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Old 02-05-2019, 03:35 PM
 
1,104 posts, read 470,214 times
Reputation: 1892

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Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Is this something that is being over diagnosed and over treated? Or, am I overlooking a serious safety issue?

Does anyone here want to give me any guidance? Is there any way I can safely avoid this whole sleep apnea treatment?
It is being over diagnosed and over treated. I would make sure you get the actual results. Don't take your doctor's word for it. When I got mine back I was "mild" sleep apnea. I scored around an 84 and the starting point was 79. All over the details in the report it said that several of the "apnea's" they picked up could have been me getting out of bed to use the facilities. I know I got up at least 4 times and they only had 4 serious apneas. When you get up, it said right in the report, it reduces the level of O2 and appears to be an apnea. There were all kind of other details / disclaimers hidden in the report which said to me that I didn't have sleep apnea. My doctor obviously didn't look at it.

I am 100% sure that eventually this will be proven to be a scam. How did we survive all these years without the c-pap machines? I mean really.

I have heard in the past that sleep apnea is a function of not having sufficient nutrients to keep your strength up and that includes when sleeping. So in theory sufficient nutrients can solve it.
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Old 02-05-2019, 03:50 PM
 
3,609 posts, read 1,041,343 times
Reputation: 2703
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
No one is objecting to lifestyle changes if called for- but that is not always the case. And again, one still needs to breathe while other causes and remedies are researched. Nothing wrong with that. What I take issue with is the idea that *whatever* remedy is prescribed by an MD must be wrong.and a handful of "sups" is automatically assumed to be more effective.

Edit - I (and I'm pretty sure at least one other poster) absolutely did ask why the doctor ordered the test - docs generally don't run random tests for no reason. The OP did say his wife said he snored - that is a symptom if sleep apnea.
I would never say that everything prescribed by an MD must be wrong. But when lifestyle is an obvious possible cause, that should at least be mentioned.

I do not automatically assume MDs are wrong, but I don't automatically assume they are right either.

According to the OP, the MD ordered the test and then prescribed a machine. Nothing was said, at first, about lifestyle or possible natural approaches.

And I have NEVER said anything about a "handful of sups." I don't take them and I don't recommend them.

However I do believe that exercise, including yoga, cures a lot of things. And even though mainstream medicine has at last admitted that exercise is needed for health, MDs don't always think to mention it. Even though most Americans get very little exercise, and MDs should think about it and mention it. And it should be mentioned on a health forum, but usually isn't.
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Old 02-05-2019, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Southern California
20,977 posts, read 7,031,073 times
Reputation: 14060
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
Yes, weight can be a cause....even so, while losing weight one still needs to breathe.

And sinus issues have treatments they require as well.

Why the objection to a machine that pushes plain (or hydrated) air? No meds there.
Many find objections with the machine. I can't imagine sleeping with a machine type thing on my face for 8 hrs or so. I've read other sites and many object to the devices. I have no objections whatever a person wants to use is their choice, but I would seek out other means if it were me...that's all. We all have opinions, right?
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Old 02-05-2019, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Southern California
20,977 posts, read 7,031,073 times
Reputation: 14060
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciesmom View Post
No one is objecting to lifestyle changes if called for- but that is not always the case. And again, one still needs to breathe while other causes and remedies are researched. Nothing wrong with that. What I take issue with is the idea that *whatever* remedy is prescribed by an MD must be wrong.and a handful of "sups" is automatically assumed to be more effective.

Edit - I (and I'm pretty sure at least one other poster) absolutely did ask why the doctor ordered the test - docs generally don't run random tests for no reason. The OP did say his wife said he snored - that is a symptom if sleep apnea.
Well then everyone must have apnea as MOST I would think snore, from young to old. I don't know if I do as no one here to tell me if I do. When I would visit my parents, my dad would shake the house with his snoring, mom was a light snorer.
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Old 02-05-2019, 05:23 PM
 
27,545 posts, read 38,904,495 times
Reputation: 35683
Quote:
Originally Posted by EmilyFoxSeaton View Post
It is being over diagnosed and over treated. I would make sure you get the actual results. Don't take your doctor's word for it. When I got mine back I was "mild" sleep apnea. I scored around an 84 and the starting point was 79. All over the details in the report it said that several of the "apnea's" they picked up could have been me getting out of bed to use the facilities. I know I got up at least 4 times and they only had 4 serious apneas. When you get up, it said right in the report, it reduces the level of O2 and appears to be an apnea. There were all kind of other details / disclaimers hidden in the report which said to me that I didn't have sleep apnea. My doctor obviously didn't look at it.

