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Old 04-12-2018, 12:38 PM
 
983 posts, read 543,089 times
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Originally Posted by HomeIsWhere... View Post
A great read Ulsterman!

I am not surprised that women of Ulster-Scots/Scotch-Irish ancestry weren't the complete mirror image of the Ulster-Scots/Scotch-Irish men. They were devoted and loyal people to their husbands/wives, their families, their communities and most of all to their new found country of America. They are a fierce people with no limitations on their sense of responsibility and duty.

Not surprisingly, yet another view.

Carter G Woodson, Berea College (Kentucky) and the term 'Scotch-Irish' yet again

"… the strongest stock among these immigrants, however, were the Scotch-Irish, "a God-fearing, Sabbath-keeping, covenant-adhering, liberty-loving and tyrant-hating race" which had formed its ideals under the influence of philosophy of John Calvin, John Knox, Andrew Melville, and George Buchanan.

Carter G Woodson, Berea College (Kentucky) and the term 'Scotch-Irish' yet again | Bloggin fae the 'Burn: <i>Ulster-Scots thoughts</i>
Bloggin fae the Burn has a lot on it. I noticed a music CD which said from Scotland to Ulster to America and had a Foreword by Dolly Parton. I think Dolly said she was Scotch-Irish.

A couple of pics. In 1889 they were still meeting. Think this meeting was in Tennessee'




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Old 04-13-2018, 04:16 PM
 
Location: East of the Mississippi and South of Bluegrass
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This thread is always 'schooling' me on the subject of the Ulster-Scots and their history from Ulster to Colonial America and beyond. Thank you to all who have contributed.

Old Ezekiel And the Eels

In 1719, the first Scotch-Irish pioneers settled in the area called Nutfield. The men came first and built a row of cabins on Ryan’s Hill. With that task completed, they returned to the settled coast to get their wives and children and take them to their new frontier home.

Soon the Nutfield pioneers had consumed what food they had brought by packhorses and on their backs.

Everyone in the Nutfield colony was discouraged.

Without food, they could not survive.

This excerpt is from “Nutfield Rambles”, Richard Holmes’ fifth published piece on local history.

http://www.londonderrynh.net/2009/12...the-eels/15305
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Old 04-14-2018, 12:40 PM
 
983 posts, read 543,089 times
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Originally Posted by HomeIsWhere... View Post
This thread is always 'schooling' me on the subject of the Ulster-Scots and their history from Ulster to Colonial America and beyond. Thank you to all who have contributed.

Old Ezekiel And the Eels

In 1719, the first Scotch-Irish pioneers settled in the area called Nutfield. The men came first and built a row of cabins on Ryan’s Hill. With that task completed, they returned to the settled coast to get their wives and children and take them to their new frontier home.

Soon the Nutfield pioneers had consumed what food they had brought by packhorses and on their backs.

Everyone in the Nutfield colony was discouraged.

Without food, they could not survive.

This excerpt is from “Nutfield Rambles”, Richard Holmes’ fifth published piece on local history.

Old Ezekiel And The Eels – Londonderry News
So they got their fish thanks to Old Ezekiel. They would maybe not have survived without his help and of course the fish. Reading it jogged my memory and a piece I read about the famine Irish who would not eat fish. I don't know why this was so and would have to look it up again.

The Nutfield Ulster-Scots did not hold Christmas but on other occasions they would party to the late hours.

I think a member of the 12th Louisanna String Band summed them up when he said about them arriving in America and the Quakers..'then among them came these Bible thumping gun-toting whisky drinking people'
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Old 04-14-2018, 03:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by England Dan View Post
The American south descendants are all ( white descent) from Scottish/English Protestant roots only.
Not so. I am entirely of Southern descent, but my heritage includes Scots-Irish, Irish, English, Scots, Welsh, German, Huguenot French, and Channel Island roots. My various ancestors settled in Colonial Virginia and Maryland, then migrated to North Carolina and Georgia after the Revolution, with subsequent generations moving on to Tennessee, Alabama, and Arkansas.

My Scots-Irish ancestors left County Derry, sailed from Larne, landed in Philadelphia, then eventually made their way down the Great Philadelphia Wagon Road through the Valley of Virginia into the North Carolina Blue Ridge, where they remained for a couple of generations (and still have some descendants).

