The 3,000,000 lb dynamic blast that tarnished East Hawaii forever (Hilo: for sale, foreclosure)

[pbmaise]

Dynamite blast....sorry about the typo in title.

1970 blast of 3,000,000 lbs of dynamite that forever changed East Hawaii.


The blast occurred on the West side of Hawaii Island and cleared the path for Kona International Airport's runway.


This is relevant to 98% of all debate about what is an “issue” about East Hawaii. The blast and new airport shifted tourism from East Hawaii to West Hawaii. Until 1970 almost all tourists came in via Hilo airport. Going to stay at the resorts on the West side was a major undertaking. One didn't even have road access till 1968.


The big new Royal Kona Resort opened up in 1968 two years before the airport and to entice people to make the long trek to Kona they were doing something sneaky:


It was called marketing.


They were telling everyone how great West Hawaii was and why they should come to West Hawaii.


After the airport opened, hotel and resort construction accelerated on the Kona side. By 2005 a full 86% of hotel rooms on the island were in Kona. Further these were big and fancy hotels which could charge more. This means that today over 90% of all tourists dollars are spent in West Hawaii. More tourists now flock to West Hawaii and it is now only natural that more decide to buy homes there. Hence the West Hawaii housing boom.



Hilo is served by 4 modest hotels, 3 date back to 1960's and 1 was built in 1975. Naturally, they don't have much money to market and they don't attract high end customers to buy expensive homes.


So..given these obvious facts think a second. There is now at least 10 to 1 more dollars invested in West Hawaii with a strong incentive to make travel and living in West Hawaii sound better. With that kind of ratio out spending East Hawaii it is a wonder anyone likes East Hawaii.


East side Hawaii people are finding themselves in the odd situation of always apologizing:


Oh..Yes it rains here..but we like the green grass and rainbows, waterfalls and gardens.
Oh..Yes some homes use catchment water...but that is because it is free, pure, and natural.
Oh..Yes it can be cooler...but most of his don't have air conditioners and like to have windows open.
Oh..Yes it is a less expensive...but that means we can afford bigger homes and larger properties.
Oh..Yes the volcano is on our side...however, the wind usually blows all the air to the West.
Oh..Yes we have few beaches..however, ours aren't crowded and we can drive over to the West.
Oh..Yes we have fewer tourists...but our restaurants offer higher quality food for less.


Do you know why we are always doing this? Simply put there is a huge economic elephant on the other side of the trying to ensure tourists and money flows their way.


Everyone stop and think a second now before you go on and on about this issue and that. Let me spearhead one issue. Rain. Rain is good people! One of the rainiest places on the planet is also the most expensive because of MARKETING. Up there in Kauai you all heard of the Princeville Resort? Right smack dap in the rainiest part of the world is a "fantastic" golf course and highly “desirable” place because it rains so much. Why is rain good there and not in Hilo? Marketing marketing.



Now I will not state there are no issues to address in East Hawaii..however..guess what people these are the same issues in most of Hawaii. There is no perfect place in Hawaii however, before writing and complaining about this or that..


Please ask yourself some questions. Is the better answer the East Side of Hawaii or the West Side of Hawaii?


Where is it more affordable to live?
Where are you more likely enjoy life without air conditioning?
Where is it less expensive to visit?
Where are the bigger farmer markets and craft fairs?
Where is the University of Hawaii?
Where is the community college?
Where is the biggest hospital?
Where are the roads bigger and less congested?
Where is the biggest new public high school?
Where is the largest private school campus in Hawaii?
Where is the newest fire station?
Where is the government center?
Where are the botantical gardens?
Where is the zoo?
Where is it easier to find parking?
Which side has the National Park?
Which side has Hawaii's largest waterfall?
Where is that canyon I always see on photos of Hawaii?
Where are the remote tropical beaches?
Which side grows more food?
Which side has more parks?
Which side has better air quality?
Which side has fewer prostitutes? (I've seen one once in Hilo..I think it was one.)


Now lets answer some bigger questions: Hint all the answers as C.


