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DavidAMIs, I'm 52 and can relate to what you're saying. At 21, one of my best friends and I used to discuss the things you're talking about. He took the adventurous path, living in many different places and never becoming interested in material possessions. I took the safer path, going to college, pursuing a conventional career, and buying a house. He married young, had a daughter, and got divorced. I married late, took on two stepsons, and am still happily married. I went through a period of regret that I didn't live a more adventurous life when I was younger. He went through a period of regret that he wasn't more conscientious about preparing for his future and that he didn't have a house and investments to show for his life's work. As a result, I loosened up, found a career I love, and am having more fun with my life. He started saving and investing money and is moving into a house with his long-time girlfriend, and he intends to stay there for most of the rest of his life, using it as a base for his travels. We realized that, for the most part, we've lived the lives we wanted to and that are best suited to our temperaments. We're both happy.
So my advice to you is to pursue your dreams. You're young and unencumbered, and there's still plenty of time to adjust your course later. I agree with the poster who said that it's usually easier to finish college while you're young and don't have other obligations on your time, but I'd add that it's only true if you want to go to college and know what you want to study. If not, you won't be motivated, and you'll be wasting your time and money. If you decide you want to go to college later in life, it might be more difficult logistically, but you'll be motivated, you'll enjoy it more, and you'll do better. I went back to college in my late 20s for a second bachelor's degree, and in my late 40s for a master's degree, and I enjoyed college much more than I did at age 18, when I was directionless and went simply because it was an expectation.
Being free, poor, and unencumbered can be great when you're in your 20s and have the right attitude (which you seem to), but for most people I've talked with, it gets old as you get older. My adventurous friend didn't complete college, but he developed skills in the advertising business, and he became a successful freelance advertiser and, later, web designer. He's always earned a good living, but he spent his money on travel and experiences rather than on material possessions. He's gone through periods where he was dirt poor, mainly to see what it was like, and concluded that there's no virtue in poverty. We both had artistic aspirations in our 20s, and we despised the business world, but eventually we realized that everyone is in business one way or another, because everyone has to make a living, and only a few manage to make a living solely from their artistic talents. It's more a matter of luck than talent, and most of us end up pursuing our artistic interests as hobbies, while earning our livings through more practical and conventional means. It can actually be more fun that way, because your art can be exactly what you want it to be.
As you get older, your outlook is going to change on some things, and not on others. Don't be afraid to go with what feels right. My 21-year-old self never wanted to have a conventional day job, a mortgage, a wife, kids, pets, and other things that would "tie me down," and probably would be aghast at what he/I became. But my 21-year-old self didn't understand the richness that can come from so-called responsibilities. As Kris Kristofferson famously sang, "Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose." Of course, we each have to find out own balance of freedom and responsibility, and that balance is bound to change throughout life.
If there's one piece of advice I wish I'd listened to when I was your age, it would be to start a retirement fund. I didn't, assuming I'd make the money later, and that I was going to become rich enough to retire early through my art. But money has never been a big motivator for me, so I didn't do what I needed to do to retire early, and most people don't. I make a good salary, but I'm going to have to keep working until I'm 65 or 70. So is my adventurous friend. I read once that, if you put away $x per month from age 20 through 30 and then stop, by the time you're 65, it will be almost equivalent to what you'd have if you put away the same $x per month from age 30 to 65. That's the power of compounded interest. We all have to do something -- I never wanted to play bingo and shuffleboard in a Florida retirement community -- but money in the bank gives you the freedom to do what you want to do.
I wish you the best of luck! You sound like your heart and values are in the right place.
David, I think your posts are great. A few years ago, I came over here myself in what started out as extended woofing and then led to a permanent position on a homestead. People want us to spend our young years overworking in hopes of a far-away retirement that may never come. I know many people who got a college degree and are working low-wage jobs or are unemployed and encumbered with massive amounts of student loan debt that makes sure they will never be free to take a year off and travel. They don't know the intricacies of year-round tropical agriculture either; of growing fruits and vegetables and living with the land. These are valuable skills for the future I think, as is exploring your music.
So follow your plan, I'm sure it will lead to something; as you seem like someone who is eager to integrate these experiences into your life instead of treating them as a temporary aberration. I think the homeless guys in their 60's likely had early lives that didn't give them a real chance to go to college and get stable employment in the first place.
Keep us in the loop. Alwyas exciting to see how others are making progress in their move.
I will definitely keep everyone in the loop throughout the year. If anyone is interested I've actually started a YouTube page at www.youtube.com/davidamis where I plan on chronicling the months leading up to my departure. I'm gonna be doing a few things before actually settling down onto a farm in Hawaii. So stay tuned if you're interested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hp1167
I was a philosophy major in college.
Don't pay to get that degree unless you supplement it with something practical. I'm serious.
You can be happy in Hawaii. That's what is important. Just know what you are giving up to do it. For many it's a fine tradeoff.
