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Old 04-13-2019, 06:02 PM
 
Location: Southern California
22,356 posts, read 7,577,391 times
Reputation: 14736

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Being one of the real seniors here, I don't think there were labs before the Synthroid world exploded and the drug came on the scene and the labs...which came first I wonder.

The doctors before didn't have labs and went by patient's symptoms..and there are MANY symptoms for hypot and would give patients theraputic dose of Armour and then go from there having the patient come back to say how they were doing and then the doc would dose up a little more etc.

That's how my D.O. got me on the road to good health and out of depression....no labs, just starting with low dose Armour and today I'm on 2 grains NT. 17 yrs to get to 2 grains.
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Old 04-13-2019, 06:06 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,569 posts, read 6,807,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miley881 View Post
I am a 37 year old female and have a lot of trouble loosing weight ( working with a nutritionist and fitness trainer for 6 months) but no success. Canít lose a single pound.i am not overweight. 5í7; 150lbs.
My metabolism got tested and is apparently well below normal for my age. Base caloric need is 1100 calories.

So my doctor tested thyroid levels...

T3 free 2.2
T4 0.9
TSH 1.7


Is this normal ... can anyone interpret these numbers before I go to the follow up?




Thank you
M

Those results have to be compared with the testing laboratory's normal range for each of the tests to determine if they're normal or not. Those normal ranges should have appeared next to each test result on the report.

Your doctor is the best person to explain those results to you, he/she can do it in the perspective of your own health and wellness.
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Old 04-13-2019, 07:02 PM
Status: "impatiently waiting for Summer!" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: The Ozone Layer, apparently...
1,822 posts, read 620,580 times
Reputation: 3700
Aside from your test results, there is a correlation between your thyroid and your liver. Adrenals. If you haven't done so already, you might find you can straighten yourself right out by adopting a whole grain plant based diet...I'm just saying.

"Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food." - Hippocrates
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Old 04-13-2019, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Southern California
22,356 posts, read 7,577,391 times
Reputation: 14736
Quote:
Originally Posted by ComeCloser View Post
Aside from your test results, there is a correlation between your thyroid and your liver. Adrenals. If you haven't done so already, you might find you can straighten yourself right out by adopting a whole grain plant based diet...I'm just saying.

"Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food." - Hippocrates
Could be a lot to that, my issue didn't hit me until I was about 53 and that was post menopause. Finally got on the Armour at 63....10 tough yrs of depression and I believe it was low thyroid but the MD's were going by their numbers. Even if the numbers are gospel, our bodies are all different and so our needs.
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Old 04-13-2019, 08:53 PM
 
3,534 posts, read 2,074,340 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parentologist View Post
Lots of totally healthy people have anti-thyroid antibodies. It doesn't mean that they are low or high thyroid. As long as your TSH and free T4 are in the normal range, your thyroid function is fine.

Quacks (naturopaths and such) are making money off diagnosing a condition that people don't have, and "treating" it with animal-derived thyroid supplements that are digested in your stomach. These are largely ineffective, and if they DID have an effect, it would make you hyperthyroid, leading to muscle loss, tachycardia, diarrhea, and other problems.
Are you kidding me? You will be the second person I say this to tonight: I sincerely hope you have thyroid issues in the future so you can see first hand what an asinine comment that is. Your list of symptoms for people being treated with NDT is actually laughable. Taking NDT at the correct dose will NOT make you hyper. I have to say I have never heard that theory before and I hope I don't hear it again.

Thyroid tests (ALL lab test for that matter) are not about being "in range". It's where in range that's what important. Relying on TSH will typically keep a patient under dosed.

Consider this: If your B12 level comes in at 401, and the range is 400-1200, yes, you are technically in range. But you are 2 points away from being out of range, and for something like B12 that is important. Thyroid is no different.

First off, the antibody tests can determine if you have an autoimmune disease called Hashimotos or Graves. Graves will make you HYPERthyroid and Hashi's can swing you from low to high, although it is usually low.

Those will Hashi's may also find some other issues, like MTFHR defects, which can hinder things like B12 absorption. You may need to take a different type that you'd normally pick up. In general, Hashi's patients may find they don't absorb meds or foods well and may have low stomach acid.

Why this knowledge is important: some people who suffer from low thyroid end up feeling tired and depressed. Some end up on antidepressants. Antidepressants will do nothing for them because it is not the real issue.

