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View Poll Results: After reading the OP in full, what is your take on the current state of pain medication prescription
Pain relief medications are "too severely restricted" for legitimate patients? 120 71.86%
Pain relief medications restrictions are “where they should be” for legitimate pain patients? 20 11.98%
Pain relief medications restrictions are “not restricted enough” for legitimate pain patients? 27 16.17%
Voters: 167. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-29-2018, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,884 posts, read 36,203,761 times
Reputation: 63544

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shooting Stars View Post
Having to see a doctor every three months is an expense that many people can't afford. Pain specialists are not abundant. I previously said that some people have to travel really far to get to one. I don't know why you resorted to wanting a count of people who embody every single difficulty mentioned. Just having one of those difficulties makes it hard to see a doctor every three months. And the point is that no one should have to visit a doctor every three months for pain that expected to be either permanent or long-lasting.

Anyway, which part of the "doom and gloom" is unrealistic?

That pharmacies have opioid quotas, which I provided proof of?

That pharmacies are increasingly turning away people with pain prescriptions because they've exceeded their opioid quota and don't have the medicine in stock?

That doctors are increasingly afraid to write prescriptions for opioids even for patients that need it because of overbearing DEA scrutiny?

The pharmacy web site I linked to expressed how difficult the situation has become for pain sufferers. They said the pendulum has swung too far. I would think that when a pharmacist publication says it's bad and goes to great lengths to explain why, that would be enough to draw the conclusion that the situation is bad. Besides, the information is everywhere if you Google it. There have been documentaries made on what is happening to pain sufferers. This has been going on for a few years now. At some point, refusal to see reality is just being stubborn. It is easily researched.

Did you read the link? https://www.pharmacist.com/article/p...nts-controlled
Yes I read the link. But it doesn't even touch on the burning question in my mind, which is WHY is our opioid prescription rate soaring so much higher than any other developed country in the world? Sorry but I don't buy that Americans are in that much more pain. And alongside that outlandish opiate prescription rate, we have much higher overdose rates, and much higher heroin use rates as well. THOSE ARE REAL PROBLEMS and developed in lockstep with the ever increasing opiate prescription rate.

We have a problem and no, I don't think that there's an effort to keep effective pain management away from patients. It's going to take some work but we have to start somewhere. Opiate use is out of control in this country and we have the death rates to prove it.
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Old 11-29-2018, 10:27 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,884 posts, read 36,203,761 times
Reputation: 63544
Quote:
Dragatsi expressed dismay at the practice. “This is unfortunate, as there is good evidence to show that more than 3 days’ worth of opioids starts to change brain architecture and hormone levels that affect motivation. The cheapest strategy for insurance companies [would be] to provide evidence-based information for proper OTC combinations first, followed by prescription-required strategies by indication. The reason we got into this mess in the first place is because opioids are much cheaper than interventional medicine and pain management techniques. Opioids were the quick fix.”
Quote:
“Have a handy reference of analgesia-related clinical guidelines, and ensure that the patient’s diseases are being treated appropriately. Ill-managed conditions are frequent contributors to unnecessary pain,” Dragatsi said. “Go through the complete medication list and see if other medications are undermining pain management.”
https://www.pharmacytoday.org/articl...792-9/fulltext
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Old 11-29-2018, 10:51 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,884 posts, read 36,203,761 times
Reputation: 63544
But you know what - I'm done with this thread and the reason is not because I've been convinced by arguments but because it's futile to argue levels of pain with people who are in pain (as I am, every day of my life - but surely I don't know what "real" pain is - like I said, that's a futile conversation), and it's also futile to tell someone who is convinced they need something, that they don't need it or that there may be other options, or that a lot of people, and maybe even they themselves, are abusing a substance. I'm not saying that anyone here is an addict, or minimizing the pain of anyone here - but what I am saying is that the comeback is always, always "Well, until you experience excruciating pain, you can't understand." How does anyone know what level of pain I've experienced, and experience every single day of my life? One person's pain is another person's agony and vice versa. Pain and pain relief are complex issues that can really bring out the judgmentalism in lots of people, on both sides of the opiate question.

So thankfully I don't have to continue to argue this. So far so good for me as far as access to effective pain management (note that I didn't say relief from pain).
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Old 11-30-2018, 07:56 AM
 
12,886 posts, read 15,438,852 times
Reputation: 14853
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Link, please. Thanks in advance.
That info is in the link...or video I posted..(.first one #866)...if you'd take the time to watch it.
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Old 11-30-2018, 08:01 AM
 
12,886 posts, read 15,438,852 times
Reputation: 14853
Quote:
Originally Posted by jencam View Post
Wal mart told me all that would be needed is for the Dr. to verify that it's a chronic pain condition and they would have filled the 60 tabs. It's not chronic, so I asked what about that? He said the Dr. would have to do a second script after the 7 day one and that could be for however many days.