Question: Where is your home less at risk of being burned down by a natural fire?



A. Montana
B. California
C. East Hawaii in Lava Zone 1


Fact: Thousands of homes went up in smoke in California and Montana over the last 10 years. In Lava Zone 1 it was 0.


Question: Where does home insurance cost more?


A. Miami
B. San Franciso
C. Pahoa
Fact: Miami and Florida's hurricane insurance policies have become incredible high for good reason. 4 struck in one year alone. Not a single hurricane in recorded history has hit the Big Island. One theory and demonstrated fact is Hawaii's tall volcanoes help push the top of storms high into the air where fast tradewinds rip off the top. No top..no big hurricane. San Francisco's insurance is high owing to earthquake insurance. In Pahoa both hurricane insurance and earthquake insurance are largely optional or more affordable when purchased since housing costs are lower.


Question: Where is air quality better?
A. Arizona
B. Florida
C. Lower Puna


Fact: Lower Puna despite being pretty close to one of the greatest tourist attractions in the world, has great air. The tradewinds keep the air clear over Lower Puna and 95% of the time the breath of the volcano is blown to Hawaii's West side. About 5% of the time winds come from the south-west. These are called the Kona winds. When they blow they blow the air toward Hilo town. In 10 years of living in Lower Puna this author has experienced the smell of sulfur in the air one day. Arizona's air admittedly used to be very good..however..now that so many moved there the pollen in the air from all the grass planted around the homes clouds the air.


Question: Where are home values more likely to rise?
A. Florida
B. California
C. East Hawaii


Fact: In East Hawaii the cost of a home is far more dependent on the cost of the materials and labor to build the home then the cost of the land. Homes are selling for not much more than the cost to build them. In most of Florida and California it is the value of the land below the house that keeps housing prices there inflated. The problem with land value is it depends on the overall desire to live in the area. East Hawaii with low taxes, low cost of living, will attract many people upon retirement and it doesn't have a huge pool of unsold or foreclosure properties. As a result as more and more baby boomers retire, it only takes a tiny percentage of them to greatly influence the future rise of East Hawaii property values. In general, today's retires are more careful and less likely to simply follow in the steps of their parents and move to typical places like Palm Springs or Fort Lauderdale. The fact that Hawaii is more remote than traditional retirement havens is less important these days as today's retirees are more apt to jump on a plane to visit the family. It matters little to them that the plane takes a few hours more.


Feel free to post this on other websites.


Philip Maise
Pahoa Hawaii


Now bring on the questions.

[pbmaise]

Note: Regarding my statement that ZERO homes in Zone 1 were destroyed by lava in the last 10 years....

The current eruption in East Hawaii has been going non-stop for over this same 10 years and taken out about less than 5 and closer to 2 homes that entire time. These were in Zone 2 and at least one of these was owing to an over anxious owner building on his land before the current flow stopped.

Zone 1 is still zero during this period.

Zone 1 by the way, counter to most common wisdom, is one of the most desirable zones to live in. Even in Kapoho where you can clearly see the town was wiped out in 1960, you will find million dollar homes. Why? It is simply a fantastic place.

Yes we all know that with some volcanoes you should live in fear.

However, not all volcanoes are alike. Before the lava last erupted in Kapoho there were several thousand earthquakes and the road split apart. There are great photos of everyone standing around looking in the crack wondering when it would blow. Clearly, everyone knew something was up and no one got killed. You can't say the same about living near Montana's forests, or California's hills. Death moves swiftly in those type of fires.

A full 51 years have gone by with no new eruption near Kapoho and where were you living during that tiime? Where will you be living during the next 51 or 500 years that it takes to return again.

Philip Maise

[McFrostyJ]

This is an amazing You Tube video that you might like.

YouTube - ‪Kapoho‬‏

[barney_rubble]

Sorry, but the difference between the sides of Hawaii is not just marketing. The beaches have drastically different characteristics. The weather is drastically different. The geography is drastically different.

Even if $0 were spent on marketing the West side, it would still be far sunnier and drier. The beaches would still be more numerous and more similar to the stereotypic perfect white sand beach. The water would still be calmer.

