Racism: Not in my experience (Kaneohe, Kailua: apartment, crimes, hotel)

[NVplumber]

Perhaps what is percieved as "Racism" by some folks visiting or attempting to adjust to life in the Islands is not so much a hatred or predjudice toward their ethnic background by the locals as it is a misunderstanding of intent. Someone stated earlier that a lot rides on how you carry and present yourself and I personally feel this is very true. We are in the process of moving to Kuaui ( a very lenghty process with a lot of thought and work involved) and I have had a LOT of interaction with local folks in the Kapa'a Lihue and Princeville areas with no negative reaction toward me, however I did not present myself with an "there's a new Sheriff in town" attitude. Quite the opposite I begged their indulgence in helping me understand how things worked and went with the "when in Rome" phylosophy. Here in Nevada right now there is a movement by we native born types to stop unwanted and sweeping changes being proposed and imposed by the influx of California transplants wanting to drag all the baggage they are supposedly leaving the Golden State to get away from with them and thus pushing our way of life out in favor of what they think OUR state should be. So ...T-shirts , posters TV adds etc that say " We don't much care how you did it in California!" I'm sure Hawaiians ( no matter their ethnic background) feel the same way about mainlanders insisting that the Islands change to suit them. Thus, before crying racism, perhaps it may behoove one to take a good look at ones self and think very hard as to whether your presenting youself as a threat to a treasured way of life rather than as a "haole" or whatever. It's quite possible that race has nothing to do with why your getting the "stink eye". Something to think about. Aloha....

[maui08]

Originally Posted by NVplumber

Perhaps what is percieved as "Racism" by some folks visiting or attempting to adjust to life in the Islands is not so much a hatred or predjudice toward their ethnic background by the locals as it is a misunderstanding of intent. Someone stated earlier that a lot rides on how you carry and present yourself and I personally feel this is very true. We are in the process of moving to Kuaui ( a very lenghty process with a lot of thought and work involved) and I have had a LOT of interaction with local folks in the Kapa'a Lihue and Princeville areas with no negative reaction toward me, however I did not present myself with an "there's a new Sheriff in town" attitude. Quite the opposite I begged their indulgence in helping me understand how things worked and went with the "when in Rome" phylosophy. Here in Nevada right now there is a movement by we native born types to stop unwanted and sweeping changes being proposed and imposed by the influx of California transplants wanting to drag all the baggage they are supposedly leaving the Golden State to get away from with them and thus pushing our way of life out in favor of what they think OUR state should be. So ...T-shirts , posters TV adds etc that say " We don't much care how you did it in California!" I'm sure Hawaiians ( no matter their ethnic background) feel the same way about mainlanders insisting that the Islands change to suit them. Thus, before crying racism, perhaps it may behoove one to take a good look at ones self and think very hard as to whether your presenting youself as a threat to a treasured way of life rather than as a "haole" or whatever. It's quite possible that race has nothing to do with why your getting the "stink eye". Something to think about. Aloha....

Your thoughts are the same ones we had 15 years ago. All you can think about is the big move to Hawaii with the beaches and plumeria blowing in the wind. -Believe me, we felt the same way. Being laid back and not acting like the new sheriff is helpful no matter where you live but don't think you are just going to slip into town and everyone is going to start inviting you over for BBQ's and you'll just fit in. I wish you the best but Hawaii is still living in the past on many issues including race. -No matter what anyone says. Yes, other states have issues too but at least you can stay out of areas where you are not wanted in bigger cities. Good luck doing that on a small island. -Unless you just live in a hotel on the strip where everyone is filled with the "aloha" spirit because everyone's on vacation!

[Sweetbeet]

Originally Posted by maui08

Your thoughts are the same ones we had 15 years ago. All you can think about is the big move to Hawaii with the beaches and plumeria blowing in the wind * * * Yes, other states have issues too but at least you can stay out of areas where you are not wanted in bigger cities. Good luck doing that on a small island. -Unless you just live in a hotel on the strip where everyone is filled with the "aloha" spirit because everyone's on vacation!