Another reason why, and this from personal experience. I had an episode last fall in the middle of the night. After it was over, I googled (because I was wide awake) to find out that what happened to me was (per google) acid reflux. Along with dire consequences of not getting it checked out. Dire as in cancer, Except I'd been tested for low stomach acid the year before. I checked with my doctor who confirmed that symptoms of low and excess stomach acid can be the same. Had I gone to my regular doctor without the knowledge of my low stomach acid, he would have tossed a script at me for acid reflux. And it would not have solved my problem at all. Actually, I was told I had acid reflux when my appendix was failing. That was a nightmare. They tried to convince me to remove my gallbladder and I'm glad I waited because 2 weeks later I was in the hospital with a gallbladder that was fine, and an appendix that wasn't. It's really hard to know who to believe anymore.
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Old 04-13-2019, 09:43 PM
 
3,961 posts, read 3,618,807 times
Reputation: 10720
Quote:
Originally Posted by WouldLoveTo View Post
Are you kidding me? You will be the second person I say this to tonight: I sincerely hope you have thyroid issues in the future so you can see first hand what an asinine comment that is. Your list of symptoms for people being treated with NDT is actually laughable. Taking NDT at the correct dose will NOT make you hyper. I have to say I have never heard that theory before and I hope I don't hear it again.

Thyroid tests (ALL lab test for that matter) are not about being "in range". It's where in range that's what important. Relying on TSH will typically keep a patient under dosed.

Consider this: If your B12 level comes in at 401, and the range is 400-1200, yes, you are technically in range. But you are 2 points away from being out of range, and for something like B12 that is important. Thyroid is no different.

First off, the antibody tests can determine if you have an autoimmune disease called Hashimotos or Graves. Graves will make you HYPERthyroid and Hashi's can swing you from low to high, although it is usually low.

Those will Hashi's may also find some other issues, like MTFHR defects, which can hinder things like B12 absorption. You may need to take a different type that you'd normally pick up. In general, Hashi's patients may find they don't absorb meds or foods well and may have low stomach acid.

Why this knowledge is important: some people who suffer from low thyroid end up feeling tired and depressed. Some end up on antidepressants. Antidepressants will do nothing for them because it is not the real issue.

Another reason why, and this from personal experience. I had an episode last fall in the middle of the night. After it was over, I googled (because I was wide awake) to find out that what happened to me was (per google) acid reflux. Along with dire consequences of not getting it checked out. Dire as in cancer, Except I'd been tested for low stomach acid the year before. I checked with my doctor who confirmed that symptoms of low and excess stomach acid can be the same. Had I gone to my regular doctor without the knowledge of my low stomach acid, he would have tossed a script at me for acid reflux. And it would not have solved my problem at all. Actually, I was told I had acid reflux when my appendix was failing. That was a nightmare. They tried to convince me to remove my gallbladder and I'm glad I waited because 2 weeks later I was in the hospital with a gallbladder that was fine, and an appendix that wasn't. It's really hard to know who to believe anymore.
Too late! I've had mild autoimmune thyroiditis since my 20s, and finally became mildly hypothyroid in my 40s. Once my TSH finally rose and fT4 dropped, I went on a low dose of levothyroxine. No big deal. And oh, that lovely MTFHR business. That too, I've seen kids whose mom has been "diagnosed" with MTFHR, seeking the same diagnosis for their child. In fact, this is a very common scenario - parents, usually mothers, who have been to a naturopath and been diagnosed with all sorts of issues that have no basis in science, who are on treatments that have no basis in science, who then seek the same diagnoses and treatments for their children, because, after all, if they're special and have these special conditions, their children must be special and must have them too. And it's ALL total quackery, real snake oil, taking advantage of anxious, nervous people who make a huge deal out of nothing.
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Old Yesterday, 05:26 AM
 
3,534 posts, read 2,074,340 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parentologist View Post
Too late! I've had mild autoimmune thyroiditis since my 20s, and finally became mildly hypothyroid in my 40s. Once my TSH finally rose and fT4 dropped, I went on a low dose of levothyroxine. No big deal. And oh, that lovely MTFHR business. That too, I've seen kids whose mom has been "diagnosed" with MTFHR, seeking the same diagnosis for their child. In fact, this is a very common scenario - parents, usually mothers, who have been to a naturopath and been diagnosed with all sorts of issues that have no basis in science, who are on treatments that have no basis in science, who then seek the same diagnoses and treatments for their children, because, after all, if they're special and have these special conditions, their children must be special and must have them too. And it's ALL total quackery, real snake oil, taking advantage of anxious, nervous people who make a huge deal out of nothing.
Wait - we forgot to mention Lyme and the effect it can have on all of this!

I sincerely envy you if a low dose of Levo is working for you. It did nothing for me. I felt great for a week, so so for the next week and then I crashed. Raise the dose, same thing. Went on NDT 6 months later and felt like a new person. 2 years later, new doctor, Levo with T3, immediate crash. Raise the dose, eh. One year later we tried NDT again and worlds better.

That doctor moved away and my new one has been progressive in trying a few combinations. I know people who love being on T3 only and I don't think I am one of them, I tried a low dose of NDT with T3, and I really didn't feel good until I increased my NDT again. I don't think I want to do T3 only, although he threw it out there as an option.

I also have a "multi-noduled goiter". My old PCP picked up on that.

Since all that started (2012), my hormones started changing so the last year has been a b*tch to say the least. I'll be happy when they finally settle down.