Don't get me wrong: East Hawaii is a fabulous place. It has amazing rainforests, waterfalls abound, and HVNP is one of the most remarkable areas on the planet. But you are deluding yourself if you think that people like the West side solely because of marketing. They like it because they value sunshine over rainforest, beaches over volcanoes, and resorts over universities.

Why are you so insistent on trying to impose your values upon others?

[Vaedrem]

Some of us live in South or North Big Island and couldn't care less about which of your sides attracts the most tourists. I don't think all public resources and institutions should be focused onto either Hilo or Kona while other districts go without. A lot of people resent the unavailability of mortgages and insurance in Kau in particular, not because of any real threat of lava, but so that property values in H/K remain high.

[pbmaise]

Aloha
And...Thank you thank you...Those that replied above...
You are demonstrating my point.



Within a few hours of my post, the negative marketing and reinforcement that the East Side of Hawaii is the wrong choice has already begun.

Notice how the first reply uses fear. Fear is negative marketing at its finest!
What motivated this poster? He is showing you an old video of an isolated event that effected only a small area of Hawaii. Isn't his clear intent to help instill fear that if you live in East Hawaii this will soon happen in your neighborhood?

Lets examine some gems this poster contributed to this website.

In a thread about Puna he wrote:
Just wondering, is the rapture really going to start tomorrow?

In a thread about whether homes in Hawaii have basements he wrote:
My uncle used to hide down in the basement to watch his dirty movies!

The marketing attempts of barney_rubble to counter my point were clear! Thanks!
Wasn't my point that marketing helps create your impression of East Hawaii? He claimed it isn't marketing and then went on to use marketing to help sell the West side over the East side. He claims, they are "drastically different". He even repeats this same phrase three times. Why is he banging his fist on the table?

In my original post, I admitted our weather was different and it rained more in East Hawaii. I admitted our beaches were different. I took care to ensure I didn't say a thing that wasn't a fact.

The second marketing technique he used was to attack the messenger. He wrote...Why are you so insistent on trying to impose your values upon others?

Isn't my objective 100% transparent? I signed my post with my name and the town I live in. Pahoa, if you don't know already, is in Puna on the East side of Hawaii. Puna is an area almost as big as the entire island of Kauai. However, despite its size, continued marketing, much of which is negative, helps form opinions.

I have a clear incentive to help put an end to misinformation and negative marketing of where I live. The people of East Hawaii are my neighbors, and friends. Their home values, their quality of life itself, and my own are continually impacted by a constant stream of negative and false marketing.

Let me cite one common example. How many postings have you read that say something like..."I heard it can be difficult to get insurance in certain parts of Hawaii"? What a crafty little fear to put into your mind. Now that I mentioned it, lets review facts.


#1 Insurance is available to all qualified homeowners everywhere in Hawaii. It is written into the laws of Hawaii. (I use the word qualified since not all homes are built with permits and not all types of homes qualify for this insurance. This law doesn't grant you the right to insure boarding houses or a commercial bed and breakfast.)

#2 All insurance companies by law must offer insurance everywhere in Hawaii. Every firm offering insurance in Hawaii is also providing insurance in lava zone 1 and 2. Many people think there is an insurance company called HPIA which standards for Hawaii Property Insurance Association.
The key word here for all to see is Association. All insurance carriers in Hawaii are part of the association and share insurance risk and profits.


#3 All insurance policies in Hawaii cover you in the event your home is damaged by lava flow. This is a rare case where reading the fine print can give you the wrong impression. So many people worry that their policy states clearly that lava flow is excluded. However, what they don't know is most insurance companies only print one form for the entire nation. By law, all policies sold in Hawaii most offer the minimum coverage based the "Standard Form Fire Insurance Policy as authorized by State of New York on December 31, 1943" The people in New York back in 1943 never thought to exclude lava flow as a reason not to payout. As a result any policy anywhere in Hawaii covers homeowners in the event of lava flow despite what it may read in the fine print.