I am 100% sure that eventually this will be proven to be a scam. How did we survive all these years without the c-pap machines? I mean really.

I have heard in the past that sleep apnea is a function of not having sufficient nutrients to keep your strength up and that includes when sleeping. So in theory sufficient nutrients can solve it.
It is not a scam. Firsthand experience here. Not only do I use one, and have for 9 years, I have recommended them to many friends who now (like me) swear by them.

Just because you had a borderline result does not mean it's a scam. What it most likely means is that you did a lousy job of picking a doctor.

And I've been down the "nutrient" and "supplement" road numerous times and none of it has worked for me. Therefore it must be a scam. See how that works? At least I made multiple efforts instead of bailing immediately.

That said I am still trying them for pain. Some of us don't just give up at the drop of a hat. Organized medicine cannot help with my pain so I'm trying alternatives. I don't slam the door shut because of past failures. That would be stupid.
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Old 02-05-2019, 05:45 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,250 posts, read 797,135 times
Reputation: 4610
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
I am already regretting letting my family doctor talk me into to getting a sleep study.

Yesterday, I got a call indicating that based on the information they got from the sleep study that I now have a diagnosis of "moderate sleep apnea". At one point my oxygen levels dropped to 79. The study information indicates that I might wake up as much as twenty times an hour while sleeping.

The crazy thing is that I do not feel tired when I get up. I've always managed well on six to seven hours of sleep in a day. I do not fall asleep at my desk at work. I do not fall asleep in my car.

I do not relish the thought of sleeping with a mask over my face for the rest of my life. I have had an issue in the past with sinus infections and I am concerned that I will get more of these wearing an oxygen mask all night. I'm confident both my parents had untreated sleep apnea and got through very long lives without any incident.

Is this something that is being over diagnosed and over treated? Or, am I overlooking a serious safety issue?

Does anyone here want to give me any guidance? Is there any way I can safely avoid this whole sleep apnea treatment?

Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
I am already regretting letting my family doctor talk me into to getting a sleep study.

Yesterday, I got a call indicating that based on the information they got from the sleep study that I now have a diagnosis of "moderate sleep apnea". At one point my oxygen levels dropped to 79. The study information indicates that I might wake up as much as twenty times an hour while sleeping.

The crazy thing is that I do not feel tired when I get up. I've always managed well on six to seven hours of sleep in a day. I do not fall asleep at my desk at work. I do not fall asleep in my car.

I do not relish the thought of sleeping with a mask over my face for the rest of my life. I have had an issue in the past with sinus infections and I am concerned that I will get more of these wearing an oxygen mask all night. I'm confident both my parents had untreated sleep apnea and got through very long lives without any incident.

Is this something that is being over diagnosed and over treated? Or, am I overlooking a serious safety issue?

Does anyone here want to give me any guidance? Is there any way I can safely avoid this whole sleep apnea treatment?

I haven't read any of the fantasies presented after the first couple here. BUT_ you're absolutely right, there's a huge financial incentive to test for and treat Sleep Apnea Syndrome. Eg: Prior to ACA, any physician was allowed to do DOT truck driver's physicals. ACA, a prime example of Crony Capitalism, provided that only certified physicians having jumped thru all the licensure & permitting processes, so onerous that only large group/corporations could comply were allowed to perform the service. Now virtually EVERY truck driver is found to meet standards ( such as >17 in. neck !!??) for referral for expensive sleep studies.


