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Old 01-30-2012, 10:57 AM
 
Location: kind of North of the middle of nowhere, FL
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Growing up in Texas, attending public schools, and college, taking history courses all along the way, I had to laugh when I heard a few years ago that the motivation for the Texas Revolution was the fact that Mexico under Santa Anna had outlawed slavery. While slavery in Mexico wast vastly different than in the American south, the timeline of 1820 to 1829 would lend some argument for this case.
However, knowing Santa Anna's concern for humanity (which was about nil) I doubt his conquest through Texas was aimed at freeing slaves.
I know of issues involving changes to homestaed laws, taxation without representation as well as a deep resentment many Texas settlers help towards Mexicans (especially those involved with warring raids) would have moved Texans towards independence.
I would propose as well that General Sam Houston was a long time friend and protege of Andrew Jackson, Andrew Jackson wanted Texas as a state. I cannot help but wonder how Jackson Inspired Houston to take a part in a revolution that would ultimately bring Texas into the Union. The Texas Revolution would untimately accomplish that.
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Old 01-30-2012, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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That slavery wasn't the only issue does not mean that it wasn't an issue...it was.

It was a subordinate problem, stemming from the major difficulty which was that by 1836, there were four Americans for every Mexican born resident in Texas. Though legally Mexican citizens, the Texians largely ignored the ramifications of that. They had all signed an agreement to convert to Catholicism, yet hardly anyone did, and for most of those who did, it was a sham, insincere ceremony which was instantly and permanently ignored thereafter. The Texians tended to cite the US Constitution as the basis for their civil rights even though they were speaking of rights not mentioned in the Mexican constitution of 1824.

The settlers did not come to Texas and morph into Mexican citizens as was planned by the Mexican government, they came and morphed Texas into an American style territory. And that, more than anything else, is why there was a revolution.
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Old 01-30-2012, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Texas
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The Texas Revolution was not inspired by slavery and it wasn't even an issue. The Mexican Gov't in the early 1830's had been busy handing out land grants to those that would settle Texas and farm and ranch the land. This free land attracted mostly those of German ancestry who came over with the clothes on their backs. They had no monies to spend on slaves. Soon the population of Mexican to "Texan" was the Texans out numbering the Mexicans 3 to 1. The Mexican Gov't wasn't real happy about the dilution of it's ethnic culture as the Texans were pressing their own form of culture. The Mexican Gov't saw the Texans as a threat but because it was having issues at home, it was not in a position to do anything about it. Later, the Mexican Gov't ruled that all Texans would surrender their firearms so as not to be a threat to Mexican sovereignty. It was too late as the Texans were now pushing for their own Government. That's when Santa Anna came to Texas to take the Texans firearms and bring Texas back into the Mexican Government and culture.
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Old 01-30-2012, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
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Don't forget Jim Bowie, who was the son in law of a Mexican Governor until his wife died. He was a rival of Huston and I'm sure Huston was not in that much of a hurry to relieve him at the Alamo.
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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Good grief, c'mon folks, don't just make up stuff if you haven't done your homework.
Trapper:
Quote:
The Texas Revolution was not inspired by slavery and it wasn't even an issue
Of course it was an issue. Slavery was banned by the 1824 Constitution and the Texians clandestinely, and openly, defied that law. Read your history, it is unavoidable.

Boompa:
Quote:
Don't forget Jim Bowie, who was the son in law of a Mexican Governor until his wife died. He was a rival of Huston and I'm sure Huston was not in that much of a hurry to relieve him at the Alamo.
Houston and Bowie were good friends...they were rivals for what? As for the relief of the Alamo, Houston's reasons for not going there had nothing to do with any rivalry with Bowie. Houston, during a brief time period when Houston was not in command of the Texian army, had "suggested" to Bowie that he go to San Antonio and supervise the evacuation and destruction of the Alamo, bringing the fort's artillery North to the main army which was being formed. Houston's idea was that Texas could best be defended by a retreating army which forced Santa Anna to spread his superior forces around where they could then be attacked piece by piece.

Bowie went to San Antonio with the intention of doing carrying out Houston's instructions, but changed his mind upon arrival and developed the idea that the Alamo was should be defended. Since Houston had not been in a position to make his suggestion an order at the time, Bowie felt free to follow his own ideas based on the situation in front of him as he evaluated it.

Houston did not want to waste any men in a useless attempt to break through the siege lines, simply to add to the total which would be killed when the Alamo fell. He was fond of Bowie personally and deeply regretted his death.
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Old 01-30-2012, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
13,111 posts, read 14,124,361 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
Don't forget Jim Bowie, who was the son in law of a Mexican Governor until his wife died. He was a rival of Huston and I'm sure Huston was not in that much of a hurry to relieve him at the Alamo.

