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Old 07-27-2018, 04:05 PM
 
3,421 posts, read 934,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bygeorge View Post
Nutrition, sterile surgerie/anesthesia, vaccines, modern drugs are the four verified reasons for longevity. I have no desire to argue the OPs position but our ancestors did not have long life spans on average and those that did simply had more robust immune systems and likely certain genetic traits which include immunity.

More and more researchers are finding that dental issues affect health in serious ways.

Cancers and heart problems are likely due to our poisoned environment. That new carpet and new car emit powerful chemicals. I would agree that diet is important.

I note that in the time of Christ (info only and not debate) His biggest ministry was healing a lot of sickness. The apostles were imbued with that same gift. There is likely no such time when humans were all that healthy. I would mention pre flood times but that would get into a new subject. Not purpose here.
Some societies have been and are much more healthy than others. Scientific research has shown this. Contemporary societies have been studied where health is much better than ours, in spite of little or no access to modern medicine.

 
Old 07-27-2018, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,556 posts, read 17,669,809 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
So you think primitive people died of old age in their 30s? Because they didn't have your drugs?
I would have.
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Old 07-27-2018, 04:56 PM
 
3,421 posts, read 934,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
I would have.
You are ONE person. Science has to consider generalities and probabilities. I have said this a lot already, no one gets it.
 
Old 07-27-2018, 05:08 PM
 
5,653 posts, read 3,201,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You are ONE person. Science has to consider generalities and probabilities. I have said this a lot already, no one gets it.
I for one do. Other than my OB 34 years ago, I would like to smack every doctor the few times I have ever sought medical treatment since then. FYI, I am turning 70 in a couple of months.
 
Old 07-27-2018, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,556 posts, read 17,669,809 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You are ONE person. Science has to consider generalities and probabilities. I have said this a lot already, no one gets it.
Here's a whole discussion on it.

http://web.mit.edu/7.01x/7.013/docum....013Lect30.pdf

Shows that one of the top causes of death was infectious and communicable disease. I mean it's like 6000 years ago so I hope that meets your requirements.

Here is another:

How 10 ancient humans met their death | Abroad in the Yard

And another:

https://www.ranker.com/list/common-c...me/philgibbons
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Old 07-27-2018, 05:39 PM
 
3,421 posts, read 934,910 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikala43 View Post
Here's a whole discussion on it.

http://web.mit.edu/7.01x/7.013/docum....013Lect30.pdf

Shows that one of the top causes of death was infectious and communicable disease. I mean it's like 6000 years ago so I hope that meets your requirements.

Here is another:

How 10 ancient humans met their death | Abroad in the Yard

And another:

https://www.ranker.com/list/common-c...me/philgibbons
You don't seem to be replying to the main point of the post. Yes, people used to die from infections, because they didn't have antibiotics. And they didn't get cancer, heart disease, etc. And infant mortality was high, bringing the average lifespan way down.

So what is your point?
 
Old 07-27-2018, 05:53 PM
 
Location: Middle of the ocean
27,556 posts, read 17,669,809 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You don't seem to be replying to the main point of the post. Yes, people used to die from infections, because they didn't have antibiotics. And they didn't get cancer, heart disease, etc. And infant mortality was high, bringing the average lifespan way down.

So what is your point?

What the? Go back and read you've written in all the posts.

And again, yes, cancer has been found in remains of Egyptians and others, and even dinosaurs. You've been given links in the past, to that info and all the others that disapprove your assertions.

The whole "leading a horse to water" and all that.
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Old 07-27-2018, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Finally the house is done and we are in Port St. Lucie!
3,488 posts, read 1,796,291 times
Reputation: 9683
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
You don't seem to be replying to the main point of the post. Yes, people used to die from infections, because they didn't have antibiotics. And they didn't get cancer, heart disease, etc. And infant mortality was high, bringing the average lifespan way down.

So what is your point?
And you know this how? Did they even have a clue if one had heart disease or cancer etc...

For the time periods anyone references, the longevity for that time period is based on that time periods averages. People are living longer in the current times than they ever have before. Only because we are able to treat infections, diseases etc... with medications. Not to mention open heart surgeries and other surgeries that improve the patient's life.
 
Old 07-27-2018, 06:04 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,159 posts, read 6,344,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Some societies have been and are much more healthy than others. Scientific research has shown this. Contemporary societies have been studied where health is much better than ours, in spite of little or no access to modern medicine.
So how about some documentation to back up your claims?
 
Old 07-27-2018, 06:08 PM
 
1,484 posts, read 334,628 times
Reputation: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
Our mainstream medical system has a certain way of looking at nature, and how it's related to health. In that view, if we lived like our primitive ancestors we would be lucky to survive to age 40.

If you believe that, as most modern Americans probably do, then you might assume that our much longer lifespans are the result of modern medicine. You might assume things like heart disease and cancer are the natural result of aging, and they are common now because we live long enough to get them.

That is the story the medical industry wants you to believe. They believe it themselves, but it also happens to make them look good and to be profitable.

If you didn't have statin drugs, for example, you would be likely to drop dead of a heart attack or stroke in your 40s or 50s.

People who are into a more natural approach to health, on the other hand, don't believe that story at all.

Prehistoric people did NOT drop dead of old age in their 30s, for one thing. No one can be sure how long people lived in various prehistoric cultures, but it is certain that many of them lived to old age. Infants and young people were much more likely to die than in our society, and that brought the average way down.

Different times and places had different average lifespans. In poverty stricken areas, life was short. If we compare ourselves to that, we look great. But there are, and have been, many non-industrial societies where people generally stay healthy into old age. They don't get our "diseases of aging." And they don't get the aches and pains that are supposedly inevitable.

If you have only been exposed to the mainstream narrative, then you are probably skeptical about lifestyle advice and the idea that "natural is better." You probably feel you should take whatever drugs your MD recommends. After all, you think, people over age 50 are only alive because of medical interventions.

For example, the paleo diet is based on what pre-agricultural people probably ate. The assumption behind it is that they were much healthier than we are. Depending on which narrative you believe, you will think that paleo diet sounds like a good idea, or you will think it's nonsense.
Keen observation, OP. I will share my opinion.

I believe that genetics can swing the pendulum of longevity farther than medical treatments or self-administered natural treatments can.

I'm tempted to say favor of civilization vs. lone savagery was the biggest leap in life expectancy for humans, until you think of how disease spread more quickly in denser communities. The lives spared from a very Darwinian death were taken anyway, by disease instead of attacks.

There are people who have won the genetic lottery, and will not die an early death or experience disability despite poor diet, exposure to toxic substances, or lack of access to medical care. Centenarians can come from poor or wealthy backgrounds alike. This is because the very nature of their gift is not what they are given or have access to, but what they won't be needing to live into old age. This is what allows people to reach 100+ in remote locations and even third world countries.
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