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Old Today, 02:33 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
212 posts, read 69,375 times
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I've heard that this battle could be thought of as a Coup attempt. As Caesar's child in Egypt was Co-Pharoah with his mother Cleopatra and was the rightful heir to Rome. Had this occurred, I've also heard that this would have brought the capital of the Roman Empire(Rome) to Egypt instead of remaining in Italy. And thus, the Roman Empire would of had an Egyptian base and not of been an Italian thing.

Again, can this battle be thought of in some respect as a failed Coup attempt??

P.S. I know Egypt was not part of the Roman Empire, but Mark Antony was a Roman Citizen.

Last edited by AlwaysByChance; Today at 03:41 PM..
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Old Today, 02:51 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
37,498 posts, read 17,639,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysByChance View Post
I've heard that this battle could be thought of as a Coup attempt. As Caesar's child in Egypt was Co-Pharoah with his mother Cleopatra and was the rightful heir to Rome. Had this occurred, I've also heard that this would have brought the capital of the Roman Empire(Rome) to Egypt instead of remaining in Italy. And thus, the Roman Empire would of had an Egyptian base and not of been an Italian thing.

Again, can this battle be thought of in some respect as a failed Coup attempt??
On what basis would Caesar's child with Cleopatra be "the rightful heir to Rome?" Rome was not a monarchy with bloodline succession. Caesar got himself named Dictator for Life but that did not come with any laws regarding his eventual replacement. Even after Caesar's will was read and it was learned that he had named Octavian as his heir, that meant he was heir to Caesar's fortune, not necessarily his political offices. Octavian was not suddenly named emperor, he had to fight for it.

Last edited by Grandstander; Today at 03:50 PM..
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Old Today, 03:25 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
212 posts, read 69,375 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
On what basis would Caesar's child with Cleopatra be "the rightful heir to Rome?" Rome was not a monarchy with bloodline succession. Caesar got himself named Dictator for Life but that did not come with any laws regarding his eventual replacement. Even after Caesar's will was read and it was learned that he had named Octavius as his heir, that meant he was heir to Caesar's fortune, not necessarily his political offices. Octavius was not suddenly named emperor, he had to fight for it.
I'm not disagreeing with you at all. But, in your opinion can this battle be seen as a coup attempt? I know it happened near Greece and was relatively far from Rome. But, the Egyptian navy could have traveled there and took Rome had they won, right?
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Old Today, 03:50 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
37,498 posts, read 17,639,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysByChance View Post
I'm not disagreeing with you at all. But, in your opinion can this battle be seen as a coup attempt? I know it happened near Greece and was relatively far from Rome. But, the Egyptian navy could have traveled there and took Rome had they won, right?
Antony and Octavian each held the same rank, the empire was divided into two ruling divisions after the termination of Lepidus from the triumvirate. Either side warring on the other might be construed as a coup attempt.
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Old Today, 03:58 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
212 posts, read 69,375 times
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Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
Antony and Octavian each held the same rank, the empire was divided into two ruling divisions after the termination of Lepidus from the triumvirate. Either side warring on the other might be construed as a coup attempt.
Ok, I'm also guessing it's seen as a battle between Rome and Egypt because Egypt was independent, hence it couldn't be seen as a Coup attempt. But, Mark Antony a Roman Citizen, was calling the shots that's why I see it as a Coup attempt.
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Old Today, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
37,498 posts, read 17,639,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysByChance View Post
Ok, I'm also guessing it's seen as a battle between Rome and Egypt because Egypt was independent, hence it couldn't be seen as a Coup attempt. But, Mark Antony a Roman Citizen, was calling the shots that's why I see it as a Coup attempt.
It was a battle between the two halves of the Roman empire, not a battle between Rome and Egypt.
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Old Today, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
212 posts, read 69,375 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
It was a battle between the two halves of the Roman empire, not a battle between Rome and Egypt.
Egypt was the power behind it all. I know the Egyptians retreated but they were there in numbers without a doubt.
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Old Today, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Proxima Centauri
3,892 posts, read 1,647,132 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysByChance View Post
I've heard that this battle could be thought of as a Coup attempt. As Caesar's child in Egypt was Co-Pharoah with his mother Cleopatra and was the rightful heir to Rome. Had this occurred, I've also heard that this would have brought the capital of the Roman Empire(Rome) to Egypt instead of remaining in Italy. And thus, the Roman Empire would of had an Egyptian base and not of been an Italian thing.

Again, can this battle be thought of in some respect as a failed Coup attempt??

P.S. I know Egypt was not part of the Roman Empire, but Mark Antony was a Roman Citizen.

I'm having trouble with what you said in your PS. Mare Nostrum included all of the Mediterranean coast line. I will check this out.
It appears that Egypt was a dependent state in 50 BC. It was later incorporated into the Roman Empire by 117 AD.
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Old Today, 04:23 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland area
212 posts, read 69,375 times
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Originally Posted by Tonyafd View Post
I'm having trouble with what you said in your PS. Mare Nostrum included all of the Mediterranean coast line. I will check this out.
It appears that Egypt was a dependent state in 50 BC. It was later incorporated into the Roman Empire by 117 AD.
As you may or may not be aware Egypt was Independent until 30BC

This is what Egypt and Rome looked like in 50BC dude.

https://www.google.com/search?source...uzKHdYrtuMhOM:

Last edited by AlwaysByChance; Today at 04:42 PM..
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Old Today, 05:16 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
1,832 posts, read 681,148 times
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Actually, it was Octavian who declared war on Egypt (Antony & Cleopatra) https://www.history.com/this-day-in-...ttle-of-actium


Check this time line for November 44BC. https://www.totallytimelines.com/oct...-63-bce-14-ce/ That's the year G.Julius Caesar was assassinated and Marc Antony was Consul (officially elected leader) of Rome. Octavian "relieved" him of that duty with the threat of his personal army. That was the coup. The battle of Actium 13 yrs later was merely the final stand of Antony when he ran out of bullets, so to speak.
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