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Hungary is a Western country. So is Poland.
Russia isn't - not only because of the alphabet and the religion but also the mentality. Democracy has been a minority belief in Russia. Russians care more about competence and strength than they do about freedom. The "Good Czar" mentality still exists (although I hope it will change, I can't be too optimistic)
Before they were communist, they were like a Christian version of Saudi Arabia under the czars, despite some insufficient attempts at reform. They come from a cultural mindset more foreign to the western mentality than Latin America, for example.
So before democracy and "freedom" (whatever that means)? there was no West? Is Greece Eastern because they have a "funny alphabet"? Does that mean Croatia is Western but Serbia is Eastern?
that song REALLY evoked Soviet images like Red Army tanks and massive armies parading through Red Square
This is the anthem. The US anthem resembles the Russian folk song "Hazbulat, you're brave, but you hut is soo poor", so what?
Talking about democracy, the US still don't have direct and equal presidential elections, and the US prison population now is 1.4 times larger than Stalin's GULAG at it's peak (~ 2,300,000 vs 1,730,000), not even mentioning the death penalties that are still in practice now (unlike most European countries including Russia).
America's prison population is there because they are criminals who were convicted after a fair trial. Many of them are also illegal immigrants too, who commit a disproportionate amount of crime in America, while the Soviet gulags were mostly political prisoners who spoke out against the Communist Party and wanted freedom.
I don't really consider Croatia or Serbia to be Western, IMHO the "West" does not include Eastern Europe. I would put Austria and MAYBE the Czech Republic in the West but not anything east of that. This is only because the Czech Republic has integrated into the EU and NATO quite well and is now closer to the Western countries than to the former Warsaw Pact. That and the former East Germany are the only places east of the former Iron Curtain that can really be considered Western. Ukraine and Belarus are also definitely NOT part of the West, neither are Romania, Bulgaria or Moldova or any of the former Yugoslav republics like Bosnia or Kosovo. In fact, Bosnia, Albania, and Kosovo are Islamic states which certainly preclude them from being Western.
Turkey and Japan are NOT considered culturally western (though turkey did a lot of westernization under Ataturk of course) and Israel has unwestern cultural elements. All three were part of the western alliance during the cold war, which is something else - east germany was not part of the "political" west but it was always culturally "western".
They were geopolitically western aswell as economically.
Does that mean Croatia is Western but Serbia is Eastern?
Yes, that's exactly where the boundary is. "Western" refers to the Western Roman Empire and its descendants. If your native language originated in a country that is now or once was Roman Catholic, you are part of Western culture.
Yes, that's exactly where the boundary is. "Western" refers to the Western Roman Empire and its descendants. If your native language originated in a country that is now or once was Roman Catholic, you are part of Western culture.
Exactly. Not only Poland, and Hungary should, and would be considered "western", but Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Czechia, Slovakia, Slovenia, and Croatia as well. Communism was an unnatural interlude forced on most of these countries by the former Soviet Union, and really shouldn't be a deciding factor if they should be considered "western" or not.
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Originally Posted by Rob Allen
Yes, that's exactly where the boundary is. "Western" refers to the Western Roman Empire and its descendants. If your native language originated in a country that is now or once was Roman Catholic, you are part of Western culture.
Poland is culturally Slavic/Eastern European despite being Catholic, as is arguably, Croatia and Lithuania. As a general rule the former and present Catholic/Western Roman Empire nations are 'Western', but there is some overlap with the 'Eastern sphere.' The former Holy Roman Empire/Byzantium is closely related to the areas using the Cyrillic alphabet, who are also culturally/religiously more of the Greco-mindset than the Roman-mindset. While Romans borrowed heavily from Greek culture, the Hellenic world developed a distinctly different approach after the split after the collapse of Rome.
I think anywhere where Eastern Orthodox Christianity is the major religion - even in those areas where religion was almost wiped out due to Communism - is a separate subset of European culture.
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