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Old 07-15-2018, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,885 posts, read 32,642,286 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat View Post
^Complete nonsense. Millions of people have taken Cipro, Levaquin, etc with little or no side effects. Iím one of them. These drugs save lives. Can they potentially have side effects that affect small numbers of people? Sure. Practically all drugs do.

By all means, donít take them if you believe theyíre dangerous.
These drugs ARE more problematic than many other antibiotics. This is why the FDA has issued more and more warnings about them over the past few years, in increasingly strident tones:

Quote:
[ 7-26-2016 ] The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved changes to the labels of fluoroquinolone antibacterial drugs for systemic use (i.e., taken by mouth or by injection). These medicines are associated with disabling and potentially permanent side effects of the tendons, muscles, joints, nerves, and central nervous system that can occur together in the same patient. As a result, we revised the Boxed Warning, FDAís strongest warning, to address these serious safety issues. We also added a new warning and updated other parts of the drug label, including the patient Medication Guide.

We have determined that fluoroquinolones should be reserved for use in patients who have no other treatment options for acute bacterial sinusitis, (ABS), acute bacterial exacerbation of chronic bronchitis (ABECB), and uncomplicated urinary tract infections (UTI) because the risk of these serious side effects generally outweighs the benefits in these patients. For some serious bacterial infections the benefits of fluoroquinolones outweigh the risks, and it is appropriate for them to remain available as a therapeutic option.
https://fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/ucm511530.htm

Actually, anyone who is prescribed one of these drugs needs to read this whole FDA release. They also need to ask their doctor if any other treatment options are available - the FDA release specifies that these drugs should only be used if other options are not available, and only for a few types of illnesses. These drugs were handed out willy nilly for years, for just about anything. It was the equivalent of killing a mouse with a flame thrower in many cases. I mean, it will work, but do would an old fashioned mouse trap - or a round of amoxicillan.

I'm glad you didn't experience any side effects. I had both my Achilles tendons fall apart and have to be surgically rebuilt. That was an ordeal, believe me. I have met MANY other people whose issues were also caused by a round of some fluoroquinolone.

At least I have two cool matching scars up the back of both my ankles.

Funny thing is, my orthopedic surgeon told me four years ago "Your wrists are next." I didn't believe him. Well, guess what - my left wist is now in a splint, with tendon inflamation and a torn TFCC. All I did was pick up a bag. Not a heavy bag, just a bag. So yeah, I have an appointment with my former doctor for a second opinion.

What doctors and patients are beginning to realize with growing horror is that the tendon and joint damage (and other damages) caused by these drugs is PERMANENT and never goes away. It often gets worse. I am just thankful that my heart valves weren't affected, as some peoples' are, or that I haven't developed neuropathy, like many people do. It could be a lot worse.
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Old 07-15-2018, 01:10 PM
 
575 posts, read 140,668 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
These drugs ARE more problematic than many other antibiotics. This is why the FDA has issued more and more warnings about them over the past few years, in increasingly strident tones:



https://fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/ucm511530.htm

Actually, anyone who is prescribed one of these drugs needs to read this whole FDA release. They also need to ask their doctor if any other treatment options are available - the FDA release specifies that these drugs should only be used if other options are not available, and only for a few types of illnesses. These drugs were handed out willy nilly for years, for just about anything. It was the equivalent of killing a mouse with a flame thrower in many cases. I mean, it will work, but do would an old fashioned mouse trap - or a round of amoxicillan.

I'm glad you didn't experience any side effects. I had both my Achilles tendons fall apart and have to be surgically rebuilt. That was an ordeal, believe me. I have met MANY other people whose issues were also caused by a round of some fluoroquinolone.

At least I have two cool matching scars up the back of both my ankles.

Funny thing is, my orthopedic surgeon told me four years ago "Your wrists are next." I didn't believe him. Well, guess what - my left wist is now in a splint, with tendon inflamation and a torn TFCC. All I did was pick up a bag. Not a heavy bag, just a bag. So yeah, I have an appointment with my former doctor for a second opinion.

