Appraiser and home inspection - differ (Honolulu, Pahoa: appointed, for sale, 2009)

[1freespirit]

Aloha,

We are in the process of purchasing our Winter retreat. It is a REO property sold as is (like most are).

After our offer was accepted - we hired a home inspector to inspect. The report came back in Fair - Good overall condition. Some things noted were mostly cosmetic, and there is one patio door that is out (boarded up), some Vinyl fooring is bubbled up but they stated sub- floor is fine, some square ceiling tiles have come down and need to be tacked/stapled back up. The home inspectoin report - noted no real noticible signs of pest infestation. So all in all not bad. The inspector on a personal note (verbally) said the house and lot is nice and with a little upgrades and minor repairs if will make a nice home and that it is structurally fine with no major immediate repairs are needed at this time. Roof everything checked out fine and has been replaced in the last 10 years.

Well then the lender (of course procedure) hires a appraiser to come out. Geesh you would think the home is ready to fall down or something.
The appraiser listed the home as non-inhabital in its current condition and listed a bunch of repairs to be made to make it in liveable conditon.

Appriaser noted the ceiling tiles - and said the ceiling needs to be repaired or replaced to make it liveable.. ?? Who cares if a couple ceiling tiles are down this is cosmetic.. the roof checked out fine and there is no leaks.

Appraiser noted the floor needs to be replaced as a conditon to make it liveable. How is having to replace Vinyl flooring making a place un-inhabital.When the inspector said the sub-floor is fine just the Vinyl looks bad and bubbled you may want to replace. Again Cosmetic I would think.

Appraiser noted the boarded up patio door - needs to be replaced as its un livable with it being boarded up. I guess having 4 other doors in the house means nothing without this one door.

Appraiser noted - Termite infestation - need to have house tented.. inspector said they seen no noticeble signs of termite or pest infestation and that there was signs that the houes had been tented at one time but the date as when we unknown.

I directly called the appraiser and asked some questions (he was relectant to talk to me as the lender hired him although I paid for his services) The appraiser told me 3/4th of the ceiling tiles were down - I KNOW this as fact it s not the case. It is just a small section about 4x6 area and I told him so.

He directly came out and said this home is in really bad/ruff shape. I Informed him many others are stating just the opposite.

I asked about his termite statement and that it does not co-inside with with the Inspector stated.. he then acted "surprised" that we actually had a home inspection done prior to him appraising. And said well maybe it is old signs of termites or something. I don't think he thought we hired a inspector.

I must note we have not physically viewed this property ourselves as we are on the mainland. But I have about 45 minutes of video of house that was taken for us including of the lot/landscaping along with about 100 photos. Paid for a complete home inspection (which came out fine). Had 2 different people go out and view for there unbias opinion. And all has checked out great - EXCEPT for what the apprasiers comments were.

So now I am waiting to hear if the lender is going to require to have all these (as far as Im concerned) cosmetic repairs done as a condition of the loan. Im just shocked by what the appraiser said versa's the home inspector. Plus the comparible properties were like ones that did require extensive work, I know because I called on a few of them when they were listed for sale before they were sold and this is what was told to me.. the comparible properties he listed.. some needed all new plumbing, most all windows gone, big holes in walls, roofs needed to be replaced, electrical etc. There is NO way this house is like any of his comparible properties his listed..

The appraisel even after his defects did appraise out at about the asking price on the property and we area paying about 40%-45% down. But I guess my concern is now since the appraiser made the property out to look like its ready to be tore down. Is the bank going to require us to do these repairs first even though we are putting a large amount down? We really don't want the expense to fly over there and quickly make repairs on things that are only cosmetic in the first place. The flight alone is not that cheap. We were planing to come out for the months of Feb and March and remodel the way we wanted.

Im just in shock over the appraisel and so are a few other people. I mean when the bank foreclosed the person still had all his furniture in it and it looked like a real nice place (as I have the photos the realator took before he or they went in and removed all the furniture etc.

The patio door was busted out by vandels after the fact.

