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Old 11-18-2011, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
22,538 posts, read 46,113,418 times
Reputation: 13304

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoPoliticsNoGamesJustMath View Post
good call.

I got in a car wreck when i was about a sophomore in high school , maybe junior.

I had to go to AA and what snapped me back to reality was these people...

I saw them and they were making it for sure, they were no longer fiends, but what they lacked IME and at my age what i saw was the zest...they had no love for life..every day it was just...1 one more day im not using...tomorrow is 2.....etc.etc.etc.etc.et.c.de.c.e.e..ce.

I just wanted to leave it all behind and not ever look back. Plus some of the dudes were kinda creepy asking me for rides and stuff i think they were the Sandusky types.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KAILANI View Post
Really good topic, and replys!

No one mentioned the addict not wanting to admit failure.. that is a hard thing to come to terms with. admitting wrongdoing and being the cause of problems...

oops, theatergypsy did..
I write about this all the time, much to the chagrin of the people firmly entrenched in the disease-modeled 12-step camp. Admitting you have a problem and taking responsibility is the only way to get back your life. Otherwise you are doomed to a life of meetings, often with sketchy people that are just holding on, minute by minute, day by day. If I thought I was sentenced to a life like that I'd be drinking and drugging, too.
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Old 11-21-2011, 08:00 AM
 
527 posts, read 2,493,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiknapster View Post
I write about this all the time, much to the chagrin of the people firmly entrenched in the disease-modeled 12-step camp. Admitting you have a problem and taking responsibility is the only way to get back your life. Otherwise you are doomed to a life of meetings, often with sketchy people that are just holding on, minute by minute, day by day. If I thought I was sentenced to a life like that I'd be drinking and drugging, too.
I probably would have felt the same way as you prior to having AA introduced to my life. I don't have a drinking problem but a loved one is an alcoholic. They say in the meetings, "it works if you work it". Virtually every rehab facility in this country is based on AA & the 12 Steps. Absolute statements are difficult to make, but the consensus of experts in the field of recovery is that you cannot get sober without it.

You are absolutely right that admitting you have a problem is the only way to get sober. That's the first of the 12 steps.
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Old 11-21-2011, 09:11 AM
 
Location: AZ
741 posts, read 1,321,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoPoliticsNoGamesJustMath View Post
Two things about the above.

1) I dont agree that AA is run by inmates, probably lots of them but nah I could not say that wholly it is.
2) I think the point about the phone call was, hey when you are ready to admit that you are an alcoholic come to us. AA will take anyone there is no secret to that. Even if you are addicted to MJ they will take you.

__________________________________________________ ___


IME, alcohol, heroin, porn, sex, coke, tv, internet, video games, love, painting, exercise, being nice...

can all be addictions, and whether they are positive or negative depends on the activity.

I read the book Infinite Jest and after that I really understood addiction at its base and not just on a per case basis such as (alcohol addiction vs benzo addiction vs fitness addiction).

It is human condition 101 - we all have a little black hole that needs to be fulfilled and we can not trick ourselves into thinking it is filled. IT takes hard work to fill it and then it is only temporary.

My pops retired at 40, sat around for about one year and then had a heart attack. Couldnt take it. Since then he has taken up smoking cigarettes, quit exercising, began drinking more, and he eats rather unhealthy.

Re specifically alcohol and other drugs or TV or sex or whatever INSTANT GRATIFICATION: it fills the hole, then comes the pain

the opposite is the natural way: pain THEN gain.
So true!!
Addiction is when the thing that you think you will die without is what eventually kills you...
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Old 11-21-2011, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
22,538 posts, read 46,113,418 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usedtobeanyer View Post
I probably would have felt the same way as you prior to having AA introduced to my life. I don't have a drinking problem but a loved one is an alcoholic. They say in the meetings, "it works if you work it". Virtually every rehab facility in this country is based on AA & the 12 Steps. Absolute statements are difficult to make, but the consensus of experts in the field of recovery is that you cannot get sober without it.

You are absolutely right that admitting you have a problem is the only way to get sober. That's the first of the 12 steps.
Did I say AA was not introduced in my life?

Not every facility is based on it but yes, a lot are. AA is big business and it is going to take a very long time to change that. Same with the consensus.

And once again, I am very aware of the steps.
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Old 11-21-2011, 01:33 PM
 
527 posts, read 2,493,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiknapster View Post
Did I say AA was not introduced in my life?

Not every facility is based on it but yes, a lot are. AA is big business and it is going to take a very long time to change that. Same with the consensus.

And once again, I am very aware of the steps.
How is AA big business?

Is there an alternative route to sobriety that you can share? (Genuinely curious, not trying to provoke).
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:03 PM
 
Location: So Ca
13,930 posts, read 13,588,503 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usedtobeanyer View Post
Is there an alternative route to sobriety that you can share? (Genuinely curious, not trying to provoke).
When I was in grad school, we had to attend several substance abuse workshops. The professors told us that that AA doesn't work for every alcoholic, and that there are different types of alcoholics, only 40% of whom are in the general alcoholic category. The twelve step program is best suited to general alcoholics, those who have a substance abuse disorder only. In addition, there are personality types who will never believe that they are powerless over anything, and if they can't admit or believe this, they can't work the rest of the steps. Other programs would be better suited for them.
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Old 11-23-2011, 04:12 PM
 
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
22,538 posts, read 46,113,418 times
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And there are other programs where the substance abuser takes back his life and finds that he is NOT powerless over the alcohol, drug or what have you.
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Old 11-25-2011, 09:45 AM
Status: "Even better than okay" (set 15 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
51,363 posts, read 50,627,712 times
Reputation: 60288
I think the people in AA are a mix of those who really do face their addictions and those who don't. I went to a meeting with a friend who was getting her 90-day pin. Of course, she was lying--she had been drinking on and off during that ninety days. At the same meeting, some guy stood up and told how he used to take a secret day off the week before his family went to their vacation home to drive up to the place and hide bottles in the ceiling tiles. You could just SEE the lightbulbs going off on faces around the room as they thought, "Hey what a great idea!" My first impression was that these people are just a bunch of liars exchanging tips on how to keep drinking secretly.

But, I did get to know some of the folks who met regularly in that room through the friend who was pretending to quit drinking. Some of them were genuine, had worked those steps and had 10, 15, 25 years of sobriety and had made lives for themselves.

As in every group, there are individuals and you can't lump everyone together.
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Old 06-05-2012, 06:36 PM
 
729 posts, read 1,379,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usedtobeanyer View Post
How is AA big business?

Is there an alternative route to sobriety that you can share? (Genuinely curious, not trying to provoke).
Actually there are several, they are newer than AA though.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:10 PM
 
729 posts, read 1,379,862 times
Reputation: 280
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
When I was in grad school, we had to attend several substance abuse workshops. The professors told us that that AA doesn't work for every alcoholic, and that there are different types of alcoholics, only 40% of whom are in the general alcoholic category. The twelve step program is best suited to general alcoholics, those who have a substance abuse disorder only. In addition, there are personality types who will never believe that they are powerless over anything, and if they can't admit or believe this, they can't work the rest of the steps. Other programs would be better suited for them.
Some people in AA would try and say that if you're still "picky" about recovery programs, you're not really "ready" to quit drinking.
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