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Old 08-23-2009, 08:18 PM
 
18,325 posts, read 18,903,953 times
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Hawaii and Hawaiians should have more influence over their lands and the politics that govern her. something will come to pass in the next decades that will equalize things a bit more for the Hawaiian people. Hawaii was stolen. Hawaii would be just fine governing themselves just like any other free democratic society.
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Old 08-23-2009, 09:23 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
56 posts, read 153,333 times
Reputation: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick St John View Post
Well then, Happy Statehood Birthday, Hawaii.
Having you with us is great. And it more than makes up for that Alaska thing.
See you in a couple of months.
Is that a bad comment about Alaska? What bad thing? I moved from Alaska to Hawaii. And right now after living in both states, Alaska is way more cheaper. I have to show my pride for Alaska too.
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Old 08-24-2009, 01:27 AM
 
Location: Hawaii-Puna District
3,752 posts, read 11,455,356 times
Reputation: 2481
Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui View Post
Hawaii and Hawaiians should have more influence over their lands and the politics that govern her. something will come to pass in the next decades that will equalize things a bit more for the Hawaiian people. Hawaii was stolen. Hawaii would be just fine governing themselves just like any other free democratic society.
I have to disagree. Hawaii's government is BROKEN. Finances are a joke. Bribes and corruption are rampant. If the threat of US federal laws were not there, Hawaii would be in total shambles.
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Old 08-24-2009, 12:04 PM
 
18,325 posts, read 18,903,953 times
Reputation: 15627
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdand3boys View Post
I have to disagree. Hawaii's government is BROKEN. Finances are a joke. Bribes and corruption are rampant. If the threat of US federal laws were not there, Hawaii would be in total shambles.
you could say the same thing about the government of any of the states on the mainland as well. Ca. is a mess as well as other states. the US way is not a guarentee that things won't break. law would not go away if the hawaiian's were given their land back or given more control, this was their land and the us took it illegally. law, how to live, maintain an economy is not something so complicated that government run by hawaiian's couldn't do it. if someone came to your home state years ago, stole it, took root there, do you think they should be allowed to govern for the rest of time without giving any of it back? would the people of your home state be content that someone else is running their land just because it runs somewhat smoothly?
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Old 08-24-2009, 05:01 PM
 
Location: Moku Nui, Hawaii
11,048 posts, read 23,865,015 times
Reputation: 10901
Precisely. Hawaii's government is broken. Isn't this an indictment of statehood, then?

As a monarchy, Hawaii had standing in the international community and a valid governing body. They unfortunately had some huge medical problems where much of their revenue base (citizens) died off from imported diseases. Had the Hawaiian people not experienced such a huge die off their history would now be a lot different. Kamehameha the First also consolidated the islands under one chiefdom (which then became the Kingdom of Hawaii) so when the rule of the islands was lost they were all lost together. Had each island retained it's own sovereignty they could not have all be taken over at the same time.

At this point in time, it is hard to conceive of the islands being a sovereign state again but folks are beginning to legally contest the illegal overthrow of the kingdom. Currently in County Council are some folks contesting the County's ability to sell some lands. The old order of land ownership - check out the Great Mahele - was through land grants given out by the King and they were written in Hawaiian (in glorious copperplate handwriting) and signed by the King. In these land grants, when they are translated from the Hawaiian the title of land can not be sold or given away for more than the lifetime of the seller. Whoever the "owner" of the land is, they can sell their ownership of the land for the duration of their life. After they die, the land reverts to their heir which generally seemed to be the eldest child. However, this concept runs counter to other ways folks look at land ownership so the translations were not correctly translated. When you buy property in Hawaii, the title company will only guarantee the title back to the overthrow of the monarchy. So far there have been several properties returned to the rightful owners as per the King's signature, it will be interesting to see how this continues.
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Old 08-24-2009, 06:16 PM
 
Location: Was in Western New York but now in Hilo Hawaii
1,234 posts, read 4,573,522 times
Reputation: 454

This is what I wanted to see!

Keep it up I will insert my 2 cents later
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