Any suggestions - Why would the appraiser state the condition of the house so much different then the inspector? Its like inspector give BIG thumbs up and appraiser gave BIG thumbs down. I would think inspector knows more then an appraiser who just gives there opinion on visual.. where as inpector crawls all over and inspects thourally.

Sorry just felt like venting is all!

[hotzcatz]

Considering the price of houses, don'tcha think it would be a good thing to inspect it personally before buying it? The house inspectors look at the house, but what if you hate the surrounding neighborhood? Do they check night time noise? Fighting neighbors? Fields of fighting roosters? Inaccessible because of heavy traffic during certain times of the day?

Which island is it on and what rough geographical area is it in?

Who benefits if the appraiser comes in with a low number?

[1freespirit]

We had a couple friends of ours view the property, neighbors, house, traffic, location etc..
Its hard for anyone to check fighting neighbors I guess when they are looking for property , but if there are no neighbors close by and your on a dead end road I doubt if traffic or neighbors will be a problem.

They gave a thumbs up and took lots of videos for us. We feel confident that the place will suit our needs.

The appraisel came in a tad bit higher then the price we paid so that is not the issue, and we plan on putting 40-50% as downpayment.

Just bugs me that - now we might have to go over there and do alot of cosmetic repairs to get the loan before closing. Like replace the kitchen vinyl tile, tack the ceiling tiles back up... stupid little things that has nothing to do with the house being livable as its strickly cosmetic. So then the expense of a addional flight, and cost for lodging (because you cannot stay in the house while you are doing repairs because the closing would not have happened yet- so its actually not your house yet). So an extra min about $3K just to do the extra trip. We were planning to fly over AFTER closing and secure the property, clean it up a bit and stay for a week or 2 (in the house) and get it in order and then come back in JAn-March and stay for a few months to actually remodel the way we want.

Not a big deal all in all - the price was right the lot is landscaped very nice, its secluded for now (until people decide to build up around it).

I'm not to worried as if the loan is contigent on doing cosmetic repairs in order to get the loan - we will just say screw it and pay cash. Not that we wanted to do that as it would take all our savings. But it is an option if need be. I never will nor will EVER apply for a mortage again. I usually pay cash or contract for deed and after this - the waiting, all the questions, you feel like your begging for a minimal amount of $$ almost less the what new truck cost. It just don't seem worth it - way to stressful and I don't like to feel like I am begging which is how the banks make you feel.

Just don't understand how everyone who has seen the house LOVES the place and says GREAT Deal, even the inspector... and then the appraiser says its un-inhabital until some cosmetic issues are addressed.

We have been to the Big Island for years and have stayed for months at a time, and this is where the house is located on the Puna side (where we wanted to be) - we are comfortable in getting a place without actually viewing, and the price could not be beat - at the time when the housing market was strong - this house sold for $150,000 more then what we are paying for it less then 24 months ago. So if it was worth X amount less then 2 years ago, I think it is worth what we are paying.

Just bugged me how an appraiser and actuall inspector could differ so much - thats all.

Maholo,

[nwcountrygal]

Uhmmm ok ... I looked at property in Pahoa all last winter and April.... Maybe it is one of the houses I looked at. It is amazing what can happen in a couple of months in Hawaii to a vacant house. Personally there is no way in hell after looking online and then in person at the houses I would ever purchase without seeing it in person. So many places looked soooo good and price was sooo right until I got to the house. You sound like you know what you are doing and don't mind spending the $$ when you get there to fix it up. I guess you will be ok. It is pretty easy if you know the areas of what streets to not be on - where there are roosters - what neighbors you want to be around by being there in person..The feel of the area makes a huge deal to me - but maybe that isn't you. I would always plan on tenting a house (me) if it was empty or not. A closed up house can change huge with mold in a matter of a couple of weeks.

that being said - how can it be so differnt ... Aloha welcome to Hawaii.... it doesn't have to make sense and many cases wont is what I have found. Good luck.