I agree completely! I keep having to justify my decisions to not go and it's easy to justify this one. In the meantime, I've been listening to Philosophy podcasts, reading books by Camus, Kierkagaard, and other books on ethics and morality. If you don't mind me asking, Hp1167, what do you do?
HonuMan and Vaedrem, thanks so much for the input! I will continue to look into the retirement thing as I've started to put money into my 401k at my job and I am super excited about getting to the islands and learning about sustainable living and giving back to the community. Lately I've been really into the idea of starting a band. I don't want to be big but I'd like to get together and make music with people which could be cool down there for sure. Last time I was there, my ex's uncle played a gig at a bar in Wailua. They were The Vibe Tribe and they played a lot of oldies and originals. Was a great experience!
If you can transfer your Whole Foods job to Hawaii, that sounds like a great starting point.
For investing, if you have a Roth account - whether it is just a savings account or a stock market account or whatever sort of account, what the Roth part of it means you don't have to pay income tax on the interest when you pull it out of the account. If you had a Roth savings account tied into a stock account and put bits and pieces of money away into the account - or had them take 10% of your paycheck and put it into the account - then after it gathered up for awhile, you'd be able to invest the savings account into stocks. Personally, I like Hawaiian Electric, (HE) they pay good dividends and have got the legislature by the short and curlies so they always turn a profit. However, before putting real money down on stocks, make up a virtual $10,000 stock account with the Yahoo Financial webpage. Make virtual trades, just as if you were using real money. When you can consistently end up with more money than when you started, then take the real money from the savings account you've been saving and put it into a real trading account.
Money is a bizarre concept as well as a useful tool - otherwise we'd all be running around with chickens in our pockets to trade back and forth. Learning about finances is something which can make your life a whole lot easier. Also, if you have the money in the bank, then you won't have to finance things which will save you tons of money overall. There is a website about "extreme early retirement" which has a lot of good financial advice for folks, although he's more about saving it than making it.
I also agree don't chase a college degree because its the thing to do if you are middle class.
I did this, my dad talked me out of what i wanted to do and I gave into what he thought was best and went to college. I studied history, i enjoyed it. But it gave me nothing i would of been better off if the 100's of thousands that spent on my degree was just given to me. Now here i am in Thailand trying to figure out wtf i want to do and have no idea. Being lost and 27 is not fun. So follow what you want to do, don't let other tell you what to do its just a waste of time.
I agree completely! I keep having to justify my decisions to not go and it's easy to justify this one. In the meantime, I've been listening to Philosophy podcasts, reading books by Camus, Kierkagaard, and other books on ethics and morality. If you don't mind me asking, Hp1167, what do you do?
I graduated with the intention of becoming a professor of philosophy. When I realized the obstacles and risks of that pursuit (6-8 years more of schooling + dissertation/book + taking adjunct jobs wherever I could find them + intense competition) I decided to go to law school instead.
However, during the application process I quickly realized I could never be a lawyer, so I reentered graduate school to get a degree in environmental and natural resource policy.
Now... I really don't know.
Part of me wants to move to Hawaii too, similar to yourself. I have friends in Maui and I think it could work out. However, part of me likes the lifestyle I have in Boise and the opportunities (besides career) I have, and I'm not sure I want to risk a ton just to be close to friends and live on Maui.
I know that all of my friends there are "underemployed" - meaning, they have advanced degrees and are waiters or work in a hotel. Except for one, who someone snagged the greatest job ever. But that's just luck.
It's always 50/50. I think that having a happy life trumps everything else. What makes you happy?
HonuMan and Vaedrem, thanks so much for the input! I will continue to look into the retirement thing as I've started to put money into my 401k at my job and I am super excited about getting to the islands and learning about sustainable living and giving back to the community.
There is a big environmental movement in Hawaii. Actor Jason Scott Lee lives there and is heavily involved, as is local radio personality Jacqueline Rosetti (also known as Skylark). My younger stepson is your age and is interested in getting involved, which for him probably would mean getting a degree in Environmental Science. (We live in Oregon, but my wife and her sons are from Hawaii.)
Quote:
Lately I've been really into the idea of starting a band. I don't want to be big but I'd like to get together and make music with people which could be cool down there for sure. Last time I was there, my ex's uncle played a gig at a bar in Wailua. They were The Vibe Tribe and they played a lot of oldies and originals. Was a great experience!
Hawaii has a thriving music scene. My older stepson moved back to the Big Island for four years and played in a couple of local bands. They played at bars and weddings. The vast majority of musicians, even the locally famous ones, still need some sort of day job to supplement their income. And, of course, plenty of people do it strictly for fun, with no intention of trying to make money.
I also agree don't chase a college degree because its the thing to do if you are middle class.
I did this, my dad talked me out of what i wanted to do and I gave into what he thought was best and went to college. I studied history, i enjoyed it. But it gave me nothing i would of been better off if the 100's of thousands that spent on my degree was just given to me. Now here i am in Thailand trying to figure out wtf i want to do and have no idea. Being lost and 27 is not fun. So follow what you want to do, don't let other tell you what to do its just a waste of time.