If it sounds like I know what I am talking about it is because I do. I have personally spoken with the State of Hawaii Insurance Commissioner, I have read the laws of Hawaii (they are called Hawaii Revised Statutes) and I have insurance in Lava Zone 2.

#4 Yes, there are some limitations to the HPIA insurance. Currently the maximum payout to rebuild a home stands at $350,000. For homes with a higher rebuild costs, or for homeowners that want comprehensive policies covering things like medical liability clams and rental income ...there are other providers. Most turn to Lloyds of London. Personally, my home is insured by one of the alternate carriers.

#5 Insurance costs is a constant complaint everywhere, and it is true that HPIA insurance is higher. However, coverage is being provided in an area that is perhaps more risky. It is my viewpoint that higher insurance costs required to live in riskier areas of Hawaii are more than offset since taxes are lower. Taxes on my home in Hawaii are about 1/5th the cost of taxes on a similar home on the mainland USA. This is possible owing to having homeowners exemptions and a great law that prevents taxes from rising too fast as property values increased.


The marketing technique used by Vaedrem is called dilution.
Dilution by far in a public forum is the most common technique used to drown out any message you don't agree with. I call it the Yeah...But!

But what about this..what about that?
Soon no one is talking about the fact that negative marketing is very real and actively spreading misinformation. Instead the thread has been hijacked and people are talking about the type of movies their uncle watched in his basement.


One common question I get is why I sleep comfortably at night?
Lets only use facts:
1. The last flow near my property was 1955. It is State land and helps guarantee my ocean view.
2. That flow created Kehena black sand beach. Thank you Pele.
3. Just a block from that flow are areas that haven't been blessed with a fresh coating for hundreds of years.
4. There are hills between me and the current flow and lava doesn't tend to flow uphill.
5. When lava is flowing from one area and pressure is being eliminated from the tap...it is less likely lava will start flowing suddenly in another.
5. Not all volcanoes are the same, and Hawaii's volcanoes have sent out clear signals via thousands of small earthquakes that something will happen before it happens.



About what Pele Gives
Too many focus on what Pele takes instead of what Pele gives in return. Pele gave us Kalapana beach. People still sing songs about the beauty of Kalapana beach. Everyone when they see a picture of that beach shouts I want to go there! An entire wall of the newspaper in Hilo is a shrine to that beach. Ask anyone who was lucky enough to experience it if anyplace was better. Sadly Pele took the beach back and we will have to await her next creation.


She is currently working at it and we have to be patient. Pele cares not about the mere span of the life of a human and operates on her time. Eventually she will form another peninsula into the sea that will prevent the her sister's current from taking away her black sand. This is exactly how Kalapana and Kehena beach were formed.





If you step anywhere in Hawaii, you are stepping on land that is hers, she gave it to us, and it will always remain her right to take it away. Sometimes it is taken in dramatic fashion and since I now mentioned that little fact I will explain.




About what Pele Takes


Oh, how so many of you focus on the tiny little expressions of Pele's rebirth and renewal of the land. So few of you have any idea the true scale and power Pele has to take. Pele has in the past, and will again take far more than you have ever imagined.


When will she command the entire Pacific ocean again cause it to rise up? No one knows. However, when she does, she will make the tiny waves in Japan look like a puddle splash. Lets look only at facts.

1. First examine your own experiences at the beach. When you piled sand higher and higher, eventually gravity caused a section to shear off.
2. The islands of Hawaii are like piles of sand built up from the seafloor.
3. The very tall cliffs you see around Hawaii were not formed by slow erosion. They were formed in one sudden moment when entire sides of islands collapsed back into the sea.
4. It is not a matter of if, but when the next collapse will occur.
5. Debri fields from previous collapses extend miles and miles in every direction around Hawaii.
6. When the next collapse occurs it will generate a tsunami that can travel dozens of miles inland in places like California, Oregon, Washington, Japan, and Canada. Only those higher than 50, 100, or is it 200 feet above the sea will be safe.
7. The millions of people that could be effected go on with their lives and accept the risk.
8. Almost all parts of Hawaii face this risk.

