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Old 06-07-2022, 11:05 PM
 
Location: Santa Barbara CA
5,016 posts, read 11,979,312 times
Reputation: 9817

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I will be having a total knee replacement next month. Despite the extreme pain I have managed to maintain pretty good function in my knee but it is bone on bone and various injections have done nothing to relieve the pain. PT has helped with the function but not the pain.

For those that have had the surgery I have a couple questions. I will spend one night at the hospital then go home and will have someone staying with me the first 5 nights I am home. I have the option of having a nerve block done and while I can see where it would be a good idea to prevent pain those first couple days does it make it harder to do PT and walk? I have never had a block but would think it would cause your leg to feel numb and wouldn't that make walking and PT in general more difficult?

I have a two story home and have a twin trundle bed in the guest room. I could bring the lower trundle bed down stairs if necessary so am wondering if you have had a TKR and live in a two story home did you go up and down stairs from the first day home or did you stay on the first floor for awhile? I actually have a very soft down couch which I love to sleep on but it will be too difficult to get up from it after surgery for awhile. A bed would be higher and firmer thus easier. So I either bring a bed downstairs or sleep upstairs in my own bed.

Any other advice to make life easier those first few weeks? I will have a walker, ice machine and raised toilet seat with handles also a grab bar for the shower and plan to make a lot of freezer dinners that can be popped in the microwave. I know there will be pain especially the first couple weeks but the pain I currently have is pretty severe so that does not worry me as knowing it will improve with time will be something to look forward too. I know it will involve a lot of PT but I have been doing exercises from the PT I did last year almost everyday to maintain function of the knee and keep the muscles strong. Getting older sucks!
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Old 06-08-2022, 03:35 AM
 
3,085 posts, read 5,758,565 times
Reputation: 4440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
I will be having a total knee replacement next month. Despite the extreme pain I have managed to maintain pretty good function in my knee but it is bone on bone and various injections have done nothing to relieve the pain. PT has helped with the function but not the pain.
Have you ever tried Collagen supplements for the pain. 12 years ago I could not do a squat without knee pain and I had knee pain walking down hill. After a few weeks on the Drs Best Hyaluronic Acid/Collagen supplement my knees were pain free and have remained pain free. I still take it and alternate it with Solgar 7.

https://www.iherb.com/r/doctor-s-bes...ranslated=true


I also know several people who had relief of knee pain after taking Solgar 7. This supplement contains UC-II collagen.

https://www.nutritionaloutlook.com/v...nd-chondroitin

https://www.newhope.com/food-amp-bev...es-gras-status

Some Amazon reviewers of Solgar 7 also report very good results.

https://www.amazon.com/Solgar-No-Veg...ews-filter-bar

" I have bad arthritis and knee pain from severe ligament and meniscus damage, I was gobbling several naproxen tablets a day and still unable to walk very far or even get out of bed some days. A few weeks on this stuff and I had reduced my naproxen intake to one tablet every few days if that, and walking a mile a day without pain."

"My pain was debilitating so I started off with 3 pills per day (one is recommended). Within a week I obtained relief. Within 2 the pain was gone. "

"after about a week my pain went from 9-10 to 0-1"

"About 10 years ago my health food store owner recommended this product. My knees are bone on bone and I am pain free. The only time I experienced any pain was when I pushed the exercise too far. I golf three times a week and I also take walks. I highly recommend!"


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
Any other advice to make life easier those first few weeks?
Vitacost has a large variety of healthy food available for delivery if you get tired of Amazon Fresh and Instacart deliveries.

https://www.vitacost.com/food-grocery-2

https://www.vitacost.com/soups-9

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
PT has helped with the function but not the pain.
According to Scott Sonnon one has to work on hip and ankle mobility to alleviate knee pain.

https://twitter.com/flowcoach/status/665265292826640384

The beginner part of his Intuflow Joint Mobility program is available for free on youtube.
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Old 06-08-2022, 04:34 AM
 
Location: Southern New Hampshire
9,476 posts, read 16,330,502 times
Reputation: 32903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
I will be having a total knee replacement next month. Despite the extreme pain I have managed to maintain pretty good function in my knee but it is bone on bone and various injections have done nothing to relieve the pain. PT has helped with the function but not the pain.