What doctors and patients are beginning to realize with growing horror is that the tendon and joint damage (and other damages) caused by these drugs is PERMANENT and never goes away. It often gets worse. I am just thankful that my heart valves weren't affected, as some peoples' are, or that I haven't developed neuropathy, like many people do. It could be a lot worse.
Mayo clinic says Cipro should not be used unless there is no other alternative. Its a dangerous drug. When I had that bladder inf and the hospital didnt like my wbc, they put me on cipro. I reAd the info on the drug, called my own dr who couldnt believe they used that drug. One of the most common side effects is torn achilles tendons. That wouldnt be good for my lifestyle. And I wasnt going to continue with that drug. My dr changed the drug esp after she remember that her mother had torn both tendons just getting out of bed while on that drug.
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Old 07-16-2018, 04:39 AM
 
5,563 posts, read 7,635,104 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Williepaws View Post
Mayo clinic says Cipro should not be used unless there is no other alternative. Its a dangerous drug. When I had that bladder inf and the hospital didnt like my wbc, they put me on cipro. I reAd the info on the drug, called my own dr who couldnt believe they used that drug. One of the most common side effects is torn achilles tendons. That wouldnt be good for my lifestyle. And I wasnt going to continue with that drug. My dr changed the drug esp after she remember that her mother had torn both tendons just getting out of bed while on that drug.
That's NOT one of the most common. It is however a severe side effect that can occur which is why it has a black box warning. Things like headaches and stomach upset are much more common.
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Old 07-16-2018, 05:36 AM
 
575 posts, read 140,668 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spazkat9696 View Post
That's NOT one of the most common. It is however a severe side effect that can occur which is why it has a black box warning. Things like headaches and stomach upset are much more common.
It is a fairly common severe side effect. Its a dangerous drug. Shouldnt be used by the medical establishment like it is. It was developed to fight anthrax, not bladder inf, or sinus inf etc. thats why the drs get a bad rapt for using drugs like that. Well deserved bad rapt too.
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Old 07-16-2018, 06:30 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,885 posts, read 32,642,286 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Williepaws View Post
Mayo clinic says Cipro should not be used unless there is no other alternative. Its a dangerous drug. When I had that bladder inf and the hospital didnt like my wbc, they put me on cipro. I reAd the info on the drug, called my own dr who couldnt believe they used that drug. One of the most common side effects is torn achilles tendons. That wouldnt be good for my lifestyle. And I wasnt going to continue with that drug. My dr changed the drug esp after she remember that her mother had torn both tendons just getting out of bed while on that drug.
I believe you and believe me, torn Achilles tendons aren't good for ANY lifestyle. Very long recovery time and in order for it to be successfully treated you have to go through MONTHS of physical therapy. In the case of fluoroquinolone damage, surgery is usually the best and most effective option so there are those risks as well. Crutches, knee scooters, deductibles, HASSLE AND PAIN...don't take these drugs unless there are no other options available - just like the FDA warning stipulates. Unfortunately, many doctors are apparently unaware of this severity of the FDA warning. They reach for Cipro because doggone it, it WILL work on an infection - just like carpet bombing WILL work on enforcing a curfew.
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Old 07-16-2018, 06:31 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,885 posts, read 32,642,286 times
Reputation: 57020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spazkat9696 View Post
That's NOT one of the most common. It is however a severe side effect that can occur which is why it has a black box warning. Things like headaches and stomach upset are much more common.
It's common enough for the FDA to give fluoroquinolones their most urgent and severe warning. They are not giving this urgent warning status because of headaches and stomach upset. Read the FDA warning. Then decide for yourself.

From the FDA (but there's more detail on the complete warning - it goes into even more serious and permanent possible side effects):

Quote:
[ 7-26-2016 ] The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved changes to the labels of fluoroquinolone antibacterial drugs for systemic use (i.e., taken by mouth or by injection). These medicines are associated with disabling and potentially permanent side effects of the tendons, muscles, joints, nerves, and central nervous system that can occur together in the same patient. As a result, we revised the Boxed Warning, FDA’s strongest warning, to address these serious safety issues. We also added a new warning and updated other parts of the drug label, including the patient Medication Guide.