Well, my sister moved to a smaller island (Kauai, to be precise) a year ago, and I don't think she's had one bit of a problem with racism. She's made friends (as has her 14-year-old daughter) and gets along fine with her neighbors, and other folks she runs into (of all races) on the beach, in stores, at her employment, etc. If she got the ol' 'stink eye' from someone I don't think she'd react much to it, just move on without really caring whether it was because of her race (caucasian), origin (from the mainland), or something else.

I also know that my brother, when a tourist on Kauai many years ago, was the subject of a nasty racist comment with the "H" word, while on the beach near his tourist condo, and if anything, he's more of a nice, easy-going guy than my sis is. Maybe it was his gender, or maybe just an a**hole. But so much for the "stay near the tourist areas" idea!

We (me, my hubby and son) have visited several times, on Oahu, the BI and Kauai (haven't been to Maui since the 70s), and as far as I know, we've never been the brunt of any adverse racist behavior. One self-described haole (store clerk) did comment to me that he felt they "needed some more haole lawyers" for some specified reasons, which could have been deemed "racist" but may also, in fact, be true (I don't know and may never know)... sometimes there is more than a grain of truth in comments about differences based on race. IMO, it is wrong to treat anyone badly or to make assumptions about them based solely on their race, but it is not wrong to discuss perceived differences, in a spirit of education and interest in gaining understanding. I mean, there are a LOT of African-Americans who are great basketball players. WHY is that? May be that they go in that direction because other opportunities are often foreclosed, due to social or economic circumstances; maybe the race is generally taller (there ARE physical differences between races, that's how we recognize them!); maybe there are other reasons. Maybe the recruiters are biased in favor of African-Americans. I don't think it's wrong to notice the skew (it would be wrong to assume that someone would be good (or bad) at basketball just because they are a certain race), or even to comment on it, if done in the proper spirit and for a proper purpose.

There have been some hints that one of the reasons why people who live in Hawaii are perceived as racist is that they have different attitudes about what is the "proper spirit" or "proper purpose" for comments that acknowledge race. I think there is probably something to that. I dunno. I'll probably comment further on this after I've lived there for a bit (if I gain any better understanding).

[HeyJoe]

Yea, it does exist in Hawaii, but it is not as bad as some make it out to be. I think the prime difference for most haoles that end up there is that for the first time in their life they are a minority... and that feels like "racism" somehow. Your average tourist that is there for a week or two will never have a clue, but yes... it DOES exist there.

That being said, I met a large number of really nice and decent people in Hawaii. I ended up moving not due to perceived racism, but because of the cost of living (astronomical).

[Jonah K]

Originally Posted by NVplumber

Perhaps what is percieved as "Racism" by some folks visiting or attempting to adjust to life in the Islands is not so much a hatred or predjudice toward their ethnic background by the locals as it is a misunderstanding of intent. Someone stated earlier that a lot rides on how you carry and present yourself and I personally feel this is very true. We are in the process of moving to Kuaui ( a very lenghty process with a lot of thought and work involved) and I have had a LOT of interaction with local folks in the Kapa'a Lihue and Princeville areas with no negative reaction toward me, however I did not present myself with an "there's a new Sheriff in town" attitude. Quite the opposite I begged their indulgence in helping me understand how things worked and went with the "when in Rome" phylosophy. Here in Nevada right now there is a movement by we native born types to stop unwanted and sweeping changes being proposed and imposed by the influx of California transplants wanting to drag all the baggage they are supposedly leaving the Golden State to get away from with them and thus pushing our way of life out in favor of what they think OUR state should be. So ...T-shirts , posters TV adds etc that say " We don't much care how you did it in California!" I'm sure Hawaiians ( no matter their ethnic background) feel the same way about mainlanders insisting that the Islands change to suit them. Thus, before crying racism, perhaps it may behoove one to take a good look at ones self and think very hard as to whether your presenting youself as a threat to a treasured way of life rather than as a "haole" or whatever. It's quite possible that race has nothing to do with why your getting the "stink eye". Something to think about. Aloha....

