Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 03-15-2014, 02:58 PM
 
2,823 posts, read 4,455,842 times
Reputation: 1799

Advertisements

I keep hearing TN was the last state to secede from the Union and join the Confederacy, but then I also hear some say NC. Which one was it? Also, a second point I'm a little curious about, what prompted VA to secede? When you look at a map, VA was the most northern geographically Confederate state. I know geography doesn't necessarily matter, but should I be surprised that VA seceded before North Carolina, Tennessee, and Arkansas? Or, seceded from the union at all?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-15-2014, 08:28 PM
 
2,687 posts, read 2,174,697 times
Reputation: 1478
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayJayCB View Post
I keep hearing TN was the last state to secede from the Union and join the Confederacy, but then I also hear some say NC. Which one was it? Also, a second point I'm a little curious about, what prompted VA to secede? When you look at a map, VA was the most northern geographically Confederate state. I know geography doesn't necessarily matter, but should I be surprised that VA seceded before North Carolina, Tennessee, and Arkansas? Or, seceded from the union at all?
Both Virginia (May 23rd) and Tennessee (June 8th) had their secession confirmed by referendum after North Carolina (May 20th), but NC was the last state legislature to secede from the Union. I think in the case of Virginia and Tennessee, the outcome of the referendums was a foregone conclusion after their legislatures passed the secession bills (April 17th for Virginia; May 7th for Tennessee).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-15-2014, 08:47 PM
 
5,544 posts, read 8,269,128 times
Reputation: 11141
and I believe there was an agreement between NC and TN that when one went the other would take steps to secede, but don't remember where I read that
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-15-2014, 09:50 PM
Zot
 
Location: 3rd rock from a nearby star
468 posts, read 678,740 times
Reputation: 747
It depends on how you count. Maryland wanted to secede, but Lincoln sent troops up to prevent the legislature from voting as D.C. would have been in the Confederacy. Thus the argument is more which was the last state allowed to secede.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2014, 03:21 AM
 
Location: Peterborough, England
472 posts, read 922,043 times
Reputation: 416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zot View Post
It depends on how you count. Maryland wanted to secede, but Lincoln sent troops up to prevent the legislature from voting as D.C. would have been in the Confederacy. Thus the argument is more which was the last state allowed to secede.

The Maryland Legislature was meeting in Frederick. There were at that time no Union troops in Frederick or anywhere near it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2014, 10:34 AM
 
Location: Colorado
1,524 posts, read 2,848,408 times
Reputation: 2220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zot View Post
It depends on how you count. Maryland wanted to secede, but Lincoln sent troops up to prevent the legislature from voting as D.C. would have been in the Confederacy. Thus the argument is more which was the last state allowed to secede.
This is a thoroughly exaggerated myth. The legislature voted in Frederick 53-13 to stay part of the United States before the federal government intervened. I wouldn't call 53-13 a close vote, would you?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2014, 11:37 AM
Zot
 
Location: 3rd rock from a nearby star
468 posts, read 678,740 times
Reputation: 747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikestone8 View Post
The Maryland Legislature was meeting in Frederick. There were at that time no Union troops in Frederick or anywhere near it.
Really? - Why did Maryland not secede from the Union and why was it important that it did not secede

Quote:
Maryland did not secede because the Federal government arrested and imprisoned the governor and the state legislators, who were for secession. If they had been left at large they surely would have convened the legislature and passed an ordinance of secession, taking Maryland out of the Union. Lincoln also suspended the Constitutionally guaranteed right of Habeus Corpus, so these imprisoned state officials could not petition a Federal Court for their release. These men were not charged with any crime, nor were they ever tried in court for anything; they were just kept in prison, not charged and not convicted.

It was crucial for the Federal government (the north) to keep Maryland in the Union because of the location of Washington DC, between Maryland and Virginia. The city of Washington is actually entirely located on land that was part of Maryland, before being ceded to the Federal government to be the District of Columbia, the home of the national government. If Maryland went out of the Union the nation's capital would be cut off, surrounded by "foreign" territory, isolated amidst a hostile population.
See also - Abraham Lincoln and the Border States

Quote:
Lincoln's border state policy blended several objectives. The first was to preserve or establish loyal governments in each of these states. In summarizing the administration's policy in Maryland in the early weeks of the war, General Nathaniel P. Banks, who was stationed in Annapolis in 1861, declared, "The secession leaders—the enemies of the people—were replaced and loyal men assigned to ... their duties. This made Maryland a loyal State." [9] In devising his border state policy, as would be true later with his Reconstruction program, Lincoln always gave first priority to placing loyal men in control of the state government.

Lincoln's second objective was that each of these Union state governments take the lead in fostering loyalty among its citizens, control the civilian population, and marshal the resources of the state behind the war effort. Lincoln did not shirk from his responsibility—as he saw it—to suppress disloyal activities among the civilian population, but he preferred to avoid such acts because they were controversial and politically embarrassing.[10]
The Lincoln border state policy is not well remembered or taught to most children, Maryland was a slave state. There are numerous clean ups of history and the civil war. Often California is credited with joining the union as a free state, which it did. However, California made a promise to send one pro slave and one anti slave Senator to the Senate. This to keep representation equal in the senate.

It always amazing to me how history is rewritten long after events are complete in a way which satisfies the victors.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2014, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Peterborough, England
472 posts, read 922,043 times
Reputation: 416
What relevance has this link to my statement that the Legislature met in Frederick, or that there were no Union troops in or near Frederick? Both statements are correct.

It's also talking nonsense in stating that the Governor was arrested. Not only was Thomas Hicks never arrested but he strongly supported the arrest of subversive elements.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top