Now the facts: studies actually show that only those with SEVERE sleep apnea are at significantly greater risk of death (and even that is only ~ 10% increased risk over 12 yrs. That risk diminishes with age and is only improved by a few percent with CPAP treatment.
https://err.ersjournals.com/content/16/106/203


If you have less than severe SA, particularly since yours is asymptomatic, then forgetting about it may be a reasonable choice. If you have severe SA, then a trial of CPAP may be worth it. If you can't tolerate it, then you play the odds.
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Old 02-05-2019, 05:59 PM
 
27,545 posts, read 38,904,495 times
Reputation: 35683
I'll give you some facts from personal experience instead of some study paid for by God knows who.

It does NOT get better with age. It gets worse. Anyone who says otherwise is a fool. Stating a few percent improvement is ridiculous. Again, I took my CPAP test and slept 3 1/2 hours. I stopped breathing 121 times. With a CPAP I don't stop breathing. Period.

That study, at least from my experience (and those I know who use one) is bull****.

Seems it's a race to publish so they can get grants. Yeah, I'm buying into that scenario.

https://www.ersnet.org/professional-...d-sponsorships

Edit: Readers should be told that the study was for mortality rates. While a good thing to look at it ignores everyone who isn't going to die from apnea. Like me. Mainly because I use a CPAP.
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Old 02-05-2019, 06:11 PM
 
Location: Central IL
14,175 posts, read 7,719,041 times
Reputation: 33088
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
No one objected to the machine. I objected to the fact that there was hardly any advice about trying to correct the cause.

Lifestyle diseases can be prevented, and can often be cured without medical interventions. A machine may be necessary, but it should not be the first thing you think of.

Yet the OP said nothing about lifestyle, and most comments said nothing about it.
We knew we could count on you to cover lifestyle!

Lots of times sleep apnea can be improved by losing weight - but not always - and there is usually a physiological component that weight loss won't fully resolve.

And even if someone is willing and able to lose 50 pounds, that doesn't happen overnight. It could easily take a year to lose that in a healthy manner - do you expect them to NOT use a CPAP until they've dutifully lost the weight? That sounds like someone more interested in punishing someone than improving their quality of life.
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Old 02-05-2019, 06:22 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,449 posts, read 6,629,156 times
Reputation: 13412
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good4Nothin View Post
I would never say that everything prescribed by an MD must be wrong. But when lifestyle is an obvious possible cause, that should at least be mentioned.

I do not automatically assume MDs are wrong, but I don't automatically assume they are right either.

According to the OP, the MD ordered the test and then prescribed a machine. Nothing was said, at first, about lifestyle or possible natural approaches.

And I have NEVER said anything about a "handful of sups." I don't take them and I don't recommend them.

However I do believe that exercise, including yoga, cures a lot of things. And even though mainstream medicine has at last admitted that exercise is needed for health, MDs don't always think to mention it. Even though most Americans get very little exercise, and MDs should think about it and mention it. And it should be mentioned on a health forum, but usually isn't.
I don't believe I have ever gone to a physician who did NOT emphasize the importance of regular exercise in maintaining a healthy life style.
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Old 02-05-2019, 06:38 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,449 posts, read 6,629,156 times
Reputation: 13412
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
Of course you've never tried it either. You've never had your spouse wake you up in a panic because you haven't taken a breath for so long that they expect you to die.

I have. Many times.

Wearing one like I wear is so non-invasive that I don't realize I'm wearing it unless I knock it loose. I won't even take a nap without it. I won't because I wake up gasping for air with my heart pounding.

The downside to the anti-doctor fanatics is that treatment is ignored by people who believe you and take some "magic" powder. Then we hear later that they died of a heart attack brought on by apnea.

The problem with your opinions is that you are convincing people to ignore what might save their life.
I'd hope most people would consider the source, and take this poster's comments with a very large grain of salt.

Regarding sleep apnea, my husband had a severe case, probably not helped by his asthma, and I think his sleep study and subsequent use of a CPap machine probably did save his life. His breathing was obstructed, can't even begin to count the number of times he stopped breathing, and his sleep quality was lousy. He had a number of very close calls with accidents when he fell asleep while driving. He's had the CPap machine for many years now, his quality of sleep is excellent now, and he wouldn't be without the CPap at this point.
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