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Old 01-23-2019, 10:39 PM
 
Location: Cebu, Philippines
3,092 posts, read 1,129,611 times
Reputation: 5928

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacInTx View Post
The three US aircraft carriers in the Pacific were out on maneuvers on Dec 7, 1941, and were not located by the Japanese during the attack. (https://www.census.gov/history/pdf/p...ct-sheet-1.pdf)
They were still part of the Pearl-based Pacific fleet, concentrated in an openly hostile attack position, ostensibly threatening the Japanese. Stop quibbling, you know what I'm trying to say and you have not argumentatively addressed it, only demanded easily-supplied footnotes for what I rounded off in the interest of brevity..

Last edited by cebuan; 01-23-2019 at 10:52 PM..
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Old 01-26-2019, 01:13 PM
 
5,025 posts, read 4,542,167 times
Reputation: 1478
Quote:
Originally Posted by john620 View Post
Speaking of the Bolshevik revolution which was heavily supported by the Jewish intellectual community and with Marx and Trotsky (Lenin’s counterpart and both Jews) being vital to the creation of a communist state.
Kropotkin & Luxembourg (some sources say she was a German, others a German Jew others a Saqaliba who became a naturalized German) acknowledged they developed their ideas based on social & economic practices of those dependent nationalities in the colonial empire (Engels as well).

Engels was not only Marx's patron but his intellectual peer & partner as well as being a businessman.

Bakukin was a peer & rival of Marx & Sorel was no Marxist.

Lenin was not a chauvinist so yes, he definitely collaborated with those from the dependent nationalities but he also saw zionism as a form of bourgeois pseudo-nationalism.

The German Jews & the Sephardi based in the northern Euro Germanic speaking nation states & their empires were deeply involved in their politics & economics before Marx & Trotsky were even born.

The Maoists were Afro-Asian asabiya/Bandung Jamia commies definitely did not have a lubby dubby thang with Euro-Communism.

And revolutionary socialism existed before & outside of Marxism (1848-49).

Last edited by kovert; 01-26-2019 at 02:29 PM..
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Old 01-26-2019, 03:46 PM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
2,924 posts, read 1,983,784 times
Reputation: 3789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaffa View Post
or what is the one that interests you the least


i would say Ancient Greece is something i could never really be interested in , sadly.
1 post, 46 reputation points--highest I've ever seen for a single-post poster in city-data, ahem, history.

So apparently you're not alone in your lack of interest in ancient Greece
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Old 01-26-2019, 03:47 PM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
2,924 posts, read 1,983,784 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
This thread....okay, everyone states something which does not interest them. What are we supposed to do with that information?

It would seem more an exercise for the Games board.
Your post just vaulted to the top of my list for least favo(u)rite event in all of history.
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Old 01-26-2019, 04:07 PM
 
Location: San Diego CA
4,190 posts, read 3,083,195 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
For the most facile popular interpretation, Pearl Harbor. It was not an attack on the USA, no effort was made to harm civilians, Hawaii was inhabited by more Japanese than ethnic Americans (and still is), nothing was targeted except military assets, which had been assembled there as an obvious and direct threat to the Japanese, who had as much right to defend their interests the Pacific as the Americans had.
Oh my God. Just about everything you have said is historically incorrect.
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Old 01-26-2019, 07:01 PM
 
Location: First Hill, Seattle
5,650 posts, read 5,996,296 times
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I would have to say the Mongol invasions. So many people slaughtered, so many priceless writings, art, and architecture destroyed. Rape, plunder, genocide. Cities like Baghdad and Kiev utterly annihilated. Baghdad, in particular, never recovered from it. And the Mongols contributed very little, politically or culturally, to the kingdoms they subjugated. The only positive aspects of that era, as far as I’m concerned, were the victories against the Mongols, in places like Austria and Japan. The tremendous adversity the Mongols presented provided an opportunity for some figures to really shine in their victories against them, and they are still talked about to this day.