We have determined that fluoroquinolones should be reserved for use in patients who have no other treatment options for acute bacterial sinusitis, (ABS), acute bacterial exacerbation of chronic bronchitis (ABECB), and uncomplicated urinary tract infections (UTI) because the risk of these serious side effects generally outweighs the benefits in these patients. For some serious bacterial infections the benefits of fluoroquinolones outweigh the risks, and it is appropriate for them to remain available as a therapeutic option.
https://fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/ucm511530.htm

And Williepaws is exactly right - this class of drugs was developed to fight super serious infections such as these listed below - and even with these, other antibiotics are listed as alternatives:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/...1.2002.00496.x
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Old 07-16-2018, 09:19 AM
 
5,563 posts, read 7,635,104 times
Reputation: 5829
Quote:
Originally Posted by Williepaws View Post
It is a fairly common severe side effect. Its a dangerous drug. Shouldnt be used by the medical establishment like it is. It was developed to fight anthrax, not bladder inf, or sinus inf etc. thats why the drs get a bad rapt for using drugs like that. Well deserved bad rapt too.
Actually tendon rupture is a rare side effect and is listed as so. The reason for the black box warning isnít because itís so common but because it is severe and potentially disabling. Iíve had 2 reconstructions due to tendon rupture, it hurts, I get it, but facts are important too.
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Old 07-16-2018, 11:08 AM
 
Location: Prescott AZ
5,843 posts, read 8,423,141 times
Reputation: 10702
It took a full two weeks for the Meloxifloxicam to exit my system. I am better now and will never take that again (along with Flagyl and Cipro.
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Old 07-16-2018, 11:14 AM
 
575 posts, read 140,668 times
Reputation: 1046
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spazkat9696 View Post
Actually tendon rupture is a rare side effect and is listed as so. The reason for the black box warning isnít because itís so common but because it is severe and potentially disabling. Iíve had 2 reconstructions due to tendon rupture, it hurts, I get it, but facts are important too.
ďFactsĒ? There are permanent and crippling side effects to that antibiotic. If you want to chance it and take that drug, go ahead. If I had anthrax I dont think I would care about tendon rupture ,but simply having a bladder inf with a high wbc though I wasnt sick, didnt have a temp, and except for the bladder felt pretty good. It was the hospital that went off the deep end. You take the drug. Not me. And for the real kicker, come to find out the bladder bacteria was resistant to cipro. Lets take the chance and permanently disable the patient but not cure the bladder inf. Oh good. Love todays med.
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Old 07-16-2018, 04:29 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,885 posts, read 32,642,286 times
Reputation: 57020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spazkat9696 View Post
Actually tendon rupture is a rare side effect and is listed as so. The reason for the black box warning isnít because itís so common but because it is severe and potentially disabling. Iíve had 2 reconstructions due to tendon rupture, it hurts, I get it, but facts are important too.
1. This "rare side effect" is not as rare as they thought it was originally.

2. There are many, many other drugs with rare but potentially devastating side effects, which do not by law have to carry the most severe warning that the FDA issues - and also, tendonitis and ruptured tendons, while painful and problematic, aren't deadly. So why the issuing and reissuing of more and more severe warnings by the FDA?

I think it's safe to assume that the FDA would be extremely cautious about numbers and ratios, but this is directly from the FDA:

Quote:
Renata Albrecht, MD, who heads the FDA's Division of Special Pathogen and Transplant Products, estimates that spontaneous ruptures occur in about one in 100,000 people. The agency says taking the drugs appears to triple or quadruple the risk.
At LEAST. Not only that, but my orthopedic surgeon, and many of his colleagues, believe that the damage can take a year or more to become really evident, and often by that time, the patient has been off the meds for months, and (in my case for instance) may not even remember taking the medication (I took it for a week - totally forgot about it till 8 months later and then a year and a half later after both my ATs disintegrated). So it's pretty safe to assume that not all cases even get linked to these drugs by patients or doctors.

I had no injury. I don't have any history of tendon issues, nor does anyone in my family. I had zero risk factors. But I did take Cipro for one week. Bam.

The scary thing is that four years ago, my orthopedic surgeon told me, "I hate to tell you this but your wrists are probably next." I brushed it off - I mean, I'm strong, I'm tough, and that far out? Well, guess what - my left arm is in a splint, my tendons in my wrist are all jacked up, and I have an appointment with my former (I just thought he was former) doctor in a few weeks, for a second opinion. My current doctor (we've moved so that was why I didn't go directly to the former doctor) looks about 12 (I'm sure she's older but she can't possibly have a lot of experience) and she is totally confused and flummoxed about "why" my wrist is so jacked up. I tried to tell her about the Cipro, but like so many other doctors who have never seen it first hand, she just sort of brushed that info aside. But she still doesn't understand why my tendons in my wrist are so inflamed, because I tore my TFCC, that doesn't have anything to do with tendons, what the heck? I tried to tell her. So time for a second opinion.
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