For those that have had the surgery I have a couple questions. I will spend one night at the hospital then go home and will have someone staying with me the first 5 nights I am home. I have the option of having a nerve block done and while I can see where it would be a good idea to prevent pain those first couple days does it make it harder to do PT and walk? I have never had a block but would think it would cause your leg to feel numb and wouldn't that make walking and PT in general more difficult?
OP, I had a TKR on my left leg in February 2020 (just before all the COVID craziness hit the U.S.), then a TKR on my right leg in July 2020 (postponed from May 2020 due to COVID). I had general anesthesia for both, nothing else (i.e. no nerve block), and the pain afterward was substantial, but of course I expected it to be. Opioids did absolutely nothing for me (morphine, oxy, hydrocodone, etc. -- NONE of them worked) so I went off them within a couple of days both times. That wasn't fun, but again, I knew the pain would lessen day by day, and it did, so I just lived with it. (The worst was when I was trying to sleep; I can't tell you how many times I screamed at my leg, "Stop hurting!" Of course that didn't work any better than the opioids. )

I think if you take large enough doses of the opioids, they will work, but then you won't be able to do things like drive, and I wanted to drive very quickly as I like being very independent. I didn't have anyone stay with me (of course I had close friends that I could have called on for help if needed, but I didn't have to), and I managed just fine. My house is 2 stories too, so before the first TKR I set up my first-floor TV room as my new "bedroom" -- it had a chair bed that I slept on. That worked fine although the TV room doesn't have a door so I could not keep my cats from "visiting" me when I slept.

The PT afterward is REALLY important, so I suggest maybe checking with your surgeon to see if the nerve block might affect that. (I can't imagine that it would affect it TOO much if they are telling you a nerve block is an option, though?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
I have a two story home and have a twin trundle bed in the guest room. I could bring the lower trundle bed down stairs if necessary so am wondering if you have had a TKR and live in a two story home did you go up and down stairs from the first day home or did you stay on the first floor for awhile? I actually have a very soft down couch which I love to sleep on but it will be too difficult to get up from it after surgery for awhile. A bed would be higher and firmer thus easier. So I either bring a bed downstairs or sleep upstairs in my own bed.
Two things. Number 1, I was able to climb stairs from day 1, although it was very, very slow going and painful too -- but still do-able. Number 2, I absolutely would NOT recommend sleeping on a LOWER trundle bed -- as in, it's basically on the floor, right? If you use that, you will have a VERY VERY VERY hard time getting out of the bed. I found this out the hard way ... I can't remember why (probably the kitties' fault!) but I gave up on the chair bed after only a few nights, figuring I could manage the stairs a few times a day (the master bedroom is on the 2nd floor). Unfortunately, I had a HORRIBLE time getting INTO the bed so at some point I pushed my mattress onto the floor and was finally able to sleep ... but a few hours later, I woke up having to go to the bathroom, and I could not stand up ... I literally had to crawl to the bedroom door, then out into the hall, then into the bathroom, then pull myself up onto the toilet so I could pee. That was frankly the worst experience I had during either recovery.

So again: I advise no lower trundle!

Oh, in the first or second week after my first TKR, my hospital physical therapist taught me how to lift my (operated) leg onto the bed with my cane -- I don't know why the nurses didn't share that info with me before I left the hospital the first time. Once I learned that trick (you just use the cane's hook to grab your foot and lift the leg onto the bed), I never had problems getting into/out of bed again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
Any other advice to make life easier those first few weeks? I will have a walker, ice machine and raised toilet seat with handles also a grab bar for the shower and plan to make a lot of freezer dinners that can be popped in the microwave. I know there will be pain especially the first couple weeks but the pain I currently have is pretty severe so that does not worry me as knowing it will improve with time will be something to look forward too. I know it will involve a lot of PT but I have been doing exercises from the PT I did last year almost everyday to maintain function of the knee and keep the muscles strong. Getting older sucks!
I didn't have a toilet with handles, but I managed OK (my toilet seats are the newer, higher ones, which I'm sure helped). Before the 2nd surgery, I bought one of those portable toilets with arms (I think it was $30) and kept that in the master bedroom for the first few weeks; I could have done without it, but I have to say, it was really convenient to have it so close. My shower DID have grab bars (from the previous owner of the house, who was in his 80s), so that was fine. Oh, I found the walker cumbersome, so after the 2nd surgery, I was using my cane by day 2 -- that was MUCH easier.

I think you will do just fine, and after you recover you will ask yourself why you waited so long to have the surgery! I know I did. I'm now 63 and anyone seeing me doing any kind of normal activities would have no idea that I have 2 artificial knees -- they are serving me very well.

I wish you the best -- please come back and post afterward to let us know how it goes!
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Old 06-08-2022, 11:35 AM
 
Location: equator
9,923 posts, read 4,888,444 times
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I had both knees done in 2013 at the same time. I used crutches after and had PT at the rehab center for 10 days. They sent me home with a machine that flexed the knee for you and I used that for weeks. I had a regimented schedule of exercises at home to do and did those religiously.

