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Here's a fact that you won't hear often or read in just about all history books:
The much talked about european Renaissance was sparked by the FIRST fall of Constantinople that was caused by the sacking of that city by the so called "friendly and brotherly" western 4th Crusade on their way to the Holy Lands. From that point the culture, knowledge, arts and wealth of the Byzantine and old Greece was "transferred (taken)" to Venice and beyond. The city was weakened and was never the same and later fell to the Turks. The dark ages for Greece itself then followed.
"The Latin soldiery subjected the greatest city in Europe to an indescribable sack. For three days they murdered, raped, looted and destroyed on a scale which even the ancient Vandals and Goths would have found unbelievable. Constantinople had become a veritable museum of ancient and Byzantine art, an emporium of such incredible wealth that the Latins were astounded at the riches they found. Though the Venetians had an appreciation for the art which they discovered (they were themselves semi-Byzantines) and saved much of it, the French and others destroyed indiscriminately, halting to refresh themselves with wine, violation of nuns, and murder of Orthodox clerics. The Crusaders vented their hatred for the Greeks most spectacularly in the desecration of the greatest Church in Christendom. They smashed the silver iconostasis, the icons and the holy books of Hagia Sophia, and seated upon the patriarchal throne a ***** who sang coarse songs as they drank wine from the Church's holy vessels. The estrangement of East and West, which had proceeded over the centuries, culminated in the horrible massacre that accompanied the conquest of Constantinople. The Greeks were convinced that even the Turks, had they taken the city, would not have been as cruel as the Latin Christians. The defeat of Byzantium, already in a state of decline, accelerated political degeneration so that the Byzantines eventually became an easy prey to the Turks. The Fourth Crusade and the crusading movement generally thus resulted, ultimately, in the victory of Islam, a result which was of course the exact opposite of its original intention."
The 4th is my favorite crusade, the Venician Doge Enrico Dandolo must have been a fascinating character..old, blind, and still managed to swindle and highjack the entire Crusade.
They gathered and marched off to free Jerusalem and instead somehow or other wound up sacking the center of Christianity in the East....ooops.
... it was done so by their fellow 'Christian" brothers!
Oh brother, here we go again. More "Christians are evil because of the Crusades" propaganda.
The crusaders were invited to attack Constantinople by the son of the deposed emperor (who was deposed by his brother). The soldiers in the crusade did what soldiers were expected to do. All of Europe was Christian so any war undertaken among themselves could be described as Christians attacking their fellow brothers. It should also be pointed out that Muslims kill Muslims, Jews kill Jews, atheists kill atheist, etc. and Muslims kill Christians (the reason for the crusades), Christians kill Muslims, Jews kill Muslims, Muslims kill Jews, atheists kill Jews, etc. Should also be pointed out that the Pope forbid the crusaders from attacking Christians.
This is no earth-shattering news to people who know some history. It only seems to shock the people who have an anti-Christian agenda.
Oh brother, here we go again. More "Christians are evil because of the Crusades" propaganda.
The crusaders were invited to attack Constantinople by the son of the deposed emperor (who was deposed by his brother). The soldiers in the crusade did what soldiers were expected to do. All of Europe was Christian so any war undertaken among themselves could be described as Christians attacking their fellow brothers. It should also be pointed out that Muslims kill Muslims, Jews kill Jews, atheists kill atheist, etc. and Muslims kill Christians (the reason for the crusades), Christians kill Muslims, Jews kill Muslims, Muslims kill Jews, atheists kill Jews, etc. Should also be pointed out that the Pope forbid the crusaders from attacking Christians.
This is no earth-shattering news to people who know some history. It only seems to shock the people who have an anti-Christian agenda.
I will disagree with your points. Anti-Christian agenda? Really?
There was no invitation and even if there was there's no excuse to sack such a city in such a horrific way that the wouldn't even do to their worst enemy. It's only its wealth and culture that those savages wanted, get real. The west collapsed from within from that turning point in history IMO and continues to do so.
That's a long time for civilization to decline without reaching rock-bottom.
Are you Eastern Orthodox?
Or we re in the abyss and just can't see it.
My religion is not relevant to this but yes I am Christian. Facts speak for themselves of which they are not widely spoken or known by many.
