Mildly Terrified to Move to Oahu After Browsing This Forum (fit in, new home)

[NoMoreSTL]

Wow, I have been reading a lot of these threads and posts and I gotta tell ya, YIKES! Should I be shaking with terror to move to Oahu from St. Louis? OR should I be has excited about it as I was BEFORE I found this site? Help!

Let me give you some background:

My fiancee (black, "W") and I (white) are moving to Oahu as he has re-enlisted for 5 more years in the military after serving 2 tours in Iraq. (Yes, he's nuts. He's also a terrific leader and mentor and is great at what he does.) He will work on-base between deployments and I will telecommute from my current job. We'll be staying off-base for the entire time, so I'm hoping most of what I read here is false or grossly exaggerated.

I've lived in St. Louis my entire life, and for 4 of those years, I've lived in St. Louis City. Don't get me wrong, I love STL, I really do. It's what I know, it's where my friends and family are, and it's where my roots are. However, after living here and visiting lots of other cities and places, I thought STL was about as crime-ridden, racist-driven, dirty, meth-addicted and opportunity-less (?) as it gets (not considering Gary, Indiana; Sorry, Gary-ites).

What's the deal? Am I to believe that W and I are going to get there and:
1. My cat will be held in quarantine, regardless of my following every condition to the letter (only because HI's gov't is money-hungry?), where he will die because of the deplorable conditions in quarantine,
2. We will only be able to find & live in a drugged-up, cockroach-infested slum because we are not millionaires,
3. It will take W 2 hours to get to work and another 2 hours to get back,
4. It will take us 2 hours to get to the beach, where we will immediately be kicked out because I am white and/or because he is black and/or because we are a mixed-race couple,
5. We will be dirt poor and living on Ramen noodles and what we can find at the farmer's market.

Is this at all accurate? I figured it would be so much different than STL. I'm not one to buy into the false promises of perpetual-vacation-living-in-paradise... Nothing was ever handed to me, I fully expect to keep working hard and I know things are expensive, but this is out of control. It sounds like STL with a tan and some palm trees! I figured people would be kinder to each other BECAUSE there are so many ethnicities represented in a small area.

W has lived in HI before for a period of 2 years before he was originally deployed and is insistent that none of this is true. He has a way of sugar coating everything for me out of love. None of you know me or have qualms about my feelings, so I'd like some honest straight talk if you've got time.

PLEASE someone give me hope that we are not destined to live holed-up in our home because of racism and inflation, among other things. OR give me some tips to deal. My flight is booked and I'll be joining you all soon anyway because W is absolutely the light of my life, but please give me hope that a lot of these posts are blown out of proportion!

Thanks for your time!

[MadRussian]

Well ... if you read Philadelphia forum on this site you'll find out that Philadelphia full of crime, drugs, heavy traffic every day, scholls sucks big time, ...
Sometimes I think - Damn, how I live here?!?
... and answer myself - pretty good!
On your Oahu question:
1. Yes, there is some problems.
2. Yes, you have to be ready for that.
3. No, there are no paradise on this planet! Sorry!

[manoagirl]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSTL

My fiancee (black, "W") and I (white) are moving to Oahu as he has re-enlisted for 5 more years in the military after serving 2 tours in Iraq. (Yes, he's nuts. He's also a terrific leader and mentor and is great at what he does.) He will work on-base between deployments and I will telecommute from my current job. We'll be staying off-base for the entire time, so I'm hoping most of what I read here is false or grossly exaggerated.

You won't have problems because you are a mixed couple. The three things Hawaii is not crazy about is Military, tourist, and mainlanders. With that being said every persons experience is different. Some military like Hawaii some don't also retired Military is treated different than active personnel that live on the Island.

[NoMoreSTL]

Thanks Manoa and MadRussian, although I have to admit our future there still looks pretty grim. Do you have any pointers for me so everyone doesn't automatically assume I am a backwoods redneck dirtbag and W is a gang-banging thug, and treat us as such? It's really scary to leave everything you know to begin with, but to know that people are going to hate you immediately upon arrival in your destination is even scarier.

