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Old 07-28-2018, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,492 posts, read 17,642,239 times
Reputation: 39957

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
\Science has to consider generalities and probabilities. \
Or, when the data doesn't fit your view.... no generalities.
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Old 07-28-2018, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,492 posts, read 17,642,239 times
Reputation: 39957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
\Averaging them all together means we can't really know what the data means.
I REALLY should learn the multi-quote.
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Moderator: Relationships Forum / Hawaii Forum / Dogs
 
Old 07-28-2018, 09:35 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
21,498 posts, read 26,102,510 times
Reputation: 26457
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
I REALLY should learn the multi-quote.
It's easy. Just click on the icon with the quote marks to the right of the one that says "quote". It will turn red. Move to the next post you want to quote and do the same thing. When you open the post reply box, they will all be there and you can insert your own text after each quoted post.
 
Old 07-29-2018, 05:53 AM
 
4,625 posts, read 10,500,588 times
Reputation: 10314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You must be kidding. Averaging them all together means we can't really know what the data means. Maybe urban areas were unsanitary and had shorter lifespans. Or they had poverty and malnutrition.

You selected a comparison that came out the way you like.

You are NOT calm. I have never seen you being calm here. It is not possible to analyze such a complicated question if you have an emotional reaction.

It is a fact that you could look at other comparisons and see that people were not sick and disabled with short lived, just because they lacked modern medicine.
My averages came from the UNITED STATES....there were not 3rd world countries averaged in...you can look at "averages" from different areas of the UNITED STATES during any of these time periods, the "average age of death" will not vary much

And has already been pointed out, the question being asked regards "average age of death" using "averages" is kind of necessary to answer the question....

YOU just choose to ignore FACTS that do no support your illogical "theory"

As for my "emotional reaction" You have never "seen me" period, trust me, I am very calm even when I respond to utter nonsense....
 
Old 07-29-2018, 06:02 AM
 
575 posts, read 140,979 times
Reputation: 1046
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
I for one do. Other than my OB 34 years ago, I would like to smack every doctor the few times I have ever sought medical treatment since then. FYI, I am turning 70 in a couple of months.
Me too. I try not to have much to do with any dr. Dangerous to your health. And even if you need to see one, the patient better be as informed as they can possibly be.
 
Old 07-29-2018, 06:33 AM
 
958 posts, read 395,223 times
Reputation: 1627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
That is the subject of many other threads. Medications for everyone. Opioids for pain. Pain in your neck? Did you sleep in a bad position? Run for the pain medication! No, work it out. If you turn your head to one side and it hurts, KEEP turning it that way. Forget the Motrin. It will go away.
I don't understand the point of taking pain meds for something that likely will go away. How else will I know it is healing or not. Pain is a sign that you need to pay attention to.

It did go away. In fact, I realized that I could be dehydrated and as soon as I started drinking the pain went down 80%. And eventually gone.

It irked me because it was just so dismissive. But I have to give the person who said it a break. She takes SSRIs and is not in her right mind.
 
Old 07-29-2018, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Central IL
13,362 posts, read 7,128,759 times
Reputation: 31065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
Yes, the decline of child mortality matters a lot for the increase of life expectancy. But as this chart below shows, there is much more to it.

Child mortality is defined as the number of children dying before their 5th birthday. To see how life expectancy has improved without taking child mortality into account we therefore have to look at the prospects of a child who just survived their 5th birthday: in 1841 a 5-year old could expect to live 55 years. Today a 5-year old can expect to live 82 years. An increase of 27 years.

At higher ages mortality patterns have also changed. A 50-year old could once expect to live an additional twenty years. Today the life expectancy of a 50-year old has increased to an additional 33 years.



https://ourworldindata.org/life-expectancy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
As I said, it very much depends on what society you are comparing it to. In some societies there is a lot of poverty, so people don't survive long. In some, there are unsanitary conditions. It goes on and on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You are only comparing against one time or place. As I already said many times, there have been times and places where poverty or unsanitary conditions caused short lives.

