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Darstar, I think what others are saying is that money always comes with special privileges. Even in countries that discourage this. People with money will always insist on the best, especially if it comes to their health care, and will always find a way to obtain what ordinary society my not be able to afford.
It would be nice to dream that some day everyone would have access to the latest and greatest technology available in medicine. But with the costs associated with that statement, I am afraid it will always be reserved for only those who have the financial means. That is not to say that I am not for a single payer system. I am, because I think it will be the most economical solution (if our government would ever work on our behalf)
and it would be the most inclusive (not leaving anyone out)
Right now, we are struggling with the hope and desire for just a decent level of care to be available for everyone who needs it in our country. If you want to shoot for the stars, be my guest. I am just hoping to be able to make it to the moon at this point. Whether you are talking single payer, or private insurance companies, there is always a "limit" that has been placed on health care for most folks. When you have sufficient money, those rules don't apply to you.
Actually that is not always true.Most of the people signing up for the trials are far from wealthily. I think what the wealthy get as an advantage is not actual health care, but axcess to it., or quicker service and maybe from a private doctor that has a closed practice and a retainer is required for the axcess.
Actually that is not always true.Most of the people signing up for the trials are far from wealthily. I think what the wealthy get as an advantage is not actual health care, but axcess to it., or quicker service and maybe from a private doctor that has a closed practice and a retainer is required for the axcess.
Yes, clinical trials are open, but they are experimental. Not to say a wealthy person would not pursue a trial when all other avenues are not promising. But there are some drugs( as an example targeted radioactive) that I am familiar with for my particular type of cancer that is no longer available (paid for by insurance companies) because of the cost involved. When it works, it works very well and has saved many lives, but it's too expensive to produce. But for people with money, it's available.
Also, there are treatments and breakthroughs in other countries not available in this country yet. The average Joe can not afford to fly to Barcelona to have this treatment performed, but someone of wealth can. Also, acclaimed surgeons of a very specific operation, usually only accept patients who have very generous insurance policies (those Cadillac plans) There are always exceptions though.
No amount of money can buy guaranteed mortality for you when you have a terminal illness, no matter how wealthy you are (As Onassis family would attest to). But if you have money or fame, doctors will clamor to try. I have had the experience of being in the company of some very famous people, and I can tell you the treatment you get when you are famous is very different from the treatment you get when you are Joe Ordinary.
Yes, clinical trials are open, but they are experimental. Not to say a wealthy person would not pursue a trial when all other avenues are not promising. But there are some drugs( as an example targeted radioactive) that I am familiar with for my particular type of cancer that is no longer available (paid for by insurance companies) because of the cost involved. When it works, it works very well and has saved many lives, but it's too expensive to produce. But for people with money, it's available.
Also, there are treatments and breakthroughs in other countries not available in this country yet. The average Joe can not afford to fly to Barcelona to have this treatment performed, but someone of wealth can. Also, acclaimed surgeons of a very specific operation, usually only accept patients who have very generous insurance policies (those Cadillac plans) There are always exceptions though.
No amount of money can buy guaranteed mortality for you when you have a terminal illness, no matter how wealthy you are (As Onassis family would attest to). But if you have money or fame, doctors will clamor to try. I have had the experience of being in the company of some very famous people, and I can tell you the treatment you get when you are famous is very different from the treatment you get when you are Joe Ordinary.
Then we agree money can save your life.......don't leave home without it...
Actually that is not always true.Most of the people signing up for the trials are far from wealthily. I think what the wealthy get as an advantage is not actual health care, but axcess to it., or quicker service and maybe from a private doctor that has a closed practice and a retainer is required for the axcess.
Actually I think you will find a good number of people in clinical trials that are wealthy. It has nothing to do with being able to afford the care. Often these people are in trials for new medications/treatments for cancer drugs or other for other conditions. I've looked into a couple clinical trials myself. We certainly are not rich but we have good insurance and a couple dollars in the bank. I've looked into those trials in order to have some technology sooner then I could get it otherwise...
I have friends that have done clinical trials for cancer treatment, with great success and they are rich.
Actually I think you will find a good number of people in clinical trials that are wealthy. It has nothing to do with being able to afford the care. Often these people are in trials for new medications/treatments for cancer drugs or other for other conditions. I've looked into a couple clinical trials myself. We certainly are not rich but we have good insurance and a couple dollars in the bank. I've looked into those trials in order to have some technology sooner then I could get it otherwise...
