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Old 03-24-2018, 10:30 AM
 
Location: New Mexico via Ohio via Indiana
1,574 posts, read 1,410,081 times
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LBJ's Great Society was nothing short of groundbreaking. We are better for it, in many cases. Doing nothing about our own would have been ridiculous, considering our boom and influence globally we were attaining.
I think he's less than remembered as much as Lincoln and others because he was a one-termer, wedged in between Kennedy and Nixon, almost as an afterthought. He is often thought to simply be continuing JFK's programs, though that was not the case entirely (and somewhat not at all), but it made good copy politically for him.
Vietnam consumed him, though. Would have been interesting to see what he could have done with two full terms without the war.
And he was less than perfect as a human being to say the least. And highly political, and as self-serving as any President before or since.
He reminds me of the famous quote: "Great men are not always good men." Not thinking he was great ,but he sure had foresight and an innate ability to cross the aisle to get bipartisan support unlike anyone outside of FDR, or in more modern terms, Clinton. As cruel as he could be personally, and as selfish, he sure loved poor folks and kids and genuinely went out of his way to make a difference for them and to help them. (Something very Texan about that, regardless of politics.) That is the positive part of his legacy, and he was always conscious of that. For good and bad.
And for some reason, he always reminded me of Foghorn Leghorn. Unintentionally funny man.
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Old 03-24-2018, 10:39 AM
Status: "Trump Resistance - The (establishment) Empire Strikes Back" (set 24 days ago)
 
Location: New York Area
17,531 posts, read 6,848,578 times
Reputation: 13493
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovemyladybabykitten04 View Post
how come in general though doesn't anyone remember or talk about the invisible president if he never existed? i want to know was he a good president or bad president? what about his personality?. . what did he accomplish? what did he fail at? if no one is able to answer this for sure he is so invisible he may as well not ever to exist as a president. maybe he could have been more well known if he was famous movie star and direct too. . he is like steve spielberg for example... lbj the president no one ever knew and never does anyone remember him ever again. let's see what others have to say. see what you can find out about this former u.s. president. maybe we will all learn something hopefully.
Despite some real accomplishments like the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act and the Fair Housing Act the time of his term in office was a disaster.

  1. You had the Vietnam War for example. What was wrong with it is no one figured out a goal and how to get there. The result was a protesting and confused populace;
  2. Inflation went from prices barely rising to around 6%;
  3. The gold standard was threatened and about to collapse;
  4. The college campuses were in an uproar;
  5. Urban riots most summers; and
  6. The hippie movement and "free love."
Makes the period quite forgettable.

Nixon was worse but easier to demonize because of mannerisms and being Republican.
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Old 03-24-2018, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
10,884 posts, read 7,013,524 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jowel View Post
It's ironic that President LBJ was from Texas, which typically isn't associated with the kinds of policies he promoted.
Well, political alignments do change and evolve over time.
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Old 03-24-2018, 12:15 PM
 
10,737 posts, read 8,745,284 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Despite some real accomplishments like the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act and the Fair Housing Act the time of his term in office was a disaster.

  1. You had the Vietnam War for example. What was wrong with it is no one figured out a goal and how to get there. The result was a protesting and confused populace;

    Mostly true.


  2. Inflation went from prices barely rising to around 6%;
  3. The gold standard was threatened and about to collapse;
  4. The college campuses were in an uproar;

    Because of Vietnam and the draft, plus the ever-increasing numbers of dead and wounded each week. Also, college activism varied - I was in college then, and my college was a hotbed of apathy for the most part.
  5. Urban riots most summers

    Actually, there were very few summers in the LBJ presidency. The urban riots were connected to police violence in response to the Civil Rights movement, and to the assassinations of Martin Luther King, Jr. and Bobby Kennedy, plus other violent deaths of Civil Rights leaders.

    [*]The hippie movement and "free love."

    Can't credit LBJ for this at all! Good grief. LBJ had little to do with sex, drugs, and rock and roll, the British Invasion, or youthful idealism. Opposition to the war in Vietnam was common in the hippie movement, but it was not a contributing factor in its existence.
Makes the period quite forgettable.

Actually, all this makes it more memorable. It was a time of incredible drama and irreversible change.

Nixon was worse but easier to demonize because of mannerisms and being Republican.


Dunno about that - there were some very edgy caricatures of LBJ around, plus loud cries of "Hey, Hey, LBJ1 How many kids did you kill today?" in ongoing antiwar demonstrations. Even at my hotbed-of-apathy university, LBJ had raw eggs thrown at him during his one visit. Such opposition and increasing domestic unrest led to LBJ's decision not to run for reelection.
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Old 03-24-2018, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,547 posts, read 17,935,774 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollytree View Post
All Presidents have pros and cons but overall, LBJ accomplished a lot.

LBJ'S Legacy:

War on Poverty: forty programs that were intended to eliminate poverty by improving living conditions and enabling people to lift themselves out of the cycle of poverty.
Education: sixty separate bills that provided for new and better-equipped classrooms, minority scholarships, and low-interest student loans.
Medicare & Medicaid: guaranteed health care to every American over sixty-five.
The Environment: introduced measures to promote clean air and water.
National Endowment for the Arts and the Humanities: program to support artists, performers, and writers.
Job Corps: provided enabling skills for young men and women.
Head Start: program for four- and five-year-old children from disadvantaged families.
I remember him well. The man was both a very inspired man, his above legacy changing many many lives for the good. It wasn't easy and a part of him really did care about the welfare of those left out of options most considered normal. And his manner, restrained and honest, kept the sharp divisions muted there.