All my ancestors other than the Scots-Irish arrived before the American Revolution - the Scots-Irish came over in 1890, the last of my folks to arrive on these shores. Fortunately, my ancestors were great at writing down family records, making it much easier to their descendants to "fill in the blanks."

Last edited by CraigCreek; 04-14-2018 at 03:55 PM..
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Old 04-14-2018, 08:07 PM
 
Location: East of the Mississippi and South of Bluegrass
4,108 posts, read 3,394,085 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
So they got their fish thanks to Old Ezekiel. They would maybe not have survived without his help and of course the fish. Reading it jogged my memory and a piece I read about the famine Irish who would not eat fish. I don't know why this was so and would have to look it up again.

The Nutfield Ulster-Scots did not hold Christmas but on other occasions they would party to the late hours.

I think a member of the 12th Louisanna String Band summed them up when he said about them arriving in America and the Quakers..'then among them came these Bible thumping gun-toting whisky drinking people'
Go figure Ulsterman (re: famine Irish who would not eat fish) as one may expect, depending on which source one procures their answer from, one will get different reasons and scenarios. I did find these articles somewhat interesting and maybe they're true but I cannot even offer firsthand anecdotes...I don't have any stories to hand down on the subject.

Irish Famine (1740–41)

Diets varied according to village locations and individual income, with many people supplementing these staples with river, lake or sea fish, especially herring, and small game such as wild duck.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_..._%281740–41%29

Capitalism and the Irish famine

From Elizabethan times and right through the penal era also, Irish (Catholic) ownership or captaincy of fishing vessels was outlawed. By the early 1800s and with the penal laws being relaxed a revival in the fishing industry was literally blown out of the water by a series of anti-competition laws passed by Peel which effectively and deliberately ruined much of the country’s indigenous industry to ensure Irish companies and artisans did not compete with British capital; fishery’s, manufacturing, glass making, etc., all were deliberately ruined by the British administrations. Harbors and boats also were either deliberately not built or let fall into complete disrepair.

Capitalism and the Irish famine - Page 4
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Old 04-15-2018, 11:54 AM
 
983 posts, read 543,089 times
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Originally Posted by HomeIsWhere... View Post
Go figure Ulsterman (re: famine Irish who would not eat fish) as one may expect, depending on which source one procures their answer from, one will get different reasons and scenarios. I did find these articles somewhat interesting and maybe they're true but I cannot even offer firsthand anecdotes...I don't have any stories to hand down on the subject.

Irish Famine (1740–41)

Diets varied according to village locations and individual income, with many people supplementing these staples with river, lake or sea fish, especially herring, and small game such as wild duck.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_..._%281740–41%29

Capitalism and the Irish famine

From Elizabethan times and right through the penal era also, Irish (Catholic) ownership or captaincy of fishing vessels was outlawed. By the early 1800s and with the penal laws being relaxed a revival in the fishing industry was literally blown out of the water by a series of anti-competition laws passed by Peel which effectively and deliberately ruined much of the country’s indigenous industry to ensure Irish companies and artisans did not compete with British capital; fishery’s, manufacturing, glass making, etc., all were deliberately ruined by the British administrations. Harbors and boats also were either deliberately not built or let fall into complete disrepair.

Capitalism and the Irish famine - Page 4
As you have said I suppose it is what book is read

And, inadequate though they were, the measures introduced by the government should be noted. In 1847 the Destitute Poor (Ireland) Act introduced the idea of setting up soup kitchens thoughout Famine Ireland, and around this time Alexis Soyer (1810-58) the celebrated French chef at London's Reform Club, and arguably the most famous contemporary chef in Europe, was enthusing over the potential for soup kitchens as a means for addressing the problems of the poor. Soyer now turned his thinking towards Ireland. Soyer also showed a persistent interest in charitable cookery and during the Famine he ran a major soup kitchen in Dublin. He left for Ireland in February 1847 and stayed there until 11 April. On Monday, 5 April his soup kitchen opened in Dublin. Soyer's Dublin kitchen produced good food at great speed and the response was positive and overwhelming. It demonstrated that some efforts were made, even during the much-maligned period of Whig government, to deal with Irish need.