I have friends that have done clinical trials for cancer treatment, with great success and they are rich.
I have never seen a study that compared income of those participating in clinical trials, but according to the CISCRP in a 2006 study/survey found that sadly the public perception as to why people participate is that they are ether "very sick, no options " or they were in it to make money. Also , about 2 per cent of Americans get involved , mostly because the people are not aware of these clinical trials.Many of the trials have been delayed or canceled due to the lack of participation.
Switching tracks here , according to a 2007 poll conducted by Research America , 69 per cent of Americans are more likely to support a Presidential candidate in favor of Federal spending on medical, health and scientific research. What I do find very interesting is that so few Americans know about these trials, that includes about 4 per cent of Doctors discuss the options to their patients.( there maybe several reasons for this, facts are unknown as to the Doctors actual awareness ) Your interest is obviously the exception out there and your "technology " advancement does consider that you maybe in the medical field in some way ?...or not , knowledge is a good thing no matter how we slice and dice it.
No, I'm not in the medical field but my Dr. talked to me about a couple trials.
Keep in mind that these trials are almost exclusively at large teaching hospitals/clinics and not everyone has access to or lives close enough to those to participate. They also have very select criteria which limits numbers. It's also why I contend that you will find that most people in the trials are not poor--there is an education factor that goes along with these trials. People rarely get paid for trials--and if they do it is more parking/mileage reimbursement vs actually getting paid.
I have never seen a study that compared income of those participating in clinical trials, but according to the CISCRP in a 2006 study/survey found that sadly the public perception as to why people participate is that they are ether "very sick, no options " or they were in it to make money. Also , about 2 per cent of Americans get involved , mostly because the people are not aware of these clinical trials.Many of the trials have been delayed or canceled due to the lack of participation.
Switching tracks here , according to a 2007 poll conducted by Research America , 69 per cent of Americans are more likely to support a Presidential candidate in favor of Federal spending on medical, health and scientific research. What I do find very interesting is that so few Americans know about these trials, that includes about 4 per cent of Doctors discuss the options to their patients.( there maybe several reasons for this, facts are unknown as to the Doctors actual awareness ) Your interest is obviously the exception out there and your "technology " advancement does consider that you maybe in the medical field in some way ?...or not , knowledge is a good thing no matter how we slice and dice it.
As a rule, doctors don't like to send away business. If a trial is being conducted in their hospital that may be a different case. Also, that is not to say that there are not some doctors who would seek to do what might be in the best interest of the patient either. My personal experience was different, in that the oncologist I was going to use, did try and talk me out of it in favor or his traditional treatment. That's when I decided to drop him.
When it comes to knowing when you are receiving the best advice from a medical doctor, it can be a very slippery slope. This current book I am reading talks about this a lot. (I'm not recommending the book) The doctor states that most people do not know when they get good good care (provided they survive). They tend to judge their doctor by their bedside manners. If the doctor appears to be a good listener and seems compassionate, then people assume that is a good doctor. But he claims, nothing could be further from the truth. He sites examples in his book of such doctors, who had patients swooning to have them as their doctor, when in fact their skills could be quite bad and some down right dangerous, but they had wonderful mannerisms.
We really don't have any good access to good doctor skills. We can obtain patients recommendations (again who survive). But these recommendations are usually based on having very good bedside manners and being likable. (not what you need in the operating room)
As a rule, doctors don't like to send away business. If a trial is being conducted in their hospital that may be a different case. Also, that is not to say that there are not some doctors who would seek to do what might be in the best interest of the patient either. My personal experience was different, in that the oncologist I was going to use, did try and talk me out of it in favor or his traditional treatment. That's when I decided to drop him.
When it comes to knowing when you are receiving the best advice from a medical doctor, it can be a very slippery slope. This current book I am reading talks about this a lot. (I'm not recommending the book) The doctor states that most people do not know when they get good good care (provided they survive). They tend to judge their doctor by their bedside manners. If the doctor appears to be a good listener and seems compassionate, then people assume that is a good doctor. But he claims, nothing could be further from the truth. He sites examples in his book of such doctors, who had patients swooning to have them as their doctor, when in fact their skills could be quite bad and some down right dangerous, but they had wonderful mannerisms.