I try to treat everyone with respect from a high-ranking government official all the way down to a homeless man as long as they're not some kind of psycho; it's going to get real old and wear me down really fast emotionally if we are treated like dirt everywhere we go because of our skin color and/or because we happened to be born on the mainland through no fault or desire of our own.

I understand that there will be jerks (of any color, creed or nationality) that rub EVERYONE the wrong way. Hell, I'M bothered by tourists even when I AM a tourist, I can't imagine what it's like to have them in your backyard all. the. time.

What does one do (or NOT do) to get along with others who are not so willing to get along in HI? Are there things mainlanders commonly do that inadvertently set islanders off on a tirade?

**Oh man, I am waiting for a world where you don't have to ask these questions...**

Really, ANY insight or suggestions you have for me are greatly appreciated. I'm the type that likes to be as prepared as possible before I make a move. I don't want to accidentally step on any toes.

[manoagirl]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSTL

Thanks Manoa and MadRussian, although I have to admit our future there still looks pretty grim. Do you have any pointers for me so everyone doesn't automatically assume I am a backwoods redneck dirtbag and W is a gang-banging thug, and treat us as such? It's really scary to leave everything you know to begin with, but to know that people are going to hate you immediately upon arrival in your destination is even scarier.

I try to treat everyone with respect from a high-ranking government official all the way down to a homeless man as long as they're not some kind of psycho; it's going to get real old and wear me down really fast emotionally if we are treated like dirt everywhere we go because of our skin color and/or because we happened to be born on the mainland through no fault or desire of our own.

I understand that there will be jerks (of any color, creed or nationality) that rub EVERYONE the wrong way. Hell, I'M bothered by tourists even when I AM a tourist, I can't imagine what it's like to have them in your backyard all. the. time.

What does one do (or NOT do) to get along with others who are not so willing to get along in HI? Are there things mainlanders commonly do that inadvertently set islanders off on a tirade?

**Oh man, I am waiting for a world where you don't have to ask these questions...**

Really, ANY insight or suggestions you have for me are greatly appreciated. I'm the type that likes to be as prepared as possible before I make a move. I don't want to accidentally step on any toes.

To be honest with if you look for problems, then you just might run into problems. So first I would say give Hawaii a chance first don't judge people on the Islands based upon this forum because it really depends upon your personality and the amount of respect you show for other cultures on the Island. If your personality is rude or displayed as ethnocentric yes you will have problems. The fact that you are in a mix relationship shows that this may not be the case. Most locals do not view mainland culture as a superior culture in fact just the opposite. The fear is that too many people from the mainland will turn the Island into the mainland. If people love the mainland so much, then why not stay on the mainland. When locals move to the mainland they don't try to change it into Hawaii. If you want to live in Hawaii then learn local customs and culture this is taken as a sign of respect. Smile, be friendly and be polite and I am sure you will grow to like Island life. Hawaii was much nicer in the past and more polite when it was not so populated and some locals long for those days. I am not saying that it is right or wrong, but history has shown that the friendlier a culture is the more adapt that culture is to being invaded or over thrown.

[NoMoreSTL]

Originally Posted by manoagirl

If you want to live in Hawaii then learn local customs and culture this is taken as a sign of respect.

This may be a stupid question Manoagirl, but bear with me:

Is there a good resource you can recommend to find the facts on HI history and culture? As you might imagine, schools in St. Louis don't spend a lot of time on the subject. I tried a few books at the library, but they turned out to be generic South Pacific books (they were good though, so no worries) or plain old tourist guides.

I love cultural and ethnic diversity! I think so many different people living together on a relatively isolated island is a great example for the world as a whole. That's one of the reasons I was initially really excited about this move. Things tend to get stale and dilluted in the midwest.

*I apologize if it seems I am judging a book by its cover when it comes to HI; I assure you I'm not- It's not easy to find cold facts about daily living and lifestyles on the internet. This is why I brought my fears to the forefront so I can get some real truths.*

[cynmkolohe]

You will most likely be fine in Hawaii......