The military prowess of the Mongols was beyond reproach, but they frankly sucked at governing and maintaining their empire, and eventually just became absorbed into the various cultures they conquered, and it was a dramatically quick process, comparatively speaking.
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Old 01-26-2019, 07:29 PM
 
Location: New York Area
14,115 posts, read 5,589,430 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cebuan View Post
The entire naval Pacific fleet was, which even after Pearl Harbor, was by itself enough to defeat Japan. You can't defeat an argument with a quibble, especially when that's all you've got.

So just strike out the word "entire", read my post again, and get back to me.
That is no quibble; very little of America's military force was concentrated at Pearl Harbor. Japan was betting that we wouldn't go to war over a territory. That's a main reason that Alaska and Hawaii became states in the aftermath of WWII and Korea.
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Old 01-26-2019, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Cebu, Philippines
3,092 posts, read 1,129,611 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgsing View Post
Oh my God. Just about everything you have said is historically incorrect.
So you believe the American Pacific fleet just happened to all be at Pearl at the same time (or were not really there at all), nobody had any notion to use them tactically against the Japanese, and the attack was intended to target blonde blue-eyed civilians and civilian installations, they accidentally hit military targets instead.. Umm, OK.

Last edited by cebuan; 01-26-2019 at 08:28 PM..
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Old 01-27-2019, 09:53 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
12,358 posts, read 7,877,302 times
Reputation: 18110
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
I would have to say the Mongol invasions. So many people slaughtered, so many priceless writings, art, and architecture destroyed. Rape, plunder, genocide. Cities like Baghdad and Kiev utterly annihilated. Baghdad, in particular, never recovered from it. And the Mongols contributed very little, politically or culturally, to the kingdoms they subjugated. The only positive aspects of that era, as far as Iím concerned, were the victories against the Mongols, in places like Austria and Japan. The tremendous adversity the Mongols presented provided an opportunity for some figures to really shine in their victories against them, and they are still talked about to this day.

The military prowess of the Mongols was beyond reproach, but they frankly sucked at governing and maintaining their empire, and eventually just became absorbed into the various cultures they conquered, and it was a dramatically quick process, comparatively speaking.
I think you will find that the Mongols did not assimilate into their conquered territories in Europe, although they probably did in China.
The Mongols went home. They were called home after the death of their leader and never resumed their wild expansion in Europe. During their brutal occupation of European countries it was made illegal for any non-Mongol to learn the Mongol language.
That at was all around, what?... 1200 AD. Same time period as The Crusades by the Normans.



As an aside:
Does this remind you of the story of the Huns at around 400AD? They showed up in Europe killing everyone in sight, riding horses with great skill, and shooting with deadly accuracy. I saw a scientist reconstruct the face from a Hun skeleton, and she was decidedly Asian looking.
Most sources say the Huns retreated but a few say they assimilated. I think it was probably a combination of both. No one knows exactly where they came from; no one can say where they went.
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Old 01-27-2019, 11:41 PM
 
Location: First Hill, Seattle
5,650 posts, read 5,996,296 times
Reputation: 7505
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
I think you will find that the Mongols did not assimilate into their conquered territories in Europe, although they probably did in China.
The Mongols went home. They were called home after the death of their leader and never resumed their wild expansion in Europe. During their brutal occupation of European countries it was made illegal for any non-Mongol to learn the Mongol language.
That at was all around, what?... 1200 AD. Same time period as The Crusades by the Normans.



As an aside:
Does this remind you of the story of the Huns at around 400AD? They showed up in Europe killing everyone in sight, riding horses with great skill, and shooting with deadly accuracy. I saw a scientist reconstruct the face from a Hun skeleton, and she was decidedly Asian looking.
Most sources say the Huns retreated but a few say they assimilated. I think it was probably a combination of both. No one knows exactly where they came from; no one can say where they went.
Yeah, the Mongols never had an established presence in Europe, they mostly pillaged and then left. They definitely were absorbed into the cultures of the east and central Asian parts of their empire, like the Chagatai Khanate and definitely the Yuan Dynasty.

And yes - definitely reminds me of the Huns. However, we have such a greater wealth of written records from contemporaneous sources about the Mongols compared to the Huns. I’m sure the Hunnic invasions were no less brutal, but certainly seemed to have been on a smaller scale than the Mongol invasions.
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