[SkyBob]

Originally Posted by nwcountrygal

I would always plan on tenting a house (me) if it was empty or not. A closed up house can change huge with mold in a matter of a couple of weeks.

How do the very wealthy people deal with this issue on their Hawaii vacation home? Is it that they are so rich that they have somebody come frequently to "freshen" up the place or do they hire house-sitters?

If that's the case - how do I get a job like that?

Bob

[1freespirit]

Originally Posted by nwcountrygal

I would always plan on tenting a house (me) if it was empty or not.

What do you mean by tenting? Are you referring to tenting a house for termites? If so is there any other way to control termites if the house has them? Inspector said there wasn't - but appriaser said there was. I tend to side with the inspector on that one.. but anyrate we planned on having a termite inspection once we closed.

I have a large family and we will be taking turns staying at the property vacationing etc. I don't think it will be vacant for many months, I hope anyways. If so any pointers on how to keep the mold down? We are not rich by any means and the house is simple, quaint, secluded and cute... it will be our tropical hide-a-way!

Yes I totally know what you mean about how photos, can look so different then the actual house when you see it. We went to the Big Island - March 2009 and looked at about 30 different properties.. and more so then not the photos looked way better then the place. That is why we chose to have the house professionally inspected... and also had friends of ours physcially view the property. I trust their judgement, and we are willing to take the risk. the price was so reasonable that I am sure we will have no problem getting our money back out of it once the market rises again.

Aloha and Maholo for the Welcome.. .. we have always loved Hawaii - and looked at others areas of the mainland before we made our decision, we kept coming back to Hawaii. My husband was born in Honolulu when Hawaii was just a territory and not a state. ( so I guess that makes him a native in a sense)

[nwcountrygal]

Good luck.... there are many posts from the Puna area that give good advice. I have read online of a natural product for cockroaches but haven't tried it. I am not so familar with the termites as from where they don't exist. After looking at the property's I would prefer the ceader or redwood built for protection after that I don't know another way around the tenting. Someone else may - would also love to hear it. Yes tenting for termites. Not worth the structual damage by not doing it in my opinon. What area are you looking at buying in if you don't mind me asking..

I am not rich either however when I purchase still haven't - going back in the fall. I have found friends to rent and also someone to vacation rental it for me along with theirs. Also looking at Duplex units - this is why I haven't bought yet. Looking for income producing (within normal reason) that will support itself while I am gone or at least help. While gone off island I am working.

AS far as taking care of it and freashing up! That is called friends!!! In my experience. I have left my car with friends and they even took it in for a saftey and changed a tire for me! Aloha is grand!

[bustaduke]

Originally Posted by 1freespirit

Aloha,

We are in the process of purchasing our Winter retreat. It is a REO property sold as is (like most are).

After our offer was accepted - we hired a home inspector to inspect. The report came back in Fair - Good overall condition. Some things noted were mostly cosmetic, and there is one patio door that is out (boarded up), some Vinyl fooring is bubbled up but they stated sub- floor is fine, some square ceiling tiles have come down and need to be tacked/stapled back up. The home inspectoin report - noted no real noticible signs of pest infestation. So all in all not bad. The inspector on a personal note (verbally) said the house and lot is nice and with a little upgrades and minor repairs if will make a nice home and that it is structurally fine with no major immediate repairs are needed at this time. Roof everything checked out fine and has been replaced in the last 10 years.

Well then the lender (of course procedure) hires a appraiser to come out. Geesh you would think the home is ready to fall down or something.
The appraiser listed the home as non-inhabital in its current condition and listed a bunch of repairs to be made to make it in liveable conditon.

Appriaser noted the ceiling tiles - and said the ceiling needs to be repaired or replaced to make it liveable.. ?? Who cares if a couple ceiling tiles are down this is cosmetic.. the roof checked out fine and there is no leaks.

Appraiser noted the floor needs to be replaced as a conditon to make it liveable. How is having to replace Vinyl flooring making a place un-inhabital.When the inspector said the sub-floor is fine just the Vinyl looks bad and bubbled you may want to replace. Again Cosmetic I would think.