I have seen regular doctors and NDs. I think it's all dependent on who you get. It was an ND that gave me the combo Levo that didn't work, but he swore by it for Hashi's patients. I've had regular docs run gobs of labs on me and others who did nothing. I had one refuse to recheck my B12 after a year of supplementing. My first test was under 300 - WELL under range and I wanted to make sure the supplements were working. Being over can be as bad as under (per that doctor) and I thought it important to check. What do I know?

I agree with you on the moms and kids - that sounds absolutely crazy. And stupid! Today's moms are anxious enough!
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Old Yesterday, 05:59 AM
 
Location: Minnesota
515 posts, read 169,739 times
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I've been on Synthroid for over 30 years. I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism at age 16 due to a goiter that was extremely painful. My numbers were way off but I couldn't tell you what they were. Over the years I have been tested for autoimmune inflammatory thyroid conditions (such as hashimotos) but always negative. My TSH has been as high as 100 (in college when I thought I didn't need thyroid meds anymore). So many things affect how well my meds work. I am also in surgical menopause and on hrt, and any imbalance in that can throw off thyroid despite meds. Stress can knock it out of whack, or eating too much soy, or taking calcium too close to thyroid meds etc. I try to always take my thyroid meds hours from eating anything.

I have always been a low normal weight and for a while I lost down to very underweight despite surgical menopause and thyroid problems and being in my forties. If you are not overweight to begin with, losing weight is much harder. You have to be very very strict with diet, and no cheat days. Exercise is also vital though plays a smaller role than diet. Exercise has given me a better metabolism, and has helped regulate my thyroid so much better. I started exercising regularly in 2007 and have needed far fewer med adjustments since then. I am 47 now and I am still very strict with diet as far as eating very healthy (but way more calories than when I was trying to lose weight), but since I am not trying to lose weight I do allow myself an occasional meal or snack that is outside my definition of "healthy" such as chocolate pancakes or a cookie at work. Not a regular occurrence though. I love to exercise so it is no problem for me, and I love how it gives my body a more firm appearance, and gives me more energy.

To me those labs look very normal, but the reference ranges might be different. I will say that menopause can also slow down metabolism and cause weight to shift more to middle. I never went through natural menopause, I went full blown surgical menopause instantly at age 33. My body changed a lot. I can no longer take it for granted. If I didn't have to be on thyroid meds I wouldn't because three decades of being on Synthroid did a number on my bone density. I was diagnosed with osteoporosis long before my eating disorder started.
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Old Yesterday, 08:21 AM
 
5,317 posts, read 6,527,005 times
Reputation: 8400
Quote:
Originally Posted by parentologist View Post
Too late! I've had mild autoimmune thyroiditis since my 20s, and finally became mildly hypothyroid in my 40s. Once my TSH finally rose and fT4 dropped, I went on a low dose of levothyroxine. No big deal. And oh, that lovely MTFHR business. That too, I've seen kids whose mom has been "diagnosed" with MTFHR, seeking the same diagnosis for their child. In fact, this is a very common scenario - parents, usually mothers, who have been to a naturopath and been diagnosed with all sorts of issues that have no basis in science, who are on treatments that have no basis in science, who then seek the same diagnoses and treatments for their children, because, after all, if they're special and have these special conditions, their children must be special and must have them too. And it's ALL total quackery, real snake oil, taking advantage of anxious, nervous people who make a huge deal out of nothing.
Where did you get your medical degree from? My doctor got his from the University of Texas, and he completely disagrees with everything you wrote. And like most medical conditions, these things are very ofen hereditary.
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Old Yesterday, 08:25 AM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,697 posts, read 942,853 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TestEngr View Post
Your Free T4 is just slightly lower than most people would test and just above the minimum of normal so not the best. The Free t3 which is the active thyroid hormone and has the most to do with how you feel at 2.2 is really a poor normal. I would probably want a small dose of NDT/DTE and get the FT4 just over 1 and the FT3 into the 3's (US labs). NDT/DTE like Armour, Nature-throid, NP Thyroid, are best divided in the day with lab testing in AM before eating or taking thyroid hormone pills.

Testing for Hashimoto's and Graves (TPO-AB and also helpful TgAB) is always advisable to rule out these conditions.

RE: "normal"-- by definition = pertaining to the norm, ie- mathematical average of the population. It compares the individual to the population, but says nothing about what the "healthy value" is for the individual. Eg- what about a guy who develops a pituitary tumor ? He's 5'7" at age 23, but grows to 5'11" at age 30. Both heights are in the normal range....What's most important is how an individual's test results change over time....Knowing "baseline" is important. That's one reason routine screening tests are done.


The OP's values are low normal now. What were thy before? What will they be in the future? Should we do anything now?...Yes... just wait and repeat the tests later.




RE: significance of thyroid antibodies-- it doesn't affect treatment. The same thyroid replacement therapy with levothyroxine is used to correct the hypothyroidism whether the dx is "officially" Grave's or Hashimoto's. [Every once in awhile a pt with Grave's will develop exophthalmos that requires treatment with steroids-- but that has nothing to do with the thyroid status, and the antibody levels don't change treatment.]
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