This doesn't negate anyone's experience, but claims were made that 7 days is it, chronic or acute, anywhere, and that is simply not true.
Oh well....if Walmart says so.....NOT!!!!
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Old 11-30-2018, 08:19 AM
 
12,886 posts, read 15,438,852 times
Reputation: 14853
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
I'm not saying that anyone here is an addict, or minimizing the pain of anyone here - but what I am saying is that the comeback is always, always "Well, until you experience excruciating pain, you can't understand." How does anyone know what level of pain I've experienced, and experience every single day of my life? One person's pain is another person's agony and vice versa. Pain and pain relief are complex issues that can really bring out the judgmentalism in lots of people, on both sides of the opiate question.

So thankfully I don't have to continue to argue this. So far so good for me as far as access to effective pain management (note that I didn't say relief from pain).
It doesn't matter what level of pain you've experienced.
Pain relief (management..same thing) is only "complex" to people who would judge others for revealing that opioids give them the relief they need and deserve.
I think it would be easy to judge others choices for pain relief when as you've said (multiple times) you can get the opioids any time you want them...no problems for you.

No one knows the "level of pain" you experience...and no one is saying you should be denied relief for it.
It's YOU who are judging others by indeed "minimizing" their pain.....even after they've said that opioids are the only drug that relieves said pain.
For some reason that doesn't sit right with you.
I've no idea why.
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Old 11-30-2018, 08:42 AM
 
12,886 posts, read 15,438,852 times
Reputation: 14853
The link you provided is a good read (yes, I do look at them)....I disagree though with the part that says "pharmacists are rightfully starting to feel a personal and professional responsibility to councel patients every time an opioid is dispensed".
They've been counceling patients about their prescription every time they pick them up for years and years.

The personal part stems from them being afraid the DEA will raid and possibly shut them down...
The responsibility part stems simply from the restrictions being forced on them by drug monitoring programs.
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Old 11-30-2018, 09:39 AM
 
12,124 posts, read 6,697,643 times
Reputation: 12973
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
Oh well....if Walmart says so.....NOT!!!!
It's still a licensed pharmacist.
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Old 11-30-2018, 09:46 AM
 
2,658 posts, read 1,552,373 times
Reputation: 3207
A couple good reads for those who are interested:

https://themighty.com/2018/11/opioid...edium=Facebook


https://www.practicalpainmanagement....in-prescribing

Both discuss how the vast majority comes from street drugs not legit prescriptions largely laced with fentanyl. Unfortunately many seem to be unable to differentiate legitimate legal use from illegal street use. The fact is that chronic pain patients are suffering within undermedicafion due to the irresponsible actions of a few. The pendulum has swung too far in the other directions and it’s not even working as they hoped. Some pain patients are committing suicide over not getting their pain adequately controlled despite treatments existing that could. Also some of the street drug deaths are from those in severe pain who can’t get their meds legitimately but no one likes to talk about that. I have seen many stories to this effect on chronic pain sites and that concerns me.

Really we need a dual approach: 1) make sure pain patients are treated with compassion and adequate medications to allow them to function and live fulfilling lives and 2) treatment for addiction that is accessible and affordable with appropriate mental health counseling. Otherwise you might get them off an opiate just to replace it with a bottle.

There was overprescribing and now there is underprescribing so it needs to balance out, especially for those in long term, progressive, severe pain. We also need to be wary of first time prescriptions for patients and make sure they’re truly warranted while not penalizing the patients who have proven they can and will use responsibly as prescribed.

Just my 2 cents and I doubt this will change two poster’s opinions who seem as closed minded as it gets on this issue though.
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Old 11-30-2018, 11:32 AM
 
1,118 posts, read 588,597 times
Reputation: 1990
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Yes I read the link. But it doesn't even touch on the burning question in my mind, which is WHY is our opioid prescription rate soaring so much higher than any other developed country in the world? Sorry but I don't buy that Americans are in that much more pain. And alongside that outlandish opiate prescription rate, we have much higher overdose rates, and much higher heroin use rates as well. THOSE ARE REAL PROBLEMS and developed in lockstep with the ever increasing opiate prescription rate.

We have a problem and no, I don't think that there's an effort to keep effective pain management away from patients. It's going to take some work but we have to start somewhere. Opiate use is out of control in this country and we have the death rates to prove it.
I truly believe Americans use more than any other country because of the advertising and "pushing" that the drug companies do and did for drugs. I can't watch an hour of HGTV without seeing a TV advertisement for a drug. How many of us have never been in a doctor's office when a drug salesman came in selling (pushing) his drug? Now that there is a problem, the government is swinging too much to the no opiate side. There has to be a happy medium here and it's going to take a long time before our country finds it.
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