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The Civil War never should have been fought. That's the truth of the matter. 700000 DIED...and for what? So a person like you can flippantly say "to *$&% with them"? 700K back at that time was what...6 million men today?
No one in their right mind would argue slavery or Jim Crow laws or other atrocities were ever justified or right or good or any of that, and you know what? Slavery was going to end, one way or the other.
In the same way, civil rights were coming in due time. MLK was just a man that was taken by a segment of this country - propped up as he were - as some sort of spokesperson for the movement.
If MLK didn't show up on the scene, it wouldn't have made a difference (in civil rights movement).
See what I did there? Exactly what you did.
If you don't mourn the hundreds of thousands that died to free your ancestors, why should I mourn the death of MLK?
Lol that's the dumbest thing Ive heard in a long time. A lot of crap "shouldn't " have happened. The Holocaust "shouldn't " have happened, 9/11 shouldn't have happened. THAT'S exactly why you have people like MLK who step forward and force change.
Now as a Black women "in due time" is code for "When its no longer convenient for those who benefit " As a slave waiting for your "master" to free you?? Don't insult me.
and lastly it is quite obvious you know nothing about the MLK's history or the history of the civil rights movement.
NO ONE propped MLK up. the FBI and the government did their best to discredit him, his house was bomb quite a number of times and he himself felt that he was not the best choice to lead, what at that time was a very unorganized small affair.
So exactly who was "propping" him up. It took quite a number of years before the media actually took any notice and the news in the south definitely painted African americans as the villains trying to destroy Americas way of life.
The problem with MLK was that he was supposed to be a reverend, supposed to be a doctor, but all of that was a total fraud, this behavior would get most anyone else knocked out of the game, especially back in the 50's and 60's when standards were much higher. Our standards are much lower today, especially in the black community, because of people like MLK. What kind of example did he set for the black clergy? Being a reverend means you are supposed to set a good example for your congregation. He cheated on his thesis in college and did not write his "I have a dream speech", he had sex orgies and beat women in his hotel room, he was a morally bankrupt character who got his name and portrait plastered everywhere, along with a national holiday in his name.
I think MLK knocked black morality into the gutter, and changed the black clergy forever by sending the message to them, that these character flaws concerning morality do not really matter, and this was the point where blacks who were trying to teach their kids right from wrong, were laughed out of the room and replaced with an evil and immoral gangster culture of drugs and deprivation. Just in my little corner of the world, I have seen many of the black clergy, black counselors, people who should be setting good examples, getting plastered on the TV news for sexual abuse or running some scam or con game on people, or generally just preaching hate and racism, always playing the victim card. Even from my own personal experience, when I delivered pizza for example, to the black minister with a nice house, 3 kids and 2 nice cars, who would order 30 bucks worth of pizza 3 times a week and never tip me, or any other driver. Or my other friend who worked at a copy store, and had black minister try and steal material from the store, which she did not prosecute him, but could have. I'm sure he had a picture of MLK hanging up on the wall tho. Yes, white preachers have done bad things too, but when they get caught, they get outted and shamed, and generally lose their influence, such as what happened with many of them in the 80's.
I don't think there should be a MLK day, it would have been better if they had called it "Civil Rights Day" and left his name off it. Puffing up MLK is not doing anyone any good, it provides an excuse to sin, an excuse to disrespect or ignore the real teachings of the church, if you gain equality but lose morality, you still lose the game, look in the ghetto for the proof.
Sexual orgies? Oh yeah, that was toooooooootally normal. Am I the only one who has revulsion and disgust to find this out about this man who now has a massive statue in D.C. now?
So, planning on taking down any Kennedy statues, soon?
...I think MLK knocked black morality into the gutter, and changed the black clergy forever by sending the message to them, that these character flaws concerning morality do not really matter...
