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Old 08-26-2014, 12:51 AM
 
Location: SoCal
5,899 posts, read 5,791,449 times
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I don't think that this topic has previously been discussed here. If I am wrong on this, then please let me know.

Anyway, I know that some areas held plebiscites after World War I, but what if more areas held plebiscites during this time? What exactly would have been the results of these plebiscites?

As for my views on this, here you go:

*Alsace-Lorraine: France wins by a double-digit margin; as far as I know, in 1919, most people in Alsace-Lorraine still descended from the pre-1871 residents of Alsace-Lorraine (who were overwhelmingly pro-French, as evidenced by the Reichstag election results there between 1874 and 1887).
*Posen: Poland wins by a double-digit margin; the Reichstag elections in Posen between 1871 and 1912 always or almost always resulted in a victory for the pro-Polish parties.
*Danzig: Lopsided German victory, considering that this area was overwhelmingly ethnically German.
*Sudetenland: The cumulative vote for Germany and Austria would probably be extremely high, possibly 90%+. I don't know whether or not Germany or Austria would win a plebiscite here (or whether the Sudetenland would have been split between Germany and Austria based on the plebiscite results), though Czechoslovakia certainly wouldn't be winning it. Of course, whether or not the Sudetenland ends up in Germany or Austria wouldn't really matter if Germany and Austria are allowed to unify in 1919/1920 after a plebiscite on this is held there.
*Memel: Toss-up; it appears that this area was about half ethnically German and half ethnically Lithuanian; thus, either Germany or Lithuania could have won a plebiscite here, or a plebiscite here could have resulted in a partition of this territory.
*Eupen and Malmedy: If this plebiscite is "winner-take-all", then Germany wins by double-digits since this area had a large ethnic German majority; otherwise, Belgium might win in Malmedy (since the majority of the population there might have spoken French even back then) and thus acquire it while Germany keeps the rest of this territory (in other words, there would have been a partition of this territory).
*Northern Transylvania: Romania wins, possibly by a narrow (single-digit) margin; as far as I know, there were more ethnic Romanians than ethnic Hungarians in Northern Transylvania even back then. Also, as far as I know, Hungary hasn't exactly been friendly to ethnic Romanians within its territory in the decades leading up to World War I.
*Trentino and South Tyrol: If it is "winner-take-all", then Italy wins, possibly by a narrow (single-digit) margin due to the fact that there were cumulatively somewhat more ethnic Italians than ethnic Germans throughout this entire territory even back then; else, this territory would get partitioned, with Italy winning lopsidedly in the Trentino while Austria wins lopsidedly in South Tyrol (Trentino was overwhelmingly ethnically Italian, while South Tyrol was overwhelmingly ethnically German, though it is worth noting that Trentino had a greater population than South Tyrol did).
*South Schlewsig: Lopsided victory for Germany; this area was even more ethnically German than Central Schleswig (which overwhelmingly voted in favor of Germany) was.
*Anschluss plebiscite in 1919/1920: Lopsided vote in favor of an Anschluss between Austria and Germany.

And as a bonus:
*The Saar (with a plebiscite in 1919/1920 rather than in 1935): Still a lopsided victory for Germany, since the population there was overwhelmingly ethnically German, and unlike in Alsace-Lorraine, the people in the Saar did not have strong ties with France back then.

Did I miss any areas/territories here?
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Central Nebraska
553 posts, read 595,464 times
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Although the Tyrol is ethnically Italian, the people there liked being part of Austria better and wish to be returned. I have heard this from people who have been there and have read it in various articles and news reports.

People do not necesarily want to be in the same country as others of their nationality. Switzerland is made up of Germans, French, and Italians who would rather be together than be divided up to Germany, France, and Italy. Many of the people of northern Maine are French Canadians but are perfectly happy as Americans. Despite what is said about the loyalties of Hispanics the simple tyruth is they deliberately left Latin America to live in the United States. Despite expressions of dissatisfaction, Blacks prefer to live in White-dominated America rather than create a Black America or return to Africa. There are Palistianian Arabs who have become citizens of stable and democratic Israel rather than live with the uncertainties of an Arab country. Numerous other examples could be cited.
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Old 08-26-2014, 09:59 PM
 
4,361 posts, read 7,069,986 times
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The Ruthenia region was made into the eastern end of the new nation of Czechoslovakia following W.W.1, but then was detached and transferred over to Ukraine (USSR) after W.W. 2.
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Old 08-30-2014, 05:43 AM
 
Location: Hong Kong / Vienna
4,491 posts, read 6,341,443 times
Reputation: 3986
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAllenDoudna View Post
Although the Tyrol is ethnically Italian, the people there liked being part of Austria better and wish to be returned.
The majority of Tyroleans are certainly not ethnically Italian. Also, most of the people living in South Tyrol don't wish to be returned to Austria simply because they get a lot of benefits from the Italian state (taxes, ...) they wouldn't get from Austria.

Given that we now we have freedom of travel in Europe and that South Tyroleans are considered Austrian by the government in many aspects in life (entrance to university, ...), I guess both Austrians and South Tyroleans are pretty comfortable with the status quo.
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Old 09-05-2014, 05:19 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 37,032,019 times
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A rather Euro-centric postulation. Perhaps more importantly, what would have the middle east have looked like if France and Great Britain had allowed Arab independence along natural ethnic, tribal and religious boundaries instead of the arbitrary carving up of middle east to suit European interests?
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