Those Crusaders were thugs, thieves, murderers and scum that vandalized the greatest city of the west at that time in the name of religion. Things people will do in the name of religion!
How can this not be a much talked about subject in school books and not considered a turning point?
"Constantinople was considered as a bastion of Christianity that defended Europe from the advancing forces of Islam, and the Fourth Crusade's sack of the city dealt an irreparable blow to this eastern bulwark. Although the Greeks retook Constantinople after 57 years of Latin rule, the Byzantine Empire had been crippled by the Fourth Crusade. Reduced to Constantinople, north-western Anatolia and a portion of the southern Balkans, the empire fell to the Ottoman Turks who captured the city in 1453."
It took eight centuries to apologize!:
"Eight hundred years after the Fourth Crusade, Pope John Paul II twice expressed sorrow for the events of the Fourth Crusade. In 2001, he wrote to Christodoulos, Archbishop of Athens, saying, "It is tragic that the assailants, who set out to secure free access for Christians to the Holy Land, turned against their brothers in the faith. The fact that they were Latin Christians fills Catholics with deep regret."[54] In 2004, while Bartholomew I, Patriarch of Constantinople, was visiting the Vatican, John Paul II asked, "How can we not share, at a distance of eight centuries, the pain and disgust."[55] This has been regarded as an apology to the Greek Orthodox Church for the terrible slaughter perpetrated by the warriors of the Fourth Crusade".
First, they were not fellow Christian "brothers"; there has been and still is great antagonism towards the Eastern Church from the Western Church; some even theorize today's issues in the MENA area is still influenced by this given the atrocities and treatment of Christians (most who are affiliated with the Eastern Church) are met by all but silence from the West; yet everyone and their brother will go nuts if Russia passes some anti-gay law.
The 4th Crusade marked the severe decline of the Byzantine Empire (well the fall by some standards, as after it returned, the Byzantine Empire was basically in name only), this opened the door for the advancement of Islam onto Europe's eastern border.
But despite it being a historical event, it was nothing unusual; sacking of cities is a common event, and the cooperation between the West and East Church was more based on the common threat of Islam, and the thought the two churches would merge together again.
If you look at the events following, with Moscow being the "third Rome"; Imperial Russia fell to the same antagonism from the West as Byzantine did before.
But despite it being a historical event, it was nothing unusual; sacking of cities is a common event, and the cooperation between the West and East Church was more based on the common threat of Islam, and the thought the two churches would merge together again.
.
What? Really? The sacking of the strongest most important city at that time in Europe ( the rest of Europe being in the DARK AGES after the fall of the western Roman Empire) with all the history, civilization, libraries, culture, etc, left from the Roman and Greek eras was nothing unusual? The betrayal of western values and ways? The fort to the east weakened for good? You got it wrong man!
Last edited by WildWestDude; 09-14-2013 at 02:57 PM..
Oh brother, here we go again. More "Christians are evil because of the Crusades" propaganda.
The crusaders were invited to attack Constantinople by the son of the deposed emperor (who was deposed by his brother). The soldiers in the crusade did what soldiers were expected to do. All of Europe was Christian so any war undertaken among themselves could be described as Christians attacking their fellow brothers. It should also be pointed out that Muslims kill Muslims, Jews kill Jews, atheists kill atheist, etc. and Muslims kill Christians (the reason for the crusades), Christians kill Muslims, Jews kill Muslims, Muslims kill Jews, atheists kill Jews, etc. Should also be pointed out that the Pope forbid the crusaders from attacking Christians.
This is no earth-shattering news to people who know some history. It only seems to shock the people who have an anti-Christian agenda.
And one of the general reasons for the Crusades was to give the growing number of armies something else to do than fighting each other. Nobody was expecting them to act any differently so long as they gave the home ground a little rest. This was during a period when authority by kings was starting to matter, but was not secured, so if you could point the other Knighly households at someone else and clean up why they were gone, so the better.
The saddest crusades to me were the Children's crusade, where children were encouraged to follow, thus draining off some of the burgeoning population. Most died if they were not captured by slavers. In fact the crusades generally fed the arab slave markets quite well. The other notable one is the one aimed at southern France, which had become resistant to the power or Rome and declared their own pope. The hordes were sent to remove them which they did quite brutally. Culturally southern France lagged for centuries they were so successful.
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