Getting out and exploring, not isolating yourself inside the military circle will help. Minimize time in bars patronized by primarily military....

If an Irish-looking Southern girl who never traveled far from the east coast before moving to Hawaii can find a home here...so can you!!

There are good tips and pointers to take away from this forum, but the "every day" experience of living in Hawaii is, in my opinion, pretty far from the picture that is painted in some of the rants here. Your experience might include some bumps in the road. And if you get a job in a place where there are "issues" due to co-workers, that will really color your perception. But, again, those are not things unique to Hawaii.

You are in for some wonderful opportunities. Take a deep breath, arrive with an open mind and go for it....though I've faced a few bumps in the road, I've never had a single regret about my decision to move here!

[manoagirl]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSTL

This may be a stupid question Manoagirl, but bear with me:

Is there a good resource you can recommend to find the facts on HI history and culture? As you might imagine, schools in St. Louis don't spend a lot of time on the subject. I tried a few books at the library, but they turned out to be generic South Pacific books (they were good though, so no worries) or plain old tourist guides.

I love cultural and ethnic diversity! I think so many different people living together on a relatively isolated island is a great example for the world as a whole. That's one of the reasons I was initially really excited about this move. Things tend to get stale and dilluted in the midwest.

*I apologize if it seems I am judging a book by its cover when it comes to HI; I assure you I'm not- It's not easy to find cold facts about daily living and lifestyles on the internet. This is why I brought my fears to the forefront so I can get some real truths.*

I agree experience of day to day living is the best but if you want to read up on the culture go the Hawaii public library, all types of book on Hawaiian and local culture just get a library card. Also don't be afraid to ask locals if you don't understand something. Never go empty handed if you get invited to someone house, bring a cake, or fruit basket etc.. If you did not it would be considered rude, and indicated an inability to share. Take off your shoes when entering someone house. This is considered very rude to walk in a persons house with shoes on. That might be viewed as you bringing out side dirt into someone house. Even if the house is dirty you still have to take off your shoes, because then it could be viewed as their house is too dirty so that is why you kept on your shoes, it all depends. Talk to the local Haoles that are residents on the Islands, they will help you to adjust and may have a better understanding of where you are coming from. I personally don't think you will have much problems at all because it sounds like you are open minded however prepare for culture shock.

[hotzcatz]

Originally Posted by NoMoreSTL

<SNIP>
What's the deal? Am I to believe that W and I are going to get there and:
1. My cat will be held in quarantine, regardless of my following every condition to the letter (only because HI's gov't is money-hungry?), where he will die because of the deplorable conditions in quarantine,
2. We will only be able to find & live in a drugged-up, cockroach-infested slum because we are not millionaires,
3. It will take W 2 hours to get to work and another 2 hours to get back,
4. It will take us 2 hours to get to the beach, where we will immediately be kicked out because I am white and/or because he is black and/or because we are a mixed-race couple,
5. We will be dirt poor and living on Ramen noodles and what we can find at the farmer's market.

<SNIP>
PLEASE someone give me hope that we are not destined to live holed-up in our home because of racism and inflation, among other things. OR give me some tips to deal. My flight is booked and I'll be joining you all soon anyway because W is absolutely the light of my life, but please give me hope that a lot of these posts are blown out of proportion!

Thanks for your time!

[HR]

Aloha St. Louie,

No worries, it won't be as bad as you think! Most of those rants are written for the "moving to Paradise" folks who want to move to Hawaii and envision living on a deserted beach with half nekkid servers bringing them fruity drinks with paper umbrellas in them - all while watching whales and dolphins jumping under a rainbow, of course.

1. Follow the quarantine rules, save all the documentation and your cat should be fine. Even if the worst happens and it gets put into quarantine it still isn't that bad. My sister-in-law brought her dog in and a friend brought in a cat before the new quarantine laws and the quarantine area is a bit dismal but perfectly survivable by your pet if the "worst" should happen. It isn't likely to happen, though, if you've followed all the rules.

