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Sure. Same as it existed BEFORE Balfour when it was still called Zionist-Arab conflict...
when western looking authority over these civil matters were the Ottomans
who had welcomed the Zionists to settle there just as enthusiastically.
(It wouldn't be called a Israeli-Palestinian conflict for another 25-40 years)
The specifics and dynamics have changed a lot over the last 100 years...
but the fundamentals haven't changed much at all.
Agreed! However, the Balfour Declaration, the UN giving the Palestine mandate to the British and the resulting British effort to establish a land for the Jewish people, all sparked the massive influx of Jewish settlement that significantly added to the tension.
Agreed! However, the Balfour Declaration, the UN giving the Palestine mandate to the British
pardon? The UN didn't exist then.
The British TOOK that mandate authority as a spoil of war (WW1).
Their trade empire still needed an eastern Med presence close to the Suez.
The Zionists (and Arabs ftm) were a side issue.
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and the resulting British effort to establish a land for the Jewish people
pardon? The Brits may have been willing to help here and there but
I would hardly call their contribution as "an effort to establish" anything.
Especially in light of the OTHER things they did against the effort.
Quote:
all sparked the massive influx of Jewish settlement that significantly added to the tension.
pardon? The Jews were coming in ever larger numbers every year since Herzl.
They would and did continue to come regardless of the Brits, WW1, the Arabs, Oil,
the Ottomans or anything else. These other entities were all nothing but background noise.
The British TOOK that mandate authority as a spoil of war (WW1).
Their trade empire still needed an eastern Med presence close to the Suez.
The Zionists (and Arabs ftm) were a side issue.
pardon? The Brits may have been willing to help here and there but
I would hardly call their contribution as "an effort to establish" anything.
Especially in light of the OTHER things they did against the effort.
pardon? The Jews were coming in ever larger numbers every year since Herzl.
They would and did continue to come regardless of the Brits, WW1, the Arabs, Oil,
the Ottomans or anything else. These other entities were all nothing but background noise.
Sorry, it clearly was the League of Nations, not United Nations.
The British TOOK that mandate authority as a spoil of war (WW1).
Their trade empire still needed an eastern Med presence close to the Suez.
The Zionists (and Arabs ftm) were a side issue.
pardon? The Brits may have been willing to help here and there but
I would hardly call their contribution as "an effort to establish" anything.
Especially in light of the OTHER things they did against the effort.
pardon? The Jews were coming in ever larger numbers every year since Herzl.
They would and did continue to come regardless of the Brits, WW1, the Arabs, Oil,
the Ottomans or anything else. These other entities were all nothing but background noise.
Before WWI, the British were already in Egypt meaning they had access to the Suez Canal.
The League of Nations gave Great Britain a mandate authority over the area of Palestine (which included the area of the Jordan river which is later became Transjordan/Jordan).
The Balfour Declaration was given as a result of Chaim Weizmann's contribution to Great Britain's war effort as a chemist.
The League of Nations (gave Political cover for) Great Britain (and France taking) a mandate authority...
The LON itself was promulgated at the same time by the same allied nations.
Presenting that ineffectual organization as having any sort of independence
or even a recognized gravitas is rather absurd.
Quote:
Before WWI, the British were already in Egypt...
Before WWI, the British were everywhere. They were TheEmpire.
Quote:
...meaning they had access to the Suez Canal.
Meaning they could get away with doing just about anything they wanted. Then.
Until WW2 broke out they acted like they still could.
Even after the War they still tried to pretend that they could.
Their prime motivation everywhere was trade (same as the US today) and w/r/t to the
eastern med in particular and in the wake of the war that meant having a Navy presence
in the region. Which in turn means a deep sea port of their own or that they could control.
The Zionsts and Arabs and their issues, beyond impact on trade (read: oil), pulled up the rear.
This mercantile reality has proven to be the common denominator of what has passed for
western diplomacy and statesmanship in/to/for the region ever since.
The British TOOK that mandate authority as a spoil of war (WW1).
Their trade empire still needed an eastern Med presence close to the Suez.
The Zionists (and Arabs ftm) were a side issue.
pardon? The Brits may have been willing to help here and there but
I would hardly call their contribution as "an effort to establish" anything.
Especially in light of the OTHER things they did against the effort.
pardon? The Jews were coming in ever larger numbers every year since Herzl.
They would and did continue to come regardless of the Brits, WW1, the Arabs, Oil,
the Ottomans or anything else. These other entities were all nothing but background noise.
Firstly, The Turks were beaten in WW1. The Ottoman empire was split to be run for the League of Nations by the UK and France as a temporary measure. These territories were not in the British or French empires. The British had stopped empire building by then and ended up with more territory to police.
The British were already in the eastern Med in Cyprus and Egypt. They already controlled Egypt and the canal. Oil had not been found in large quantities in the Middle East in 1918. The British found oil in Iran and built the refinery at Aberdan which was essential in supplying the British and the USSR in WW2. The British never looked elsewhere find oil as Iran provided enough. The US were allowed to look for oil in Saudi Arabia and found it on the Gulf in vast quantities opposite Iran in 1938.
The region was not a rich trading block or filled with valuable natural resources in 1918. It was backward and poverty stricken. The area was not a natural trade route. The only one, an artificial one, the canal, the British controlled. The British and French wanted a stable area that was not a threat to them and their empires and aimed to create one largely creating the Middle East states we have today.
Pre WW2, the British did not like Jews from Europe flooding into Palestine which would destabilise the region - and it did. The British stopped the flow of Jews into the region. The British allowed people to buy land in Palestine and the Jews bought up land, which was a mistake. No one could buy land in Hong Kong. The Balfour Declaration was the first large step to give Jews a "homeland", not a sovereign state.
The region was not a rich trading block or filled with valuable natural resources in 1918.
It was backward and poverty stricken. The area was not a natural trade route.
The British and French wanted a stable area that was not a threat to them and their empires...
As far as this goes... correct.
If you want to flesh it out more limit references to the time in question (1917-21).
As for me, I'll stick with the points I've already made.
As far as this goes... correct.
If you want to flesh it out more limit references to the time in question (1917-21).
As for me, I'll stick with the points I've already made.
..of which had inaccuracies.
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