Appraiser noted the boarded up patio door - needs to be replaced as its un livable with it being boarded up. I guess having 4 other doors in the house means nothing without this one door.

Appraiser noted - Termite infestation - need to have house tented.. inspector said they seen no noticeble signs of termite or pest infestation and that there was signs that the houes had been tented at one time but the date as when we unknown.

I directly called the appraiser and asked some questions (he was relectant to talk to me as the lender hired him although I paid for his services) The appraiser told me 3/4th of the ceiling tiles were down - I KNOW this as fact it s not the case. It is just a small section about 4x6 area and I told him so.

He directly came out and said this home is in really bad/ruff shape. I Informed him many others are stating just the opposite.

I asked about his termite statement and that it does not co-inside with with the Inspector stated.. he then acted "surprised" that we actually had a home inspection done prior to him appraising. And said well maybe it is old signs of termites or something. I don't think he thought we hired a inspector.

I must note we have not physically viewed this property ourselves as we are on the mainland. But I have about 45 minutes of video of house that was taken for us including of the lot/landscaping along with about 100 photos. Paid for a complete home inspection (which came out fine). Had 2 different people go out and view for there unbias opinion. And all has checked out great - EXCEPT for what the apprasiers comments were.

So now I am waiting to hear if the lender is going to require to have all these (as far as Im concerned) cosmetic repairs done as a condition of the loan. Im just shocked by what the appraiser said versa's the home inspector. Plus the comparible properties were like ones that did require extensive work, I know because I called on a few of them when they were listed for sale before they were sold and this is what was told to me.. the comparible properties he listed.. some needed all new plumbing, most all windows gone, big holes in walls, roofs needed to be replaced, electrical etc. There is NO way this house is like any of his comparible properties his listed..

The appraisel even after his defects did appraise out at about the asking price on the property and we area paying about 40%-45% down. But I guess my concern is now since the appraiser made the property out to look like its ready to be tore down. Is the bank going to require us to do these repairs first even though we are putting a large amount down? We really don't want the expense to fly over there and quickly make repairs on things that are only cosmetic in the first place. The flight alone is not that cheap. We were planing to come out for the months of Feb and March and remodel the way we wanted.

Im just in shock over the appraisel and so are a few other people. I mean when the bank foreclosed the person still had all his furniture in it and it looked like a real nice place (as I have the photos the realator took before he or they went in and removed all the furniture etc.

The patio door was busted out by vandels after the fact.

Any suggestions - Why would the appraiser state the condition of the house so much different then the inspector? Its like inspector give BIG thumbs up and appraiser gave BIG thumbs down. I would think inspector knows more then an appraiser who just gives there opinion on visual.. where as inpector crawls all over and inspects thourally.

Sorry just felt like venting is all!

Get a copy of the Home Inspector's Errors & Omissions Insurance Certificate and the Appraisers Errors & Omissions Insurance Certificate.

Find out which one is telling the truth and doing the job you hired them to do and then hold the other one responsible, this is why they carry insurance.

If the home inspector missed everything that the appraiser found he can be held responsible for the repairs.

If the appraiser is listing things that are not true he can be held responsible for you losing the house if the sale falls through.

busta

[cynmkolohe]

Do you have a buyers agent? Is your appraiser assigned to the job via changes required by HVCC ( https://www.efanniemae.com/sf/guides...f/hvccfaqs.pdf ) ?

[1freespirit]

Well we have decided for now just to pay cash for the house (have to borrow a small bit from a family memeber) and then after 6 months refiance through the bank we have banked with for the last 20 year, already talked to my bank they said not a problem (then pay my family member back). It was going to be a big hassel and added unnecessary expense to fly over there and quickly make all all the bogus repairs the lenders appointed appraiser made to be elligible for a minimal mortgage/loan amount we were requesting. This way we can pick the time we want to go over and make repairs/ clean up etc.

Anyrate we are Hawaii bound - atleast for a few months out of every year - who knows down the road could be full time! We are looking forward to meeting all our future new friends!