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Old Today, 11:36 AM
 
Location: North Carolina/Maine
634 posts, read 645,665 times
Reputation: 534

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
My God people, can we give the "American/White Guilt" thing a break for once? This is a about Nazi Stolen Art, not American Indians. Stay on topic because it is an interesting topic.

Now I can't see the link from you OP (the country I am a guest in currently, China Peoples Republic of, doesn't seem to like the New York Times) so I can't address the personal spy story aspect, but there are billions, tens of billions, of dollars of stolen art still floating around Europe. Specifically between Germany and Switzerland and Liechtenstein, traded to private dealers on occasion and kept in cellars in Munich and elsewhere in Germany, handed down from descendants of nazi officers.

This is mostly modern (of that day) art, which both was vilified and fascinated nazis of that day as "degenerative" art. Much of it was stolen/plundered from well to do jewish art collectors who later ended up in the gas chambers. This was not the focus of the allied "monument men" (did anyone see that extremely bad movie?) who focused on the old classics. But they are still extremely valuable. Many Nazi's captured after the war ended said they were destroyed by allied bombing - B.S. Nazi party members knew very well where to put these in secure places, this was their retirement funds. Anyways this was noted as false when in 2012 they found a huge stockpile of over 1,000 pieces of artwork in some German's apartment, son of an SS officer.

It's still out there, all this artwork, sitting in various cellars by otherwise outstanding German citizens that have long dissociated themselves from their nazi past (and of course, they all claim there families were anti-Nazi all along during that period). Some of these, these people have no idea of the value. Others - they know very well what they are and where it came from.
I have no guilt, I am of Micmac Indian ancestry.
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Old Today, 12:08 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
74,366 posts, read 66,026,319 times
Reputation: 70927
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
My God people, can we give the "American/White Guilt" thing a break for once? This is a about Nazi Stolen Art, not American Indians. Stay on topic because it is an interesting topic.

Now I can't see the link from you OP (the country I am a guest in currently, China Peoples Republic of, doesn't seem to like the New York Times) so I can't address the personal spy story aspect, but there are billions, tens of billions, of dollars of stolen art still floating around Europe. Specifically between Germany and Switzerland and Liechtenstein, traded to private dealers on occasion and kept in cellars in Munich and elsewhere in Germany, handed down from descendants of nazi officers.

This is mostly modern (of that day) art, which both was vilified and fascinated nazis of that day as "degenerative" art. Much of it was stolen/plundered from well to do jewish art collectors who later ended up in the gas chambers. This was not the focus of the allied "monument men" (did anyone see that extremely bad movie?) who focused on the old classics. But they are still extremely valuable. Many Nazi's captured after the war ended said they were destroyed by allied bombing - B.S. Nazi party members knew very well where to put these in secure places, this was their retirement funds. Anyways this was noted as false when in 2012 they found a huge stockpile of over 1,000 pieces of artwork in some German's apartment, son of an SS officer.

It's still out there, all this artwork, sitting in various cellars by otherwise outstanding German citizens that have long dissociated themselves from their nazi past (and of course, they all claim there families were anti-Nazi all along during that period). Some of these, these people have no idea of the value. Others - they know very well what they are and where it came from.
lol. Oops, sorry. But the Germans have created a good model, for how to deal with certain aspects of history. It's a shame other nations haven't chosen to utilize that model. It's not about guilt, really; it's about how to educate responsible citizens, and how to prevent future...um..."issues", such as the US supporting genocide in Guatemala.

RE: the underlined: fascinating. Annoying if you live there, but fascinating. I wonder at what point Russia might start doing something similar.

Good post, overall. Thank you. OK, back to topic now...
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Old Today, 02:06 PM
 
Location: Forest bathing
1,406 posts, read 774,619 times
Reputation: 3225
A very fascinating and compelling history. She was a brave survivor. It was fortunate that she sent her children away for safety. What a legacy. Thank-you for sharing.

My grandmother had some German Jews as cousins whose family left Germany before 1900 including a pair of twins. Their last name was Maher. I shudder to think of their fate with the infamous Dr. Mengele.

I, too, can see a book or, at the very least, a documentary.
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