...Puffing up MLK is not doing anyone any good, it provides an excuse to sin, an excuse to disrespect or ignore the real teachings of the church, if you gain equality but lose morality, you still lose the game, look in the ghetto for the proof.
I trust you feel the same way about President Washington and the current stain in our WH?
I think Trump knocked white morality into the gutter, and changed the white clergy forever by sending the message to them, that these character flaws concerning morality do not really matter...
...Puffing up Trump is not doing anyone any good, it provides an excuse to sin, an excuse to disrespect or ignore the real teachings of the church, if you gain equality but lose morality, you still lose the game, look in the White House for the proof...
See how that works?
Personally, I have no problem with our greatest leader's extramarital affairs, but if you do, your outrage should apply to both back and white leaders...
Anyway, go on with your rambling. The only message I'm getting out of it is that for reasons you don't express very well that you just don't like MLK.
I already said why he is dishonorable. For example:
Quote:
Originally Posted by mofford
The problem with MLK was that he was supposed to be a reverend, supposed to be a doctor, but all of that was a total fraud, this behavior would get most anyone else knocked out of the game, especially back in the 50's and 60's when standards were much higher. Our standards are much lower today, especially in the black community, because of people like MLK. What kind of example did he set for the black clergy? Being a reverend means you are supposed to set a good example for your congregation. He cheated on his thesis in college and did not write his "I have a dream speech", he had sex orgies and beat women in his hotel room, he was a morally bankrupt character who got his name and portrait plastered everywhere, along with a national holiday in his name.
I think MLK knocked black morality into the gutter, and changed the black clergy forever by sending the message to them, that these character flaws concerning morality do not really matter, and this was the point where blacks who were trying to teach their kids right from wrong, were laughed out of the room and replaced with an evil and immoral gangster culture of drugs and deprivation. Just in my little corner of the world, I have seen many of the black clergy, black counselors, people who should be setting good examples, getting plastered on the TV news for sexual abuse or running some scam or con game on people, or generally just preaching hate and racism, always playing the victim card. Even from my own personal experience, when I delivered pizza for example, to the black minister with a nice house, 3 kids and 2 nice cars, who would order 30 bucks worth of pizza 3 times a week and never tip me, or any other driver. Or my other friend who worked at a copy store, and had black minister try and steal material from the store, which she did not prosecute him, but could have. I'm sure he had a picture of MLK hanging up on the wall tho. Yes, white preachers have done bad things too, but when they get caught, they get outted and shamed, and generally lose their influence, such as what happened with many of them in the 80's.
I don't think there should be a MLK day, it would have been better if they had called it "Civil Rights Day" and left his name off it. Puffing up MLK is not doing anyone any good, it provides an excuse to sin, an excuse to disrespect or ignore the real teachings of the church, if you gain equality but lose morality, you still lose the game, look in the ghetto for the proof.
THANK YOU. I think there is a lot of TRUTH and correlation within what you say. I have plenty of anecdotes myself from spending my entire life in the inner city, most of which a lot of the apologists (who accuse me of being a "BIGOT!!!!") here would not find very savory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
So, planning on taking down any Kennedy statues, soon?
As I said, was he a "minister" and a man who pranced around acting as a "man of God"? No. But MLK was.
Moreover, the Kennedy's were the worst thing to ever happen to this country. Their efforts/lies to the American public about the 1965 Immigration Act were the most treasonous act ever committed agains the American people!
Take all their shrines or memorials down, and I would be all for it. You do not know me very well if you think there are many politicians I find honorable.
Well luckily the rest of the world recognizes that minister, Rabbi's, preachers, priest, Iman's and every thing in between are all just like the rest of us....Human....
the memorials are in honor of their contributions to this country and to the world and since you have not been able to provide one shred of credible reason why those don't matter, I happy to say I'm pretty sure all the memorials will stay.
I already said why he is dishonorable. For example:
THANK YOU. I think there is a lot of TRUTH and correlation within what you say. I have plenty of anecdotes myself from spending my entire life in the inner city, most of which a lot of the apologists (who accuse me of being a "BIGOT!!!!") here would not find very savory.