No walker or cane, just crutches for about a month or maybe even less. My case was unusual in that I had no pain before or after. I only did it because my knees were so weak and had NO cartilage. However, the operation did not solve the weakness. The surgeon said I "should have had pain", so who knows.

I could climb stairs after a couple weeks but did not try right away since our house was one-level. Did get a raised toilet seat and have used it ever since. Normal-height bed. I don't recall trouble getting in or out of it.

My biggest disappointment was the inability to squat or crouch fully, and no kneeling unless on a pillow. The "caps" are really sensitive and I hate not being able to squat past half. But that's how it is, said the ortho doc.

Wishing you the best!
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Old 06-08-2022, 06:07 PM
 
15,594 posts, read 10,623,941 times
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MrsM was home in one day with TKR (twice) and revisions (twice, second revision, she came home the same day) PT worked with her immediately on steps


Home is Tri-Level with bathrooms on bottom and top floors. She came down stairs once daily for a week.



No problems
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Old 06-08-2022, 08:16 PM
 
690 posts, read 282,252 times
Reputation: 1858
I had TKR and it was great. I had very little pain, mostly just uncomfortable from swelling. But once that was gone, I had no pain at all and never used pain meds.

They WANT you to use the knee. Go up and down the stairs, bend your knee, do exercises. PT pushed hard to get my knee to bend and get it going. Not fun but I was walking without any assistance, cane, walker, and driving within the month.

I hope it goes well for you OP.
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Old 06-08-2022, 08:48 PM
 
Location: Santa Barbara CA
5,016 posts, read 11,979,312 times
Reputation: 9817
Thanks for all the replies.

By lower trundle bed I meant the bed that slides under the other one but the frame can be raised so it is the same height as a normal bed. I can put the two beds together so have a big bed if my guests want to sleep in one bed. It would be no more difficult then other beds to get up off of. I am tall so a raised toilet seat I think will really help and I found one that has handles so figured why not?

I am eating a very low inflammatory diet and as when I was actually eating a keto diet year ago thus very low carbs my joints all felt less stiff so I know how carbs and cutting them can help. I plan to get off opioids as fast as I can and I do have a pretty high pain threshold. I had a hysterectomy 5 years ago and stayed one night in the hospital then went home and once home all I used was Tylenol for a couple days.


I am bone on bone and not only is it painful but sometimes it catches due to bone spurs when I am out walking. It can take minutes to hours to un catch which is never fun and extremely painful so yeah I am tired of trying supplements and injections that really did not help at all. PT helped keep function but did not stop pain or stop the knee from catching so surgery is the answer. I think keeping inflammation down starting before surgery and having good function will help recovery go better and hopefully faster too.
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Old 06-09-2022, 02:03 AM
 
Location: Southern New Hampshire
9,476 posts, read 16,330,502 times
Reputation: 32903
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
Thanks for all the replies.

By lower trundle bed I meant the bed that slides under the other one but the frame can be raised so it is the same height as a normal bed. I can put the two beds together so have a big bed if my guests want to sleep in one bed. It would be no more difficult then other beds to get up off of. I am tall so a raised toilet seat I think will really help and I found one that has handles so figured why not?
Ah, OK, so your bottom trundle bed should work just fine. I have a daybed with trundle in my spare room but the trundle just slides out from under the daybed on casters -- it can't be raised. That's what I was envisioning -- I had forgotten there are some that can "bounce up."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dashdog View Post
I am eating a very low inflammatory diet and as when I was actually eating a keto diet year ago thus very low carbs my joints all felt less stiff so I know how carbs and cutting them can help. I plan to get off opioids as fast as I can and I do have a pretty high pain threshold. I had a hysterectomy 5 years ago and stayed one night in the hospital then went home and once home all I used was Tylenol for a couple days.

I am bone on bone and not only is it painful but sometimes it catches due to bone spurs when I am out walking. It can take minutes to hours to un catch which is never fun and extremely painful so yeah I am tired of trying supplements and injections that really did not help at all. PT helped keep function but did not stop pain or stop the knee from catching so surgery is the answer. I think keeping inflammation down starting before surgery and having good function will help recovery go better and hopefully faster too.
Oh, this sounds awful. I was bone on bone with both knees before the surgery (which is why I wish I had had the surgery many years earlier!). I tried an injection just before I took my students on a trip to the UK in May 2019 -- I had heard wonderful things about how well the injections work so I had high hopes, but it did absolutely nothing for me. I was totally crushed as it meant I had to miss all the field trips in the UK -- could only do the classroom parts. I want to go back so I can do all the walking I missed!