And you gave one example, I gave others. There isn't a definite consensus. But obviously there are many who doubt the myth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedevilz View Post
"Reality" AKA your "opinion" AKA "Longevity the (Non)Facts"

You have provided NOTHING but opinion pieces devoid of actual research and you continue to fall back on your tired, completely disproven MYTHS regarding infant mortality and lifespan....

Here is the crux of your argument stated in your OP ( and in a bazillion prior threads)

Infants and young people were much more likely to die than in our society, and that brought the average way down.

Here is where facts are not your friends....

This has been shown to you in the past over and over and over and you continually disregard it but unless you can disprove actuarial tables your argument is over, done, finished....

FACT: In 1850 in the US a white male child of 10 could expect to live to age 58
FACT: In 1850 in the US a white female child of could expect to live to age 57

FACT: In 2011 in the US a white male child of 10 could expect to live to age 77
FACT: In 2011 in the US a white female child of 10 could expect to live to age 82

FACT: Infant mortality is COMPLETELY irrelevant to these FACTS

https://www.infoplease.com/us/mortal...-age-1850-2011
Good4nothin - you accuse people of not looking at your sources - what about these? They look at multiple countries, multiple time frames, both with and without infant mortality figured in. You have NOT been able to refute any of it specifically - you just moan about averages and different cultures and ancient times. You can't make the data fit your theory so you accuse everyone else of believing in "myths" and getting angry. You're not gonna win this one - in fact I can't think of any arguments you've won on c-d.

You live your life...and everyone will live theirs as they see fit. Fair enough?
 
Old 07-29-2018, 07:37 AM
 
5,644 posts, read 3,196,510 times
Reputation: 6627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You must be kidding. Averaging them all together means we can't really know what the data means. Maybe urban areas were unsanitary and had shorter lifespans. Or they had poverty and malnutrition.

You selected a comparison that came out the way you like.

You are NOT calm. I have never seen you being calm here. It is not possible to analyze such a complicated question if you have an emotional reaction.

It is a fact that you could look at other comparisons and see that people were not sick and disabled with short lived, just because they lacked modern medicine.
Absolutely, you cannot average all areas together, especially relative to sanitary conditions. I can tell you the difference between living in a big city and a suburb in the 1950's.

Not all Manhattan apartments then had their own toilets in the units. Many had a common toilet in the hallway which multiple families shared. It could get pretty gross in there. My Aunt and Uncle still had a bedpan so they would not have to go into the hallway in the middle of the night.

To cool off we kids turned on fire hydrants in the streets. No pooper scooper laws then. Some police rode horses. Those animals left their mark in the streets also. Drunks vomited outside. Garbage was put outside in bags by the curbs. With all this flies and bugs (roaches) were everywhere.

My Uncle lived in an Indiana suburb. Night and day sanitary conditions. The single family homes had toilets. People did not have to share toilets with other families. When we kids wanted to cool off, we turned on the garden hose on the lawn. It was clean on that lawn. There weren't mounds of garbage outside.

How can you lump all demographics together in determining longevity when living conditions were so different? I am sure some on here will consider these differences irrelevant.

Which came first? Change in Sanitary Conditions, or "Modern" Medicine?

Last edited by Jo48; 07-29-2018 at 07:46 AM..
 
Old 07-29-2018, 08:23 AM
 
5,644 posts, read 3,196,510 times
Reputation: 6627
The OT brings up the research into Human Genetic Engineering to eliminate disease leading to increased longevity.

Thoughts? Just because we (someday) could, should we, or want to?
 
Old 07-29-2018, 08:44 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
1,653 posts, read 629,266 times
Reputation: 3310
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
The OT brings up the research into Human Genetic Engineering to eliminate disease leading to increased longevity.

Thoughts? Just because we (someday) could, should we, or want to?

Too bad modern science has added years onto the end of our lives, not the middle where we really want more time
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