We really don't have any good access to good doctor skills. We can obtain patients recommendations (again who survive). But these recommendations are usually based on having very good bedside manners and being likable. (not what you need in the operating room)
Not so , I am proof of that myself. When I was told I was just fine with that enlarged tonsil as from observation by my ENT guy over a years time and there was no change or enlargement, He sent me home and was told to forget about it.
Those very words " you are released from my supervision " started to drive me crazy and after a month I booked another visit and demanded a biopsy. Fact was a week later I got a cell phone call as I was fighting rush hour in my truck. from my ENT . He said "guess what you have cancer" ! I guess I knew that in my gut, thats why I took charge. Yes I went through all the general procedures , advice about radiation, then surgery maybe , but my ENT guy was not sure he wanted to do a medium radical surgery, he would have to think about what options there were....as most locals do the radiation and hope for the best.
I went home , got on Google and started research on my own. I wanted the dam thing gone one way or the other and I wanted the best Surgeon for the job there was avail;able to me period ! I soon found Him at Mayo Clinic, 400 miles in winter on bad roads, but I packed my bag and showed up in Rochester , ready for robotic tonsorial medium radical surgery by the Doc than invented the procedure. I cared little about his bedside manner , there was a job to be done and He was the Guy to do it !
The outcome is now three years latter I am clean , no evidence of any cancer , not even in the 52 lymph nodes He removed and tested, it was all so far contained to the Tonsil. The recovery was no walk in the park , worst pain and non comfort I ever had had in my life. It took over a year and along with that there was now a drug dependency issue from the Benzos I was taking like candy, a very miserable 1 and a half years out of my life. I had to learn to eat all over again, and different foods etc. it was Hell on Earth ! .... But in the end , I think I saved my self and no radiation ether. So , it had nothing to do with if I liked my doctor or not. It had everything to do with knowledge , which is a good thing the way I see it. ... I believe you go where you can get the best care or procedure, and that can change depending on what your problem is. Those who whine about Affordable Health Care Insurance and the fact they may not wind up with the same doctor or plan as promised is a bunch of crap . No one Doc has all the answers to everything , you go where you can get the job done right, and I don't care if its in Rochester, Minn. or half way around the world , I go where I need to go and I don't have to like the Guy or Gal thats cutting me up ether. All I want is a clean sharp knife and a firm experienced hand doing the Job, ..!
I believe you go where you can get the best care or procedure, and that can change depending on what your problem is. Those who whine about Affordable Health Care Insurance and the fact they may not wind up with the same doctor or plan as promised is a bunch of crap . No one Doc has all the answers to everything , you go where you can get the job done right, and I don't care if its in Rochester, Minn. or half way around the world , I go where I need to go and I don't have to like the Guy or Gal thats cutting me up ether. All I want is a clean sharp knife and a firm experienced hand doing the Job, ..!
But, that's the problem with 80% of the ACA insurance offered. It isn't even a matter of a doctor "you like." It's a matter of limited networks, NO out-of-network coverage, most plans operating as HMOs.
Had you been in one of those plans three years ago, all your costs at Mayo would have been on you.
Of the four carriers offering ACA plans in WI, only ONE has out-of-network coverage, with a far more extensive network locally and a 25% higher premium than the other plans, but worth paying for, imo. Sadly, some states have no PPOs in the exchange and people will NOT have your options.
Wonderful that you have overcome your cancer. I know all about after-effects of a major illness, which I endured 35 years ago. Fine now, but that year and a few years thereafter, were not fun. As it happened, I cured myself through alternative means. Nonetheless, access to organized medicine is essential and I, for one, don't want to be limited in my choices.
But, that's the problem with 80% of the ACA insurance offered. It isn't even a matter of a doctor "you like." It's a matter of limited networks, NO out-of-network coverage, most plans operating as HMOs.
Had you been in one of those plans three years ago, all your costs at Mayo would have been on you.
Of the four carriers offering ACA plans in WI, only ONE has out-of-network coverage, with a far more extensive network locally and a 25% higher premium than the other plans, but worth paying for, imo. Sadly, some states have no PPOs in the exchange and people will NOT have your options.
Wonderful that you have overcome your cancer. I know all about after-effects of a major illness, which I endured 35 years ago. Fine now, but that year and a few years thereafter, were not fun. As it happened, I cured myself through alternative means. Nonetheless, access to organized medicine is essential and I, for one, don't want to be limited in my choices.
Well , looks like a good case for Single Payer , ( Medicare for all !! ) I guess I have proved that myself !
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