While in Ireland, Soyer was horrified to note that fish was being used as fertilizer for potatoes, rather than as food, simply because people in Ireland ' know how to cook potatoes to perfection and are totally ignorant of the way to cook fish....the country produces plenty of vegetable and animal substances, and the waters washing your magnificent shores teem with life....They only require to be properly employed to supply the wants of everyone , with good, nourishing and platable food. ' Soyer thought that the poor should eat as well as possible, and put considerable effort into making this a reality; but he also thought that, as in France, so also peasants in Ireland should be able to produce good food from the good ingredients around them.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:27 PM
 
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To get back to the American connection.

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Old 04-17-2018, 09:20 PM
 
Location: East of the Mississippi and South of Bluegrass
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Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
To get back to the American connection.
Aye, (as you say) back to the American connection...

How the Scots-Irish Came to America (And What They Brought With Them)

In the summer of 1718, five ships of Scots-Irish immigrants from Ulster arrived in Boston to an uncertain welcome. The Puritan leaders sympathized with their fellow Protestants who also endured Anglican intolerance. But the newcomers came from an impoverished land, and whether they could support themselves was an open question.

Cotton Mather wrote in his diary:

But what shall be done for the great number of people that are transporting themselves thither from ye North of Ireland?

Had he known that they brought seed potatoes for the first potato patch in America, he might have been more sanguine about their arrival.

How the Scots-Irish Came to America (And What They Brought With Them) - New England Historical Society
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Old 04-22-2018, 11:36 AM
 
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HomeIsWhere another good link.Some of the comments referred to Cromwell and Scots being sold into slavery. I think it happened to English folk too though maybe not at the time of Cromwell.

Some more words about the Ulster-Scots in America.... When he refers to the American soldier he would have been speaking to him when he was stationed in Ulster during WW2.

Then again they introduced into New England two things that were never seen there before - the small flax spinning wheel and the irish potato. Many of them wintered in Boston city in the first year of their arrival, and the good ladies of Boston were tremendously intrigued by the strange machines which seemed inseparable from the Ulster women. Indeed, to watch the spinning became a fashionable fad. Further, it is because of these emigrants that our potatoes, which came to Europe from South America, are known as 'Irish' potatoes all over the United States. A family named Young, from Burt, in Donegal, presented a few of these strange tubers to its New England neighbours, but the gift was regarded as poisonous, and the potatoes were thrown into the nearest swamp. Eventually a man named Walker, in Andover, Massachusetts, was persuaded to plant a few tubers. They blossomed and produced their seed in what we call potato 'apples'. Mrs Walker made a valiant effort to cook these apples. She tried them boiled, and she tried them roasted, and in the end pronounced them unfit for food. But the following spring, when Mr Walker was ploughing his garden, he turned up some potatoes, and when these had been cooked, the verdict was enthusiastic. Lat year I asked an American soldier from Iowa if his people had a special name to distinguish our potato from the sweet potato. ''Yes, he said,''we have. We call your kind 'Irish potatoes.'

It is well known that the record of Congress in the war was far from creditable. It would not give Washington enough regular troops, and it would not properly equip, clothe or feed the troops that he had. Those who do not wish to read about this in history can read about it in the American novel ''Rabble in Arms.'' Congress wanted to fight the war on the cheap, with militia; it feared to demand long-term service; it pandered to complaints; it was fertile ground for military intrigue; it let Washington down again and again. He had many claims to greatness; but among them this must never be forgotten, that he was able to keep an army in the field when a lesser man would have thrown up his command in disgust. Militia, here to-day, and away to morrow, were no substitute for troops of the line, yet again and again the general's appeals for more regulars fell on deaf ears. There were times, therefore, when his army was small, and since it is generally agreed that the Ulster-Scots were steadfastly enthusiastic for the war, it could very well be that often they comprised the greater part of his men. One famous force of regulars was the Pennsylvania Line and these were Ulstermen almost to a man.