Actually, it was oredered abandoned as undefendable. Those who stayed did so voluntarily. That Santa Anna who could have just ridden around it an caught an revolution in the process of being organized, rather than one that was in progress made a decisive difference in the outcome. The idea of their sacrifice is in it being chosen and that they did have a real and measurable effect in the end.

Ego played a big part in that part of history, especially that of Santa Anna.
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Old 01-30-2012, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
16,032 posts, read 18,256,591 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightbird47 View Post
Actually, it was oredered abandoned as undefendable. Those who stayed did so voluntarily. That Santa Anna who could have just ridden around it an caught an revolution in the process of being organized, rather than one that was in progress made a decisive difference in the outcome. The idea of their sacrifice is in it being chosen and that they did have a real and measurable effect in the end.

Ego played a big part in that part of history, especially that of Santa Anna.
Well thoose who ran away and were brought back to be executed there have certainly been diefied by "History".
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Old 01-31-2012, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Texas
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Grandstander, you obviously don't read well so I'll post this slow.

Quote:
This free land attracted mostly those of German ancestry who came over with the clothes on their backs. They had no monies to spend on slaves.
The German people as an ethnic group did not believe in slavery. Quite a number had already seen white slavery back home and were escaping it.

You pick the Mexican Constitution of 1824 for your reference when the Texans didn't recognize it. It called for the surrender of their firearms. We still had Indian issues in Texas and most still hunted for their food. The idea was to starve the Texans out to equalize the culture. That same document also controls the land and any waters, but you failed to mention that as well. You didn't mention that besides Mexico having internal issues at the time that Juan Alvarez was inciting Civil War in California, yet another problem for an already stretched Mexican Government. Slavery was the least of any issues in Texas as there were very few at the time. After Texas Independence, slavery was recognized in our Constitution but it was more political than anything. Are you aware that Texas applied for statehood to the Union before the civil War? We were turned down because of the slavery provision in the Texas Constitution.

My family came over on the ship Pleasant in 1824 and settled in what is now Bulverde Texas which is just north of present day San Antonio. I have LOTS of diaries and letters to document Texas history from those that actually lived it. I tend to believe those that actually lived history rather than some clown in an office in New York that "researched" the story.

The Alamo was not defendable as such against what the defenders knew was coming. Santa Anna before he left Mexico said it was going to a Deguello, which means slaughter or a scorched earth war. All ranches were destroyed along his path to the Alamo as well as the families beheaded or impaled by sword. Without a doubt Santa Anna was a major egotist. He brought along a band to play for those about to die and played the song Deguello. At the Alamo, it was played over and over all night for the defenders. When the music stopped, the battle was started. But the battle at the Alamo bought time for the Texans to regroup and get organized. One of the ancestors had a freight company and tells of running wagons up and down the coast picking up supplies and taking them to the now Houston area for the impending battle hauling freight, arms, and men. It was at San Jacinto were the Texans got their chance to defeat the Army of Mexico.

DEGUELLO - YouTube
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Old 01-31-2012, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Texas
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"No Quarter" was the logical outcome of Santa Ana's considering the rebellious Texian's as "pirates." Under Mexican law, pirates were summarily executed. And, he warned the Texian's before he came that they'd be considered as such, as well as sending a letter to our President containing the same threat in regards to any American's caught inside Mexican territory in armed revolt.

The point is, that though it seems un-necessarily brutal from this distance, it was not, or should not have been, a surprise to anyone. Under Mexican law, it was a legal justification for the ranch burnings, the slaughter of the Alamo's defenders to the last man and the Fannin massacre.

The Alamo: I can't say for sure, but it seems to me I read somewhere that Houston told Travis specifically NOT to barricade himself inside the Alamo. It was indefensible and even Bowie should have known that as he was involved in the siege of San Antonio earlier, when Gen. Cos was trapped in the Alamo by the Texian's and was forced to surrender.
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Old 01-31-2012, 10:53 AM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
24,613 posts, read 14,307,605 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
Grandstander, you obviously don't read well so I'll post this slow.

You are confused. This is not a problem of comprehension, it is a problem of your making an incorrect statement. You claimed that slavery was not an issue....and it certainly was. It was not ther only issue, it was not the most important issue, but indeed it was an issue.

Unconfuse yourself by doing some reading on the matter. It will be more gratifying than your making a series of posts designed to try and rehabilitate your error or insult me.
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