Here's a link to an example of a Californian trying to change things on Kaua'i by building a house in a graveyard....
Protesters, workers clash over graves | starbulletin.com | News | /2008/07/12/

[NVplumber]

Thanks for the link Jonah. Good read. Incidents such as that are precisely the type I'm refering to as being the root cause of what is being percieved as racial in nature but, in fact, are not. My home state is going through just this type of thing regularly because of big shot out of state and even out of the country types slithering in with big coin and trampling on our cultural heritage. They seem to feel that a large bank account means more than us common folks feelings about our way of life. In general, everyday average people are passionate about their heritage and eliteist types backed by big money trampling on that passion is exactly the type of thing that has been known to start shooting wars, and the ethnicity of the offenders matters about as much as a dried rat dropping in a whirlwind. Wherever one chooses to hang their hat and call home you have an obligation to understand that you have no right to force your values and traditions on your neighbors or disrespect their way of life. Rather , by choosing to live there, one must understand that your now a part of that culture and if you don't like it, don't live there! And a large wad of cash is not a license for a pompous attitude. I'm not , by any means saying that racial tension is non existent in Hawaii but I still firmly believe that trampling of cultural heritage by arrogant outsiders and local anger over that is often misinterperated as "racism". Aloha.......

[scorpy01]

That isn't much different than the use of eminent domain to seize property from private homeowners in order to develop the land for commercial use. It's an injustice upon the individual, backed by wealthy developers and given the nod from a corrupt government. And our hapless Supreme Court put their stamp of approval on it, to boot! That wasn't on Hawaii but in Connecticut.

It isn't about whites vs. Hawaiians; it's about those with money being able to buy whatever they want, or take what they can't buy. In that regard, Hawaii is not special - it's just like the rest of the country. In fact, it's just like the rest of the world.

The problem with racism or any type of prejudice is that it means you are not seeing Me but your own (flawed) concept of me. You have reduced me to your thought while ignoring who I am. That seems to go against my understanding of The Spirit of Aloha.

[NVplumber]

Originally Posted by scorpy01

That isn't much different than the use of eminent domain to seize property from private homeowners in order to develop the land for commercial use. It's an injustice upon the individual, backed by wealthy developers and given the nod from a corrupt government. And our hapless Supreme Court put their stamp of approval on it, to boot! That wasn't on Hawaii but in Connecticut.

It isn't about whites vs. Hawaiians; it's about those with money being able to buy whatever they want, or take what they can't buy. In that regard, Hawaii is not special - it's just like the rest of the country. In fact, it's just like the rest of the world.

The problem with racism or any type of prejudice is that it means you are not seeing Me but your own (flawed) concept of me. You have reduced me to your thought while ignoring who I am. That seems to go against my understanding of The Spirit of Aloha.

Oh yea...good old eminent domain. when it boils right down to it it's all about the money and more importantly the power it can buy. At the risk of sounding like a conspiresy theorist I'd hazard a guess that the strife created by the flexing of that power amongst we common folks is exactly what the elite power brokers are looking for.If they can keep us at each others throats along whatever lines suit their interests ( race, ethnic background, etc) and have us pointing fingers at each other and stereotyping ourselves they can lean back with a big cigar and a snifter of fine congnac and watch us do their dirty work for them. Brings to mind that old quote " We have met the Enemy...and he is us". Nothing suits corruption better than setting every day, honest, and basically decent people against each other so as we're so busy getting nasty with each other we forget to look at the big picture. The classic divide and conquer. So, they snuff out our cultures, build their hotels and highways on our sacred places and have us blaming each other for it. I could write a whole in depth thesis on this but all I'm really trying to say is divisiveness amongst ourselves is just what the real bad guys want.

[Frangi914]

Nevermind - was going to post here but changed my mind

[ZhugeLiang]

Originally Posted by DBale

Actually, I think there is a reason that there are "a lot of posts about racism" here - but I don't think it's because there is a lot of racism, I think there is an ulterior motive by a select few.

Yes, that stuff about the Hawaiian soverignty crowd, those really idiotic "Defend Hawaii" with a picture of a rifile decals and hate crimes taking place on the Big Island, they're really just figments of our imaginations.