A few words may be said here about the civil side of the war effort. In 1780 the army of the United Colonies was in sad condition, imperfectly supplied with equipment and munitions of war, disgracefully clad and poorly fed. A number of patriotic citizens, hopeless of Congress action, subscribed a large sum of money to purchase equipment, clothing and food for their fighting men. Among these patriots was Blair McClenaghan, who gave 50,000 dollars. He was born in Ulster. James Mease gave 25,000 dollars. He was born in Strabane. His uncle John, born in the same town, gave 20,000 dollars. John Dunlop gave a similar sum and he was born in Strabane. John Murray was born in Belfast. He gave 30,000 dollars. John Donaldson, of Dungannon gave 10.000 dollars. John Nixon, Thomas Barclay and John Nesbitt were three men of Ulster origin who gave 30,000 dollars apiece. This list could be extended and these are only a few of out of those who might be named. The acid test of enthusiasm for a cause is generous support in the form of hard cash. It is clear that our folk passed the test.
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Old 04-23-2018, 01:02 AM
 
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
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Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
HomeIsWhere another good link.Some of the comments referred to Cromwell and Scots being sold into slavery. I think it happened to English folk too though maybe not at the time of Cromwell.

Some more words about the Ulster-Scots in America.... When he refers to the American soldier he would have been speaking to him when he was stationed in Ulster during WW2.

Then again they introduced into New England two things that were never seen there before - the small flax spinning wheel and the irish potato. Many of them wintered in Boston city in the first year of their arrival, and the good ladies of Boston were tremendously intrigued by the strange machines which seemed inseparable from the Ulster women. Indeed, to watch the spinning became a fashionable fad. Further, it is because of these emigrants that our potatoes, which came to Europe from South America, are known as 'Irish' potatoes all over the United States. A family named Young, from Burt, in Donegal, presented a few of these strange tubers to its New England neighbours, but the gift was regarded as poisonous, and the potatoes were thrown into the nearest swamp. Eventually a man named Walker, in Andover, Massachusetts, was persuaded to plant a few tubers. They blossomed and produced their seed in what we call potato 'apples'. Mrs Walker made a valiant effort to cook these apples. She tried them boiled, and she tried them roasted, and in the end pronounced them unfit for food. But the following spring, when Mr Walker was ploughing his garden, he turned up some potatoes, and when these had been cooked, the verdict was enthusiastic. Lat year I asked an American soldier from Iowa if his people had a special name to distinguish our potato from the sweet potato. ''Yes, he said,''we have. We call your kind 'Irish potatoes.'

It is well known that the record of Congress in the war was far from creditable. It would not give Washington enough regular troops, and it would not properly equip, clothe or feed the troops that he had. Those who do not wish to read about this in history can read about it in the American novel ''Rabble in Arms.'' Congress wanted to fight the war on the cheap, with militia; it feared to demand long-term service; it pandered to complaints; it was fertile ground for military intrigue; it let Washington down again and again. He had many claims to greatness; but among them this must never be forgotten, that he was able to keep an army in the field when a lesser man would have thrown up his command in disgust. Militia, here to-day, and away to morrow, were no substitute for troops of the line, yet again and again the general's appeals for more regulars fell on deaf ears. There were times, therefore, when his army was small, and since it is generally agreed that the Ulster-Scots were steadfastly enthusiastic for the war, it could very well be that often they comprised the greater part of his men. One famous force of regulars was the Pennsylvania Line and these were Ulstermen almost to a man.

A few words may be said here about the civil side of the war effort. In 1780 the army of the United Colonies was in sad condition, imperfectly supplied with equipment and munitions of war, disgracefully clad and poorly fed. A number of patriotic citizens, hopeless of Congress action, subscribed a large sum of money to purchase equipment, clothing and food for their fighting men. Among these patriots was Blair McClenaghan, who gave 50,000 dollars. He was born in Ulster. James Mease gave 25,000 dollars. He was born in Strabane. His uncle John, born in the same town, gave 20,000 dollars. John Dunlop gave a similar sum and he was born in Strabane. John Murray was born in Belfast. He gave 30,000 dollars. John Donaldson, of Dungannon gave 10.000 dollars. John Nixon, Thomas Barclay and John Nesbitt were three men of Ulster origin who gave 30,000 dollars apiece. This list could be extended and these are only a few of out of those who might be named. The acid test of enthusiasm for a cause is generous support in the form of hard cash. It is clear that our folk passed the test.
The Nixons were Quakers.

Actually, while many of the Quakers who arrived at the ports of Philadelphia & Wilmington, were from northern England, some were from Ulster, like the Kirks.
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