How'd you get to Thailand? What are you doing there? I think having a basic idea of where you want to be keeps you out of that state of confusion. It also keeps you looking forward to something. I have ideas about what I want to do after Hawaii. Hawaii is not the be all, end all but a step in a journey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hp1167
I graduated with the intention of becoming a professor of philosophy. When I realized the obstacles and risks of that pursuit (6-8 years more of schooling + dissertation/book + taking adjunct jobs wherever I could find them + intense competition) I decided to go to law school instead.
However, during the application process I quickly realized I could never be a lawyer, so I reentered graduate school to get a degree in environmental and natural resource policy.
Now... I really don't know.
Part of me wants to move to Hawaii too, similar to yourself. I have friends in Maui and I think it could work out. However, part of me likes the lifestyle I have in Boise and the opportunities (besides career) I have, and I'm not sure I want to risk a ton just to be close to friends and live on Maui.
I know that all of my friends there are "underemployed" - meaning, they have advanced degrees and are waiters or work in a hotel. Except for one, who someone snagged the greatest job ever. But that's just luck.
It's always 50/50. I think that having a happy life trumps everything else. What makes you happy?
Yeah... I could never spend that much time in school and pay to basically think all day. Plus, I'm not much of a writer. I can barely articulate my own thoughts when I speak. I believe that if you know things are momentary then choosing to be happy becomes easy and most things will not bring you down. I couldn't tell you what makes me happy since I choose to be happy and I don't expect things to make me happy, but what I think will sustain my choice to be happy is finding love, being somewhere beautiful, traveling, and doing something that has purpose and helps people. I think I've been so content lately with my life because I know that I'm working towards achieving a happy life and knowing reinforces my choice even before I've attained anything.
Yeah... LOL!
Quote:
Originally Posted by HonuMan
There is a big environmental movement in Hawaii. Actor Jason Scott Lee lives there and is heavily involved, as is local radio personality Jacqueline Rosetti (also known as Skylark). My younger stepson is your age and is interested in getting involved, which for him probably would mean getting a degree in Environmental Science. (We live in Oregon, but my wife and her sons are from Hawaii.)
Hawaii has a thriving music scene. My older stepson moved back to the Big Island for four years and played in a couple of local bands. They played at bars and weddings. The vast majority of musicians, even the locally famous ones, still need some sort of day job to supplement their income. And, of course, plenty of people do it strictly for fun, with no intention of trying to make money.
I actually considered Environmental studies if I were to go back to school. The college I recently withdrew my admission from was Warren Wilson in North Carolina. They're big on sustainability. All this "green" stuff that the government is trying to promote amidst a divided nation is actually looking to be a booming business. I was just never a technical guy so I could never imagine myself learning the logistics of a whole area. I mostly like to learn just enough about something where I can handle the basics on my own and if I want to learn more I'll look into something on my own time. That's exactly what happened with music. I don't have to be a fluent theorist and reader of notation to be able to write a song. I just like singing and performing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotzcatz
If you can transfer your Whole Foods job to Hawaii, that sounds like a great starting point.
For investing, if you have a Roth account - whether it is just a savings account or a stock market account or whatever sort of account, what the Roth part of it means you don't have to pay income tax on the interest when you pull it out of the account. If you had a Roth savings account tied into a stock account and put bits and pieces of money away into the account - or had them take 10% of your paycheck and put it into the account - then after it gathered up for awhile, you'd be able to invest the savings account into stocks. Personally, I like Hawaiian Electric, (HE) they pay good dividends and have got the legislature by the short and curlies so they always turn a profit. However, before putting real money down on stocks, make up a virtual $10,000 stock account with the Yahoo Financial webpage. Make virtual trades, just as if you were using real money. When you can consistently end up with more money than when you started, then take the real money from the savings account you've been saving and put it into a real trading account.
Money is a bizarre concept as well as a useful tool - otherwise we'd all be running around with chickens in our pockets to trade back and forth. Learning about finances is something which can make your life a whole lot easier. Also, if you have the money in the bank, then you won't have to finance things which will save you tons of money overall. There is a website about "extreme early retirement" which has a lot of good financial advice for folks, although he's more about saving it than making it.
Around Christmas, I was talking with a family friend who said the exact same thing about money. He was talking about how the system is built to profit off of if you know how to work it and handle your money. There was a time when I actually looked into investing but I couldn't understand any of the terms and jargon. HAHA!
Seems like Maui is really environmentally ignorant. Most people on the leeward side water their lawns daily.
I'm not sure Environmental Studies is a legit major BTW. What job would you expect to get? And are you willing to learn inconvenient truths like how resource and land intensive organic agriculture is and that only industrial non-organic agriculture can feed the world?
If you're bent on staying in Hawaii I'd just grab whatever trade job you can find, learn it, do it for a few years, and then try to start your own business.
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