As I said, was he a "minister" and a man who pranced around acting as a "man of God"? No. But MLK was.
Moreover, the Kennedy's were the worst thing to ever happen to this country. Their efforts/lies to the American public about the 1965 Immigration Act were the most treasonous act ever committed agains the American people!
Take all their shrines or memorials down, and I would be all for it. You do not know me very well if you think there are many politicians I find honorable.
You are quoting Mofford who I have argued with many times on this forum.
Want to know what else he believes? He believes Richard Nixon was one of the greatest presidents this country ever has had. He has sung the praises of Spanish dictator Francisco Franco. He admits that he admires totalitarian leaders. Opinions like that don't count for much around here.
I really don't get this fixation on the fact that King was a minister. I guess I'm supposed to feign surprise at the notion that a minister could commit adultery? How about responding to my allegation that King's principal accuser, J. Edgar Hoover, was a closet gay man involved in a decades long relationship with Clyde Tolson, the number 2 man at the FBI? Do you see any hypocrisy there in what Hoover did to King? Do you see anything wrong with the man who was probably most responsible for upholding the laws in the USA behaving as he did while wiretapping King to prove he was committing adultery?
The saddest thing of all is that both you and Mofford miss the essential truth about MLK. Perhaps, his greatest achievement was the very limited amount of violence that took place achieving civil rights for black people. This was largely because King and most of the people around him were determined to work for civil rights in a non-violent manner. King was repeatedly subjected to violence during his years with the SCLC. One time he was hit with a brick and he just kept marching. He preached to his followers that if he were ever killed that he did not want them to react with violence. If it were not for MLK, I predict that a whole heck of lot more black and white people would have met their deaths marching for civil rights.
When I remember MLK, probably the first thing I remember is his determination to achieve his aims without violence. That should make him a hero to people of all races and all colors.
You are quoting Mofford who I have argued with many times on this forum.
Want to know what else he believes? He believes Richard Nixon was one of the greatest presidents this country ever has had. He has sung the praises of Spanish dictator Francisco Franco. He admits that he admires totalitarian leaders. Opinions like that don't count for much around here.
I really don't get this fixation on the fact that King was a minister. I guess I'm supposed to feign surprise at the notion that a minister could commit adultery? How about responding to my allegation that King's principal accuser, J. Edgar Hoover, was a closet gay man involved in a decades long relationship with Clyde Tolson, the number 2 man at the FBI? Do you see any hypocrisy there in what Hoover did to King? Do you see anything wrong with the man who was probably most responsible for upholding the laws in the USA behaving as he did while wiretapping King to prove he was committing adultery?
The saddest thing of all is that both you and Mofford miss the essential truth about MLK. Perhaps, his greatest achievement was the very limited amount of violence that took place achieving civil rights for black people. This was largely because King and most of the people around him were determined to work for civil rights in a non-violent manner. King was repeatedly subjected to violence during his years with the SCLC. One time he was hit with a brick and he just kept marching. He preached to his followers that if he were ever killed that he did not want them to react with violence. If it were not for MLK, I predict that a whole heck of lot more black and white people would have met their deaths marching for civil rights.
When I remember MLK, probably the first thing I remember is his determination to achieve his aims without violence. That should make him a hero to people of all races and all colors.
This is the sad fact. Some people don't like his accomplishments. This is why some people bring up his personal life. His personal life is used as a way to deflect from their own prejudice. Some people want the days of segregation back. I do not want those days back. I'm as pro-integration as you can get.
I am going to keep celebrating Dr. King. Anyone who has a problem with that can kick rocks.
Anyone who has a strong admiration for Francisco Franco, I have no respect for that person. I like having democracy. I like being in a free nation. Dr. King was all about making this nation would truly be a free nation for EVERYONE.
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