But there was also Vietnam. No, he didn't start it, but he was deeply entrenched in the idea that we must win. That it's cost was high, but justified by the intended outcome. From what I've read, he could not understand the uprising of the anti war activists, or their support. He saw far with one vision, but was blinded by the other. So Viet Nam compromised his legacy rather deeply.

I don't think there's many now who'd say the we had to win at all costs plan did us as an society any good. But the tragic part is sometimes it takes so long to understand that it was the wrong option. Johnson's legacy will always have Vietnam and his clinging to his age clouding his passions.
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Old 03-24-2018, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Ft. Myers
18,927 posts, read 11,950,035 times
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Lyndon who ? Oh, the guy who took over after Kennedy was assassinated ! I was there during that time, and I remember very little of what he did, good or bad. Kinda a lackluster President IMO.
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Old 03-24-2018, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Nantahala National Forest, NC
27,091 posts, read 6,499,780 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by don1945 View Post
Lyndon who ? Oh, the guy who took over after Kennedy was assassinated ! I was there during that time, and I remember very little of what he did, good or bad. Kinda a lackluster President IMO.

Well there was Viet Nam, as mentioned, on one hand...

then his Civil Rights work on the other.

Kind of a draw.

I didn't like him personally as he picked his dogs up by the ears at times.
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Old 03-24-2018, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Louisiana
809 posts, read 639,762 times
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His " civil rights work " had ulterior motives . He used black people to gain Democrat votes .
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Old 03-24-2018, 03:04 PM
 
9,532 posts, read 9,577,012 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Despite some real accomplishments like the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act and the Fair Housing Act the time of his term in office was a disaster.

  1. You had the Vietnam War for example. What was wrong with it is no one figured out a goal and how to get there. The result was a protesting and confused populace;

    Johnson has to accept responsibility for escalating American involvement in Vietnam. The problem with that is that the decision was not made in a vacuum. It was the product of bad foreign policy decisions made by a number of Presidents since the end of World War II and hysteria that surrounded the Cold War. Had Johnson not escalated American involvement in Vietnam, the South would have fallen to the North and everyone would have called him a "communist appeaser and sympathizer". There was no winning over this no matter what Johnson did. The decisions he made were right in accord with what all foreign policy advisers were telling him. Barry Goldwater actually suggested dropping nuclear bombs on Vietnam which could easily have lead to World War III. I submit that no one could have done much better than Johnson did. Vietnam was like a train coming down the tracks. Stopping that train would have required an enormous effort that very few people could have made.


  2. Inflation went from prices barely rising to around 6%;

    Its been much higher than that at other times. It was higher than that following both World War I and World War II. It was higher during the last part of the Carter presidential years. Six percent isn't great, but it isn't an unmanageable number.
  3. The gold standard was threatened and about to collapse;

    Nixon took us completely off the Gold Standard about 1971.

  4. The college campuses were in an uproar;

    Demonstrations against the war began about 1967. They steadily grew and popularity of the war declined. The problem with major foreign policy decisions is that they cannot be instantly reversed. Once arriving at a decision that the war could not be won, a strategy for gradually withdrawing the troops and ending American involvement in the war on honorable terms had to be constructed. It wasn't easy. The Paris Accords were not signed until 1973.
  5. Urban riots most summers; and

    The ghetto riots were a function of decades of discrimination and had very little to do with LBJ. In fact, his civil rights legislation was aimed at trying to eliminate such problems from the fabric of America.
  6. The hippie movement and "free love."

    I doubt this had anything to do with LBJ. It was a function of the times and changes in American culture. "Free love" became possible with the development of the birth control pill. I wonder what you think any President could have done about this.
Makes the period quite forgettable.

Nixon was worse but easier to demonize because of mannerisms and being Republican.
Anyone who had any doubts about Nixon need only review Watergate. The President literally sat in the oval office plotting how to bribe members of his administration to lie to a federal grand jury investigating the Watergate burglary. Payments of hush money were actually made at Nixon's direction with this intent. Other Presidents may have violated laws. What made Watergate unique was this President did so blatantly and with full knowledge he was breaking the law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by selogic View Post
His " civil rights work " had ulterior motives . He used black people to gain Democrat votes .
Interesting you would say this. Right after Johnson succeeded in getting the Civil Rights Act of 1964 enacted he told people all around him that he thought the democrats had lost the South as a voting bloc for at least a generation. He was more concerned with the votes he lost than any he might be getting. In getting these laws passed, LBJ behaved more like a statesman than a politician. Since he never ran for reelection he never personally benefited if any new votes resulted from the passage of this legislation.

*My replies in bold.
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Old 03-24-2018, 04:56 PM
 
Location: 912 feet above sea level
2,269 posts, read 939,622 times
Reputation: 12519
Quote:
Originally Posted by selogic View Post
His " civil rights work " had ulterior motives . He used black people to gain Democrat votes .
Nonsense.

For every vote gained by the enfranchisement of blacks, he lost a vote ... because of white resentment over the enfranchisement of blacks. The Solid South was gone and LBJ knew it, telling special assistant (later press secretary) Bill Moyers: "I think we just delivered the South to the Republican party for a long time to come" upon signing the Civil Rights Act into law in 1964.
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