How To Avoid - Lower Hurricane Insurance In Hawaii (Hilo: loan, how much)

[pbmaise]

Seriously, I didn't plant this guy. Doesn't he prove my point that no matter how much data you present they will tell you it is not enough and provide no justification in return? My apologizes to the residents of Kauai, if I thought your "peaks" could be described as volcanoes and not eroded mountains. I thought you had at least 2 of the 107 volcanoes in the chain. What was/were the name(s) of your volcano(es)?

[HankDfrmSD]

There have been insinuations here that the insurance companies are ripping us off, and that they have taken in much more than they have paid out.

I have experience in this area. I own a house in Princeville on Kauai which went through Hurricane Iniki. We suffered major damage.

It took months, but the insurance company paid, and I deposited the check.

Two days later the insurance company went belly-up and stopped paying further claims.

I'm happy that insurance companies are now more solvent, since I still own that house, which we completely rebuilt using that insurance check.

Hank

[Jonah K]

Originally Posted by pbmaise

Aloha,
Hurricane Insurance isn't chump change to me. Anyone out there have a bill higher than $40 per month?

Those that insist you buy hurricane insurance, will tell you that you failed to provide enough evidence, and that history is not relevant. They will tell you, your risk is the same as homes built on flat coastal lands of Florida. Lenders don't care if it is hurting you and your family to cough up that hurricane insurance bill..their investment is 0.000001% safer.

If a person can't afford a measly $480/year for hurricane insurance, Hawai'i might not be the best place to try to be a homeowner with a mortgage. Simply pay off the mortgage, drop the "high-priced" hurricane insurance, and call it a day.

[mdand3boys]

Originally Posted by Jonah K

If a person can't afford a measly $480/year for hurricane insurance, Hawai'i might not be the best place to try to be a homeowner with a mortgage. Simply pay off the mortgage, drop the "high-priced" hurricane insurance, and call it a day.

Exactly. Rep point for you!

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by pbmaise

Aloha,
Hurricane Insurance isn't chump change to me. Anyone out there have a bill higher than $40 per month?

Those that insist you buy hurricane insurance, will tell you that you failed to provide enough evidence, and that history is not relevant. They will tell you, your risk is the same as homes built on flat coastal lands of Florida. Lenders don't care if it is hurting you and your family to cough up that hurricane insurance bill..their investment is 0.000001% safer.

I research my posts and try and provide the most accurate and best available data.
Here is a better link to that 29 years of data I found.
Western Regional Climate Center

It is from a place called the Western Regional Climate Center. WRCC Supports a Three-Partner National Climate Services Program - the Partners Include: National Climatic Data Center (NCDC), Regional Climate Centers (RCC's), and State Climate Offices.

Everyone is free to look at the data. I picked the biggest sample I could find, and again no matter how big the sample, people making money selling you things will never agree it is enough.

However, since you asked, I thought it would be fine to prove my point further.
Period of Record: Jul 1996 to Dec 2008
Maximum Peak Gust in any single month
Hilo Hawaii Island, 51, 39, 38, 37 MPH
Honolulu, Oahu, 48, 47, 47, 44 MPH
Lihue, Kauai 60, 59, 55, 48 MPH
Guam 94, 90, 66, 61 MPH

Since I was on the site it wasn't hard to look up a few others for you to compare. Some of these are pretty far away from the Pacific Ocean.

Casper, Wyoming 81, 78, 68, 66 MPH
Seattle, Washington 69, 60, 53, 53 MPH
Salt Lake City, Utah 75, 64, 62, 60 MPH
Reno, Nevada 82, 63, 62, 62, 61, 61, 61 MPH
Billings, Montana 85, 70, 69, 62 MPH

The numbers and facts do not speak for themselves. It is up to people to take the numbers and facts and request an explanation as to why all of Hawaii is classified as a high risk area.

Do not forward any information to anyone struggling to pay their bills in Hawaii. Facts can only make them frustrated. It is better they get a third job.

Philip Maise
Pahoa Hawaii

I never said the risk was the same as it was in Florida. The waters of the Atlantic and the Gulf are shallow and are warmer waters, perfect for the existence and growth of major hurricanes.

Lumping all arguments into a strawman isn't a very effective way to make a point.

The fact that tornados are often spawned by hurricanes is a good reason to get insurance...I'd like to see you argue that your place was destroyed by a tornado instead of a hurricane and would therefore be covered by a standard homeowner's policy, not a hurricane policy.

BTW, Hurricanes don't strike Casper, Reno or SLC. Not sure why those windspeeds are relevant.

[PacificFlights]

I think the real estate market is way down in Hawaii.
I think less people are aplying for loans.
I think many can only afford the lower cost in hazard areas.
I think loans aren't moving because people find out about the lava and hurricane insurance problem.
I think someone is worried they will get the boot from their job processing these loans.
I think someone is trying to find a way to breakdown the roadblocks.
I think someone is just looking to make it easier to get a loan.
I think we all see through the nonsense.

[pbmaise]

Aloha PacificFlights

Good summary and great points.

I think the real estate market is way down in Hawaii.
.....Agree, it effects all.

I think less people are applying for loans.
.....Agree, especially in areas where people are denied on an arbitrary basis.

I think many can only afford the lower cost in hazard areas.
.....Agree, I always remind myself that not all are fortunate to afford more expensive areas, larger homes, and higher insurance bills. My apologies if I have caused offense.

I think loans aren't moving because people find out about the lava and hurricane insurance problem.
......Partly agree, it largely is when the lender looks at the total debt to income ratio that they fail to qualify to buy. All home sales are down..The last figure I heard was 107 for month of April 2011 for entire Island.

