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Old 07-26-2018, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Middle of the valley
48,287 posts, read 34,411,101 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Not much. And very little since the new drugs. Partly explained by less smoking.
It was significant. New drugs have been added for a very long time, it's kinda hard to eliminate that time span. But let's face it, you have a theory in search of facts, not facts that denote a theory.
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Old 07-26-2018, 08:59 PM
 
8,175 posts, read 3,369,641 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
It was significant. New drugs have been added for a very long time, it's kinda hard to eliminate that time span. But let's face it, you have a theory in search of facts, not facts that denote a theory.
What I am saying goes against the mainstream medical mythology. So people will resist it. You try not to even think about it.

But there are controversies, and lots of people saying different things. If primitive people really died of old age in their 30s, no one would have considered the paleo diet. But it's popular because there are many who question the modern mythology.

If you only read WebMD, and you only listen to your doctor, you would never hear anything but the mainstream myths.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:01 PM
 
8,175 posts, read 3,369,641 times
Reputation: 6041
Can we try to just agree on the central point of the post? That primitive people were not dying of old age in their 30s. That myth is part of the foundation of the mainstream medical belief that "natural is not better."

It has other foundations as well, such as the ideas that life evolved by chance and DNA is mostly junk. But this post is about the longevity myth.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:17 PM
 
3,055 posts, read 1,507,674 times
Reputation: 6116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
What I am saying goes against the mainstream medical mythology. So people will resist it. You try not to even think about it.

But there are controversies, and lots of people saying different things. If primitive people really died of old age in their 30s, no one would have considered the paleo diet. But it's popular because there are many who question the modern mythology.

If you only read WebMD, and you only listen to your doctor, you would never hear anything but the mainstream myths.
But in your quest for natural explanations of and cures for disease, you are missing the largest contributing factor to increased life expectancy and that is sanitation. From UNICEF: “Plagues make headlines, but in human terms, the price of neglecting sanitation is both more prosaic and more profound. It can be summed up in one word: diarrhoea. It thrives in the absence of hygienic conditions and is tied with pneumonia as the biggest child-killer on earth, taking the lives of 2.2 million children each year. Diarrhoeal episodes leave millions more children underweight, mentally and physically stunted, easy prey for deadly diseases and so drained of energy that they are ill equipped for the primary task of childhood: learning.”

Now the other side wants to believe its vaccines and statins and heart transplants etc etc not the importance of the common toilet and clean water supply that contribute to longer life expectancy. You both have axes to grind and both sides ignore fundamental truths. Both sides need to open your mind and do some reading and research.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:18 PM
 
Location: Middle of the valley
48,287 posts, read 34,411,101 times
Reputation: 73226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
What I am saying goes against the mainstream medical mythology. So people will resist it. You try not to even think about it.

But there are controversies, and lots of people saying different things. If primitive people really died of old age in their 30s, no one would have considered the paleo diet. But it's popular because there are many who question the modern mythology.

If you only read WebMD, and you only listen to your doctor, you would never hear anything but the mainstream myths.
Shoot and a miss. I read many things. A lot is history, and most of my understanding comes from that reading. I also read a lot of medical books that are unrelated to this type of stuff, but info and data comes from there as well.

I learn information and form my opinions, not, the other way around.

You are not enlightened, better informed or any other of the things that seems to make you feel you are a seeker of truth and can see through the veils.... Just another set of conspiracy theories. It's not special, or different.
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Old 07-26-2018, 09:20 PM
 
Location: Middle of the valley
48,287 posts, read 34,411,101 times
Reputation: 73226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Can we try to just agree on the central point of the post? That primitive people were not dying of old age in their 30s. That myth is part of the foundation of the mainstream medical belief that "natural is not better."

It has other foundations as well, such as the ideas that life evolved by chance and DNA is mostly junk. But this post is about the longevity myth.
Just your words, no data, or anything really to support your personal claims.


Have you ever thought why you have this obsessive need to keep posting the same things, over, and over again? What do you think drives you?
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Old 07-26-2018, 09:22 PM
 
8,175 posts, read 3,369,641 times
Reputation: 6041
Quote:
Originally Posted by Williepaws View Post
But in your quest for natural explanations of and cures for disease, you are missing the largest contributing factor to increased life expectancy and that is sanitation. From UNICEF: “Plagues make headlines, but in human terms, the price of neglecting sanitation is both more prosaic and more profound. It can be summed up in one word: diarrhoea. It thrives in the absence of hygienic conditions and is tied with pneumonia as the biggest child-killer on earth, taking the lives of 2.2 million children each year. Diarrhoeal episodes leave millions more children underweight, mentally and physically stunted, easy prey for deadly diseases and so drained of energy that they are ill equipped for the primary task of childhood: learning.”

Now the other side wants to believe its vaccines and statins and heart transplants etc etc not the importance of the common toilet and clean water supply that contribute to longer life expectancy. You both have axes to grind and both sides ignore fundamental truths. Both sides need to open your mind and do some reading and research.
Yes I know the main thing is sanitation. I just didn't want to get into a lot of detail.

Longevity research is very complicated and can be very misleading. That's why I brought it up. My point is just that the mainstream medical myth needs to be questioned and examined.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:24 PM
 
8,175 posts, read 3,369,641 times
Reputation: 6041
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
Just your words, no data, or anything really to support your personal claims.


Have you ever thought why you have this obsessive need to keep posting the same things, over, and over again? What do you think drives you?
I am not posting the same things. The theme might be the same (modern medicine is not all-powerful and we should not worship it), but I have been posting many different aspects of the theme.

It's a challenge to get anyone here to listen, because this is very obviously a mostly mainstream crowd here.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:26 PM
 
2,842 posts, read 2,090,450 times
Reputation: 6737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Can we try to just agree on the central point of the post? That primitive people were not dying of old age in their 30s. That myth is part of the foundation of the mainstream medical belief that "natural is not better."

It has other foundations as well, such as the ideas that life evolved by chance and DNA is mostly junk. But this post is about the longevity myth.
i don't know about you but i rarely hear mainstream medicine reference prehistoric times as a comparator.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 09:27 PM
 
8,175 posts, read 3,369,641 times
Reputation: 6041
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
Shoot and a miss. I read many things. A lot is history, and most of my understanding comes from that reading. I also read a lot of medical books that are unrelated to this type of stuff, but info and data comes from there as well.

I learn information and form my opinions, not, the other way around.

You are not enlightened, better informed or any other of the things that seems to make you feel you are a seeker of truth and can see through the veils.... Just another set of conspiracy theories. It's not special, or different.
This is not a logical argument, you're just complaining about me personally. You aren't citing evidence that I'm wrong about anything.

And now days an easy way to argue is to accuse someone of being a conspiracy theorist. I definitely do not believe in any conspiracy theories. I don't think people are capable of organizing big conspiracies. On the other hand, there is lots of confusion and corruption and self-deception. That is life. And it occurs in the medical system, and any other aspect of society that is powerful.
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