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Old 10-15-2013, 10:35 PM
 
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The Roman Republic was founded in 509BC. The Western Empire lasted until 476AD. However the Eastern Empire lasted until 1453. Why do historians give credit for Rome lasting only 1000 years and not 2100 years?

Last edited by jobseeker2013; 10-15-2013 at 10:43 PM..
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Old 10-16-2013, 03:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jobseeker2013 View Post
The Roman Republic was founded in 509BC. The Western Empire lasted until 476AD. However the Eastern Empire lasted until 1453. Why do historians give credit for Rome lasting only 1000 years and not 2100 years?
It all depends on which historians and how those particular ones want to measure. There are several important points to measure and which ones you pick impact the length of time...

1. 509 BC - Founding of Roman Republic
2. 44 BC - Crowning of Julius Caesar, Start of Roman Empire (others would say 27 BC with Octavian)
3. 476 AD - Last Western Roman Emperor, Romulus Augustus, is deposed by Odoacer.
4. 1453 AD - Fall of Constantinople to the Ottoman Turks.

Ostensibly "The Roman Empire" lasted from 44 BC to 1453 AD, or approximately 1,500 years. If we want to talk about "unbroken chain" then it lasted from 509 BC to 1453 AD, or approximately 1,960 years. If they only want to focus on "Rome" the city as the cultural and political power it was, then it lasted from 509 BC to 476 AD or 985 years.

In most cases, the Eastern Roman Empire is seen to have become the "Byzantine Empire" in 330 AD when Constantine moved the capital to Constantinople (330 AD is widely used as the data of the founding of the Byzantine Empire). However, one could make the argument that "Rome" lasted until 620 AD after which the Eastern Empire firmly became Byzantium. In 620 AD, the Byzantines switched the court language from Latin to Greek and reformed the military and administrative divisions from obviously Roman to what are now seen as Byzantine.

So, there is a distinct argument for saying that Rome ceased to exist in 620 AD in any recognizable form. That means that from Republic through the end of the Roman Empire, it lasted 1,129 years. From the crowning of Caesar to the end of the Roman Empire, it lasted 664 years. What existed after 620 AD was Byzantium.
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Old 10-17-2013, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Here.
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If you are going to count the Byzantine Empire as "Roman" (as it was referred to at the time), might as well include the Holy Roman Empire which ended in 1806.
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Old 10-17-2013, 10:17 AM
 
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And to just get a little bit broader...really the 'Empire' kind of died and went to heaven......Rome, Italy, the Vatican,the Catholic Church...2013 A.D. In history, things don't die..they usually 'morph' into something else...;-)....
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Old 10-17-2013, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
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Originally Posted by travric View Post
And to just get a little bit broader...really the 'Empire' kind of died and went to heaven......Rome, Italy, the Vatican,the Catholic Church...2013 A.D. In history, things don't die..they usually 'morph' into something else...;-)....

Some consider that there are 3 Romes! The original Rome, the second Rome "Constantinople" where the the Eastern Rite of Christianity was based until 1453 and the third Rome where the Eastern Patriarchy is still based today it also became the seat of a vast Empire (The 2nd Largest ever created and is largely intact to the present day). The Third Rome is of course Muscovy and the Land of All the Russias and was proclaimed by the First Czar named Ivan IV better known as Ivan the Terrible.
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Old 10-17-2013, 12:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
If you are going to count the Byzantine Empire as "Roman" (as it was referred to at the time), might as well include the Holy Roman Empire which ended in 1806.
How so? They are not at all related?
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Old 10-17-2013, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
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Had the Byzantines successfully reunited east with west following the WRE's collapse, I believe historians would continue to call this domain the Byzantine empire. Conventionally speaking, I consider the two very separate, but do acknowledge the reason why you could see things different. For all intents and purposes though, the head of the true Roman empire was seated in the west, and this only changed towards the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
If you are going to count the Byzantine Empire as "Roman" (as it was referred to at the time), might as well include the Holy Roman Empire which ended in 1806.
The HRE was born about 4 centuries after the collapse of the western portion of the Roman empire. They were a kingdom, and really shared no commonality with the former empire other than territory that fell under their rein.
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Old 10-18-2013, 10:28 AM
 
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T
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he HRE was born about 4 centuries after the collapse of the western portion of the Roman empire. They were a kingdom, and really shared no commonality with the former empire other than territory that fell under their rein.
Interesting. You know I'm not even sure they could 'understand' each other in more ways than one, linguistically, culturally, etc etc. Surely two different 'animals'.
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Old 10-22-2013, 04:33 PM
 
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Rome has no equal in all human events. No equal.
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Old 10-22-2013, 06:09 PM
 
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Default In case it's unclear, I do revere Rome!

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Originally Posted by Snowball7 View Post
Rome has no equal in all human events. No equal.
Exactly. We can argue about what constituted the Roman Empire etc etc but how many lasted half as long? Aside from Egypt I mean. And China. Oh nvm
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