U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-07-2019, 06:27 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 13,622,677 times
Reputation: 14253

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by TreeBeard View Post
Italy did not fight particularly porky during WWI. Their performance had more to do with poor leadership and incompetent generals. They had their defeats but toward the end of the war, they were pushing forward.

As far as WWII, Italian leadership knew that Italy was not prepared for war. Il Duce thought the war was over when he intervened. He was an idiot as he did not heed his generals who told him they were headed for disaster.
To be fair the call wasn't just Mussolini's to make: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_...g_World_War_II


Italy assumed GB would roll over after France surrendered thus ending the conflict. When that didn't happen Italian Royal Army entered WWII with their pants down so to speak.


Mussolini only got Italy into WWII after France fell; prior to this he had rebuffed Hitler's calls for Italy to enter the European war saying (correctly) the nation wasn't prepared. https://ww2db.com/country/Italy


For the record OP's query has been made before: https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-It...poorly-in-WWII


https://www.lifeinitaly.com/history/...world-war-ii-2


It cannot be overstated just how much many European nations (or at least their populace) were sick of war and wanted nothing to do with WWII.


Yes, Germany was licking her wounds and waiting to get her own back in the years between 1918 and 1939, but many others in those twenty short years had enough of war.


Aside from the massive loss of human lives, those surviving after WWI had to face rampant inflation, the Great Depression, often starvation and a host of other issues; the *last* thing inhabitants of Italy much like France and elsewhere wanted was another war. They'd heard all that palaver before about national unity, pride and whatever in the run up to WWI, and look what it got them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-07-2019, 06:30 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,462 posts, read 18,492,066 times
Reputation: 18575
Quote:
Originally Posted by SWFL_Native View Post
Because Christians especially Catholics are soft warriors.
Like Charlemagne? William the Conqueror? Richard the Lionhearted? Alfred the Great? El Cid? Soft warriors all?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2019, 07:16 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
33,839 posts, read 41,948,655 times
Reputation: 43213
Because Italian men are lovers, not fighters. Ask one. Or several.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 01:37 AM
 
Location: Eugene, Oregon
9,058 posts, read 2,958,120 times
Reputation: 13560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seenee View Post
Seems kind of crazy how in WWI Italy was part of the allies and in WWII they were part of the Axis yet regardless, they were awful and couldn't accomplish anything really noteworthy in terms of militarily speaking. Especially considering they were the ones that had the infamous Roman Republic/Empire. So what was it that made them such trash at warfare in the 20th century?
Now this is just a joke, that should not be taken seriously by Italians, who I generally like and with whose language I even have a bit of facility. But when I was in the U. S. Army, we told the story about a dealer who advertised used Italian Army rifles: never fired and dropped only once.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 02:25 AM
 
Location: South Australia
374 posts, read 91,231 times
Reputation: 867
Christians, especially Catholics are poor fighters? Gee, I didn't know that.

I'm thinking first of the Crusades, the Templars, and Richard Coeur De lion.

In modern times'; The US was and remains Protestant and Catholic,

The Brits in WW1 &2 wer protestant Christians.

The Germans were nominally Lutheran and catholic Christian during WW1 & 2 .Right through WW 2 the Wehrmacht troops still had the traditional belt buckle, with "Got Mit Uns" (God with us) engraved.

An alternate view: Without exception, every religion reflects the culture which invents it. The warlike nature, and/or innate violence pre exist any religion. The term 'religious war' is an oxymoron. Religion maybe used as an excuse , but it has nothing to do with war.

Wars are fought for one or both of two reasons only; To take something the other chap wants or to stop the other chap from taking something you have.

Although I am not a veteran, I served in a combat battalion from the time it returned from Vietnam. As a medic I got to know a large number of veterans. I kept my mouth shut ands listened; I never once heard any soldier claim he fought for country, duty or to free /protect the Vietnamese people. The only reason for fighting I ever heard was ; to protect their own life and the lives of their mates.Period.

I heard exactly the same thing from my dad's war buddies*; some fought the Japanese on the Kokoda Track, some
the Germans at El Alamein and Tobruk

I don't think your claim about christian soldiers doesn't stand up to scrutiny .Often the case with sweeping generalisations

*On the rare occasions they spoke of the war. I've never heard a veteran boast of his combat experience.Like my dad, if he spoke of it at all ,it was about the heroism of others and sacrifice of others in protecting their mates. Or of course the fun they had on leave.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 05:54 AM
 
11,881 posts, read 5,045,855 times
Reputation: 18347
Also, let's not forget millions of first and second generation Americans of Italian ancestry fought for the U.S. in WWII, many bravely giving their lives for their new country.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 06:11 AM
 
5,580 posts, read 3,647,278 times
Reputation: 5399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seenee View Post
Seems kind of crazy how in WWI Italy was part of the allies and in WWII they were part of the Axis yet regardless, they were awful and couldn't accomplish anything really noteworthy in terms of militarily speaking. Especially considering they were the ones that had the infamous Roman Republic/Empire. So what was it that made them such trash at warfare in the 20th century?
Italy today isn't Rome.

Italy is lazy. Just look at their poor economy today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Because Italian men are lovers, not fighters. Ask one. Or several.
Lovers/dogs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by marino760 View Post
Also, let's not forget millions of first and second generation Americans of Italian ancestry fought for the U.S. in WWII, many bravely giving their lives for their new country.
Yeah... They had t he US flag on their shoulders. If they were still back in Italy it'd be different.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 09:40 AM
 
563 posts, read 168,758 times
Reputation: 2070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seenee View Post
So what was it that made them such trash at warfare in the 20th century?
At the height of WWII, an Italian and German General were making ready for battle. The German barked at his assistant - "Fritz! Bring me my red tunic!"
"But General, exclaimed the Italian, won't enemy snipers target a red vest, thinking it belongs to an officer?"
"No matter", said the German, "If I am hit, my soldiers won't be able to see the blood and will not lose heart, and they will continue to fight valiantly". "Ahhh, I unnerstand", said the Italian. "Luigi, bringa me my brown trousers!".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 09:42 AM
 
6,499 posts, read 2,757,740 times
Reputation: 7807
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSquidworth View Post
Italy today isn't Rome.

Italy is lazy. Just look at their poor economy today.



Lovers/dogs.



Yeah... They had t he US flag on their shoulders. If they were still back in Italy it'd be different.

Italy is the eight largest manufacturing economy in the world ahead of the UK. Hardly lazy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-08-2019, 09:44 AM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
33,839 posts, read 41,948,655 times
Reputation: 43213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve McDonald View Post
Now this is just a joke, that should not be taken seriously by Italians, who I generally like and with whose language I even have a bit of facility. But when I was in the U. S. Army, we told the story about a dealer who advertised used Italian Army rifles: never fired and dropped only once.
I thought those were French rifles.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top