2. Hawaii doesn't have all that many "slum" areas as the way the mainland defines "slums". All the housing areas are small and all jammed into each other so less than desirable housing will be next to big fancy housing areas. You, will, however, have cockaroaches. Even the big fancy houses have cockaroaches. They get up to two inches long and they fly where ever they want to and sometimes they want to live in mansions so they do.

3. Depending on where you live, this could be true. It won't be two hours rushing about in traffic, it will be two hours sitting in traffic. You may want to look into getting a bus pass so you can be sitting on a bus reading a book or crocheting or something instead of sitting in traffic burning up your own gasoline.

4. I don't think you can get two hours away from the beach anywhere on Oahu. Beaches are everywhere. Why would they kick you out for being a mixed race couple? You are both mainlanders so you aren't a mixed race couple.

Race in Hawaii is usually used as an identifier. "W" can say you are "the haole over there in the group by the beach" and folks will know who you are since you aren't the Chinese, Korean, Tongan, Filipino or Japanese one. We also have a lot of hapa folks who are half of one da kine and half of another such as Barak Obama. He's hapa. Then there are "chop suey" folks who are so many different varieties it takes too long to label them all. Usually each race is known for certain tendencies. Chinese folks are known for being careful with money and gathering into a hui (group) to get stuff done. Japanese folks are known for following rules and regulations and being very clean and tidy. Hapa children are known for being beautiful. Is it racist? Probably, but it is how groups of folks are seen in Hawaii.

5. I don't think it is possible to be dirt poor in Hawaii. Have you seen the price of dirt around here? Anyone with dirt is rich.

Saimin (Ramen) noodles are tasty and found on many restaurant menus. Mix in an egg and some vegetables when cooking it and it is even better. Fruit and vegetables at the farmer's market are really good! Try shopping in Chinatown, too, for inexpensive fruits and vegetables. Eat stuff produced locally if you can manage it and you'll find less expensive food. Chinatown has interesting shops and such although if you are used to Safeway it might be a bit of a culture shock. Oh, you'll have access to the base grocery stores, huh? Well, that should save money, too.

Here's a few tips on getting along in your new home:

Be polite and non-judgmental. Just cuz they do it differently on the mainland nobody wants to hear about it here. Things will be done in a very slow and very ineffective manner. Just let it go, it doesn't matter if it is ineffective - why hurry? Is it gonna snow soon?

Never say anything bad about anybody. It is an island and everyone eventually knows everyone else and many of them are all related to each other in some fashion. Not as much among the military, but among folks living here, quite frequently. Smile a lot and be happy. Happy folks get along better.

Ask your neighbors for advice and ask how they do thing. There is probably a good reason why it is done the way it is done around here. Instead of asking your neighbor where to find a good furniture store, ask them what sort of furniture would be best for your house. That allows for more interesting answers.

When visiting folks, leave your slippers (mainland folks call them flip-flops) at the door. Never return a dish empty. If you have too many avocados on your tree, offer some to your neighbors.

On the mainland they say the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Here they say the nail that sticks up gets hit on the head. Be accepting, be respectful and blend in.

It won't be a thing like Saint Louis but it should be a wonderful place, especially if you have your "W" with you. If anything else, it will be very educational, don'tcha think?

[Calico Salsa]

Hi NoMoreSTL,

There may be a lot of negative posted here, but there is also a lot of positive. Plus it's just possible that the dramatic posts get more reads and answers and so seem like more the topic.

As far as what you can do to fit in, you sound pretty sensitive, that likely means you will be observant and will take your cues from those around you.

Some simple things that will be appreciated -

• As mentioned, take off your shoes in everyone else's house
• If offered food, it can be considered rude to turn it down.
• If you have a harvest (like bananas, share)
• Let people merge into traffic ahead of you, and blink your lights at them to let them know
• When people let you merge in, wave thank you
• Look people in the eye, say hello and thank you; don't treat people like "the help" in stores or restaurant

You'll be fine.