied there either....

Charlotte seems like it is really a place for families...I am glad they got some Public Transportation...

NC is a Beautiful State though....

Have you thought of going to other parts of VA----Alexandria, Charlottesville?