I think someone is worried they will get the boot from their job processing these loans.
......I'm sure many are. Not all were fortunate like me to have left the industry.

I think someone is trying to find a way to breakdown the roadblocks.
......I hope you think that is me, breaking roadblocks that depress real estate in Hawaii is my expressed goal.

I think someone is just looking to make it easier to get a loan.
.....Absolutely. One reason the Hawaii market has suffered so much is it has become harder for people to get loans. Now you are beginning to see the logic. If the goal is to bring real estate values up...then you need to address what is making it difficult to get a loan.

I think we all see through the nonsense.
.....Excellent! That is the point of my being here. To end the nonsense.

It will take a while for everyone to understand.

Potential homeowners are being forced to live in slum lord properties because:

1. Arbitrary Washington rulings that have no basis in fact have red-lined Hawaii.
2. The Washington policy was picked up by private firms as the basis to deny services and classify all of Hawaii as if it was exactly the same as Florida.
3. Few believe they can fight Washington and a fewer still have a background like mine.
4. Fewer still do not work in the industry now and can't be threatened by their employer for raising a stink.

It is only owing to the fact that I'm currently not in the industry, I came from the industry, and I have a strong legal background fighting and winning my own real estate legal battles in Hawaii that I have this ability.

I am nearing completion on the section of hurricane insurance in the strategic plan and will post that here soon.


Philip Maise
Pahoa Hawaii

[beachmouse]

Originally Posted by AlohaHuey

Compared to a hurricane, the Islands are puny. Katrina took up most of the Gulf at its largest size. Plot that against the Hawaiian islands. A large Pacific hurricane would only be minimally affected by mountains. For approx. $40 a month, I prefer the peace of mind insurance brings.

You also neglect to take into account hurricanes often spawn tornados, which would cause uninsured damage in the event you are without hurricane insurance.

We've seen far stronger storms than normal in the mainland this year...it's a good reminder that nature can and will do its worst, and we need to be prepared. You're cutting a corner to save chump change with very dangerous financial implications.

And Katrina and Ike were wee things compared to many WPAC storms. Time to break out the Super Typhoon Tip pictures:

Typhoon Tip - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And from experience, I can say that the insurance companies will jump on any excuse possible to classify something as hurricane damage even when it's unrelated. In the early 00s, we ended up filing a claim for lightning damage to our house. Time frame was at the same time a small tropical storm was making landfall on the TX/MEX border, and we actually had to spend five minutes on the phone with the claims office verifying that a) it was a small tropical storm and b) Brownsville, TX is a long, long way from the Florida panhandle, so c) our regular deductable applied instead of the hurricane deductable.

And if anyone wants a good primer on why hurricane-related insurance is so expensive, Paige St. John won a Pulitzer for digging into the reinsurance world last year. Some of it's Florida-specific, but a lot of the meta applies to Hawaii insurance markets at well:

Sarasota Florida News, Sarasota Weather, Sports and Business | Florida Property Insurance Investigation | HeraldTribune.com | Sarasota Herald-Tribune


(The 'Insurers make millions' and 'billions sent overseas' are probably the best general articles of the set.)

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by pbmaise

Aloha PacificFlights

Good summary and great points.

I think the real estate market is way down in Hawaii.
.....Agree, it effects all.

I think less people are applying for loans.
.....Agree, especially in areas where people are denied on an arbitrary basis.

I think many can only afford the lower cost in hazard areas.
.....Agree, I always remind myself that not all are fortunate to afford more expensive areas, larger homes, and higher insurance bills. My apologies if I have caused offense.

I think loans aren't moving because people find out about the lava and hurricane insurance problem.
......Partly agree, it largely is when the lender looks at the total debt to income ratio that they fail to qualify to buy. All home sales are down..The last figure I heard was 107 for month of April 2011 for entire Island.

I think someone is worried they will get the boot from their job processing these loans.
......I'm sure many are. Not all were fortunate like me to have left the industry.

I think someone is trying to find a way to breakdown the roadblocks.
......I hope you think that is me, breaking roadblocks that depress real estate in Hawaii is my expressed goal.

I think someone is just looking to make it easier to get a loan.
.....Absolutely. One reason the Hawaii market has suffered so much is it has become harder for people to get loans. Now you are beginning to see the logic. If the goal is to bring real estate values up...then you need to address what is making it difficult to get a loan.

I think we all see through the nonsense.
.....Excellent! That is the point of my being here. To end the nonsense.

It will take a while for everyone to understand.

Potential homeowners are being forced to live in slum lord properties because:

1. Arbitrary Washington rulings that have no basis in fact have red-lined Hawaii.
2. The Washington policy was picked up by private firms as the basis to deny services and classify all of Hawaii as if it was exactly the same as Florida.
3. Few believe they can fight Washington and a fewer still have a background like mine.
4. Fewer still do not work in the industry now and can't be threatened by their employer for raising a stink.

It is only owing to the fact that I'm currently not in the industry, I came from the industry, and I have a strong legal background fighting and winning my own real estate legal battles in Hawaii that I have this ability.

I am nearing completion on the section of hurricane insurance in the strategic plan and will post that here soon.


Philip Maise
Pahoa Hawaii

I think you underestimate the understanding of this board. We see right through you.

[PacificFlights]

Originally Posted by AlohaHuey

I think you underestimate the understanding of this board. We see right through you.

Let me add one more to see if clearer
I think someone is just trying to protect their high commissions as a loan officer!