Anyway, I wish you the best!
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Old 06-09-2022, 07:39 AM
 
1,860 posts, read 1,166,246 times
Reputation: 2765
Quote:
Originally Posted by capoeira View Post
Have you ever tried Collagen supplements for the pain. 12 years ago I could not do a squat without knee pain and I had knee pain walking down hill. After a few weeks on the Drs Best Hyaluronic Acid/Collagen supplement my knees were pain free and have remained pain free. I still take it and alternate it with Solgar 7.

I may try this but I am pleased with the GC w/ turmeric I am using. I was also told I may need a knee replacement in 5-10 years due to OA from a young Orthopedic surgeon who looked at the MRI. Been using a sleeve periodically and icing after workouts.

For those who believe and trust holistic medicine and health, it's worth noting that what reduced inflammation in one culture may not work as well in another. A study of Indian men aged 40-75 vs American men at the same age.

simpelskincarescience.com made me realize this. They noticed a major difference in Korean and Asian diet and the west which contributed to bad skin. In addition, any ingredient that ends in "ate" or "ose" (topical or internal) is a contributor to a natural body fungus which brings on inflammation. It's worth reading their research and studies and ignore the sales links.

So it depends on your diet for the last 40-50 years as to how effective the KR or supplement is. The American diet is high fat and high carbs so inflammation is very prevalent here. While in India they grow up on curcumin, turmeric, and goats without steroids or hormones. Unfortunately, our fast food corporations are expanding worldwide contributing to obesity and bad gut health in other cultures.

Many well respected holistiic doctors claim inflammation and OA is caused from bad diet, declining gut health, and lack of exercise. So, we must take care of that first or in conjunction. Nothing will work to its maximum benefit if the person with inflammatory pain continues to eat the typical diet of burgers, sandwiches, fries, pizzas, processed foods, fried or breaded whatever and sugary drinks. Of course, since the study about UC-II on OA was done in India it suggest parts of their diet are bad too. Your chronological age is not always your effective age.

I may not be communicating it right but over decades bad gut bacteria grows and grows and needs to be deep cleansed or it shows up in your skin and joints later on. Hey I am not perfect either because some foods are hard to give up. So we end up livng to treat it instead of preventing it. GLTA

Last edited by frankrj; 06-09-2022 at 08:27 AM..
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Old 06-09-2022, 08:40 AM
 
15,175 posts, read 24,345,130 times
Reputation: 29080
Quote:
Originally Posted by capoeira View Post
Have you ever tried Collagen supplements for the pain. 12 years ago I could not do a squat without knee pain and I had knee pain walking down hill. After a few weeks on the Drs Best Hyaluronic Acid/Collagen supplement my knees were pain free and have remained pain free. I still take it and alternate it with Solgar 7.

https://www.iherb.com/r/doctor-s-bes...ranslated=true


I also know several people who had relief of knee pain after taking Solgar 7. This supplement contains UC-II collagen.

https://www.nutritionaloutlook.com/v...nd-chondroitin

https://www.newhope.com/food-amp-bev...es-gras-status

Some Amazon reviewers of Solgar 7 also report very good results.

https://www.amazon.com/Solgar-No-Veg...ews-filter-bar

" I have bad arthritis and knee pain from severe ligament and meniscus damage, I was gobbling several naproxen tablets a day and still unable to walk very far or even get out of bed some days. A few weeks on this stuff and I had reduced my naproxen intake to one tablet every few days if that, and walking a mile a day without pain."

"My pain was debilitating so I started off with 3 pills per day (one is recommended). Within a week I obtained relief. Within 2 the pain was gone. "

"after about a week my pain went from 9-10 to 0-1"

"About 10 years ago my health food store owner recommended this product. My knees are bone on bone and I am pain free. The only time I experienced any pain was when I pushed the exercise too far. I golf three times a week and I also take walks. I highly recommend!"




Vitacost has a large variety of healthy food available for delivery if you get tired of Amazon Fresh and Instacart deliveries.

https://www.vitacost.com/food-grocery-2

https://www.vitacost.com/soups-9



According to Scott Sonnon one has to work on hip and ankle mobility to alleviate knee pain.

https://twitter.com/flowcoach/status/665265292826640384

The beginner part of his Intuflow Joint Mobility program is available for free on youtube.
The issue with any supplements like this is you have to have a joint and a meniscus for it to work on. Bone on bone literally means bone on bone. The mechanics that your supplements works on are no longer there for it to work. So unequivocally this stuff will not work.

And the reason I know this is because I am also bone on bone in both knees, and I asked my doctor. And that’s exactly what he said.
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