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Modhatter used the word attack. It was not my word choice and thus in responding I should have put the word "attack" in quote marks.
No one is out to spout anything about "the rich," only to provide a larger perspective of the unfortunate situation in our country and how it is always on those with much less income that the axe falls. But that is the American way.
An astonishing 43.4 percent of Americans now pay zero or negative federal income taxes. The number of single or jointly-filing "taxpayers" - the word must be applied sparingly - who pay no taxes or receive government handouts has reached 65.6 million, out of a total of 151 million.
Yes they may pay local or state taxes but Medicare and Social Security are federal programs and this thread is about Medicare. Now what percentage of Americans are contributing much of anything to Medicare?
The challenge facing us as a nation is to define and differentiate between the deserving and non deserving poor senior citizen. It would appear it is fiscally impossible to pull all fully under the protective umbrella as we now define it. We either push some out into the rain or begin to differentiate umbrella's. The wealthy and those who have prepared will always be able to afford and provide their own care within reason. It is those unable to provide for themselves that continuously drives the equation, here there and everywhere. It is hard for many of us to have this discussion without thinking about the PIGS.
The rich are subsidizing the poor and the poor are subsidizing the rich and everyone is subsidizing the corporations and banks. Seems like a welfare state to me.
Funny - I've never seen a corporation at a doctor's office (this thread is about Medicare). Robyn
The rich are subsidizing the poor and the poor are subsidizing the rich and everyone is subsidizing the corporations and banks. Seems like a welfare state to me.
Yes we tend to feed the hand that feeds us. Corporations hire and pay payroll taxes and banks lend and provide the financial infrastructure for a our complex modern world. It would seem that part of the success China and other countries are having is a result of their promoting and giving favorite status to their corporations. Perhaps in your world the message to corporations in this country is to relocate to other countries with more favorable tax and corporate support benefits. Singapore and San Francisco come to mind. Yes the great bastion of liberalism San Francisco is another country to many. Not me but to many others from what I hear.
Location: Los Angeles, but looking for my niche in ME, or OR
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Originally Posted by newenglandgirl
The rich are subsidizing the poor and the poor are subsidizing the rich and everyone is subsidizing the corporations and banks. Seems like a welfare state to me.
What I find disturbing about this whole discussion in the country today is the lack of empathy and the lack of a sense of community with others, many of whom are less fortunate. Do so many people really care so little about their less fortunate brother and sister humans?
Medicare was enacted because seniors, most of them, couldn't get affordable health insurance. In the US not having affordable health insurance basically means a life of illness and early death. Are we proposing to cut Medicare to "eliminate" seniors, the people who raised us and worked to keep the country going for so many years, because they never earned big incomes as lawyers or whatever, or became disabled early and couldn't work? Is that how we save money and save the wealthy from paying more taxes? Do we choose not to care?
The problem isn;'t saving money its spenging money we don't have at the rate of 40 cents for every dollar.We are to the point where their are less and less people actually contributing to the tax fund that funds more and more entitlements.
What I find disturbing about this whole discussion in the country today is the lack of empathy and the lack of a sense of community with others, many of whom are less fortunate. Do so many people really care so little about their less fortunate brother and sister humans?
Medicare was enacted because seniors, most of them, couldn't get affordable health insurance. In the US not having affordable health insurance basically means a life of illness and early death. Are we proposing to cut Medicare to "eliminate" seniors, the people who raised us and worked to keep the country going for so many years, because they never earned big incomes as lawyers or whatever, or became disabled early and couldn't work? Is that how we save money and save the wealthy from paying more taxes? Do we choose not to care?
The problem is that most seniors (and other people in this country for that matter) are neither poor nor rich (or disabled either). Most people are middle class. Yet all I hear is whining about the poor - and vilification of the rich. What about the 80% in the middle - who aren't at either end of the bell curve? Frankly - I am sick of the violins played for the poor - and the pitchforks aimed at the rich. If we are serious about doing anything about Medicare - which is basically a middle class entitlement* - we must talk about the 80% of all people in the middle. And that is apparently a discussion that most middle class Americans don't want to have. Are *you* willing to talk about middle class people?
On my part - I think it's disgusting - adults behaving like spoiled children. But my husband and I use our observations mainly to plan for *our* future. If I live long enough - I think traditional Medicare will come to resemble what Medicaid is today - and people who don't want to be treated like Medicaid patients will have to be prepared to cough up more dollars than they thought they'd have to cough up. My husband and I are still saving pretty significant amounts of money today (even though we're in our mid-60's) so we are prepared for that possibility. Robyn
* - many really poor people - even those on Medicare - qualify for Medicaid as well. Medicaid offers various benefits to the poor on a state by state basis. This is a general statement of how Florida Medicaid works:
Medicaid is often confused with Medicare. They are, however, two separate programs. Medicare is a medical insurance program for which, like Social Security, eligibility depends on a person's work history. Medicaid is a need-based medical assistance program primarily for low income persons age 65 or older, disabled and under 65, or visually impaired and under 65. In Florida, if a person is qualified to receive SSI, he or she also qualifies to receive Medicaid. Medicaid patients do not have to pay for any covered hospital or medical services. The Medicaid program pays the health care provider directly. However, not all health care providers will accept Medicaid. For more information, call the Florida Health and Rehabilitative Services Department at (904) 487-1111.
What I find disturbing about this whole discussion in the country today is the lack of empathy and the lack of a sense of community with others, many of whom are less fortunate. Do so many people really care so little about their less fortunate brother and sister humans?
Medicare was enacted because seniors, most of them, couldn't get affordable health insurance. In the US not having affordable health insurance basically means a life of illness and early death. Are we proposing to cut Medicare to "eliminate" seniors, the people who raised us and worked to keep the country going for so many years, because they never earned big incomes as lawyers or whatever, or became disabled early and couldn't work? Is that how we save money and save the wealthy from paying more taxes? Do we choose not to care?
You have to always have a perspective of what is the focus of the conversation. If the focus of the conversation is sociological in might go in one direction if it is fiscal a very different one. The reality is the credit card is maxed out and the bank is close to saying whoa pay up and no more loans. That circumstance is a calamity for this nation. With SS and Medicare being such a large part of the budget it is impossible for them not to be part of the chopping block discussion.
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(this thread is about Medicare). Robyn