Now that you have been trained a bit..and I have hopefully opened your eyes a bit...look at each post from here out and ask yourself.

What motivates the post?
Is the post an attempt to market one part of Hawaii over another?
Is the post factual?
Does the author have any credibility?

Let the replies role.

Philip Maise
Pahoa Hawaii
Yes that is in Puna, on the East Side of Hawaii
I live in a section that is Lava Zone 2


I feel blessed to live where I do. Yes go ahead call me a Punatic. I expect that negative slam soon.

[Jungjohann]

YOU'RE A BLOODY PUNATIC!!!!!!!!!!!!! and maybe a Spamunist in Punatics clothing..............................

uuuurrrrpppp.....................

[McFrostyJ]

Originally Posted by pbmaise

Within a few hours of my post, the negative marketing and reinforcement that the East Side of Hawaii is the wrong choice has already begun.

Notice how the first reply uses fear. Fear is negative marketing at its finest!
What motivated this poster? He is showing you an old video of an isolated event that effected only a small area of Hawaii. Isn't his clear intent to help instill fear that if you live in East Hawaii this will soon happen in your neighborhood?

Lets examine some gems this poster contributed to this website.

In a thread about Puna he wrote:
Just wondering, is the rapture really going to start tomorrow?

In a thread about whether homes in Hawaii have basements he wrote:
[i]My uncle used to hide down in the basement to watch his dirty movies!

It is so funny how people misread things! LOL!

I posted the video because I thought it was a really cool video, nothing else. As far as Puna goes, it is on our short list(top 2) of places we are planning on moving to. Infact, the only reason why we might not move there would be that family is on Oahu. So, you totally misread why I was posting that video.

In the other thread that you quoted, I like reading what the person posts and was curious what he thought about the rapture issue. Again, you completely misread that.

The last quote from me was just a joke. Nothing more, nothing less.

I completely understand how the written word can easily be taken the wrong way. Since I know that, what I do is try to assume the best first, until proven otherwise.

Anyways, I can see that it was just a misunderstanding. No worries!

[McFrostyJ]

By the way, how I came across that video is we found a little place for sale in Kapoho that we love. So, I then looked up some videos on You Tube about Kapoho. The ONLY thing stopping us from buying is the price tag that is WAY out of our budget. We would have have to win the lottery to buy this! Unfortunately, I don't play the lottery. But if we did...!


Coldwell Banker Pacific Properties ~ Property Search

[barney_rubble]

Wasn't my point that marketing helps create your impression of East Hawaii? He claimed it isn't marketing and then went on to use marketing to help sell the West side over the East side. He claims, they are "drastically different". He even repeats this same phrase three times. Why is he banging his fist on the table?

In my original post, I admitted our weather was different and it rained more in East Hawaii. I admitted our beaches were different. I took care to ensure I didn't say a thing that wasn't a fact.

Let's talk about the facts, then. The west side has more beaches, more sunshine, and more glitzy resorts. The east side has more rainforests, more opportunities to explore the volcano, and a university.

If someone prefers sunny days to rainforests, beaches to volcanoes, and resorts to universities, that person will prefer the west side to the east. Period. It's not an issue of misinformation or marketing. It's an issue of values.

By the same token, some people will prefer everything the east side has to offer.

The second marketing technique he used was to attack the messenger. He wrote...Why are you so insistent on trying to impose your values upon others?

Isn't my objective 100% transparent? I signed my post with my name and the town I live in. Pahoa, if you don't know already, is in Puna on the East side of Hawaii. Puna is an area almost as big as the entire island of Kauai. However, despite its size, continued marketing, much of which is negative, helps form opinions.

I have a clear incentive to help put an end to misinformation and negative marketing of where I live. The people of East Hawaii are my neighbors, and friends. Their home values, their quality of life itself, and my own are continually impacted by a constant stream of negative and false marketing.

You have never proven that misinformation is harming the east side. I think Puna is awesome. But it is different and will not appeal to the same people as the west.