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Old 08-06-2019, 07:59 AM
Status: "Watching Matthew 24 unfold..." (set 10 days ago)
 
Location: Avery Co., NC
968 posts, read 845,076 times
Reputation: 597

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74 years ago today America destroyed Hiroshima with atomic bomb killing 80,000 people...a non military target. Then 40,000 nore when we nuked Nagasaki.
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Old 08-06-2019, 08:03 AM
 
895 posts, read 200,030 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
a non military target.
Is this true?
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Old 08-06-2019, 08:21 AM
 
871 posts, read 196,280 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
a non military target.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCal_Native View Post
Is this true?
There weren't a great deal of military assets in Hiroshima. There were some, however. The HQ of the Second General Army, as well as the HQs of a number of other units, were present in Hiroshima. There was a lot of war industry in Hiroshima, and it was a major logistics hub.

So, no, the 'non military target' claim is false.

However, it was not targeted for the military presence there. Were it a target of even moderate importance, it would not have been ignored by the USAAF until August 1945. the atomic bombings were meant to break Japanese morale at the highest level and induce surrender. This was essentially terror bombing. That will be denied by some (who will emphasize the supposed direct military importance of Hiroshima as a target) but I do not mean it as a pejorative. It is simply a fact that during World War II, the bombing of civilians in order to weaken morale among both populace and leadership was an accepted strategy. It happened to London and Rotterdam, to Manila and Hamburg and Dresden and Belgrade. The strategy is even conditionally deployed today, with the nuclear targeting of cities.

Invariably, when the discussion of the atomic bombings arises, you have two factions:
*The anti-Americans, who condemn them abominations and label any discussion of their merits as raving jingoism, and
*The American apologists, who laud them as the only reasonable recourse and condemn any questioning of them as anti-Americanism

Both are examples of historical revisionism who work to impede the actual discussion of history.
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Old 08-06-2019, 08:26 AM
 
122 posts, read 12,643 times
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Despite Hiroshima on Aug 6
Despite Nagasaki on Aug 9
Despite the threats of resumtion of conventional bombing

It still took 5 days for Japan to surrender and the vote to surrender was a tie 3-3
The Emperor, who had no vote, had to urge the 3 dissenting generals to re-consider.

To those that say Japan would have surrendered w/o dropping the nuclear bomb...NO WAY !
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Old 08-06-2019, 10:15 AM
Status: "Watching Matthew 24 unfold..." (set 10 days ago)
 
Location: Avery Co., NC
968 posts, read 845,076 times
Reputation: 597
A air/sea blockade combined with the Japanese military was in shambles as well as their capabilities to manufacture weapons would have achieved surrender and saved hundreds of thousands lives. Russia was planning to invade if they had China may have joined the effort... i don't buy the cover that we HAD to use the a-bomb to save a million American lives invading Japan. We just wanted to develop a atomic advantage over Russia...that sure didn't work out.
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Old 08-06-2019, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Howard County, Maryland
5,768 posts, read 3,704,186 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
A air/sea blockade combined with the Japanese military was in shambles as well as their capabilities to manufacture weapons would have achieved surrender and saved hundreds of thousands lives. Russia was planning to invade if they had China may have joined the effort... i don't buy the cover that we HAD to use the a-bomb to save a million American lives invading Japan. We just wanted to develop a atomic advantage over Russia...that sure didn't work out.
By August 5, 1945, we had fire-bombed more than 60 Japanese cities, including Tokyo, leaving them in smoking ruins. We had sunk almost all of their capital ships and most of their smaller ships as well. We had severed the sea links between the home islands and their captured territories, bringing shipments of oil and coal to a standstill. We had cut off millions of their soldiers, leaving them stranded on island outposts. Japan's ability to undertake any military action other than suicidal defense was nearly gone. And, perhaps most ominously, starvation was already beginning to rear its ugly head -- and with it, the horrifying possibility that MILLIONS of Japanese civilians might have died.

By any objective measure, Japan had been completely defeated by August 5, 1945. And yet, they had not surrendered by this time. Nor had they surrendered when the sun came up on August 6th. Absent the atomic bombs, what makes you think they would have surrendered on that day, or the next one, or any time?
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Old 08-06-2019, 10:52 AM
 
Location: Howard County, Maryland
5,768 posts, read 3,704,186 times
Reputation: 16895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
a non military target
Hiroshima did possess some military assets, which made it a legitimate target. But that's not why it was attacked. We needed an intact major city to conclusively demonstrate the power of the atomic bomb, and thus persuade Japan's leaders to surrender; and by August of 1945, there weren't many intact major Japanese cities left.
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Old 08-06-2019, 11:00 AM
 
12,429 posts, read 18,517,342 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
74 years ago today America destroyed Hiroshima with atomic bomb killing 80,000 people...a non military target. Then 40,000 nore when we nuked Nagasaki.
That would be incorrect - these were military targets.
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Old 08-06-2019, 11:30 AM
 
12,429 posts, read 18,517,342 times
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By the way, to avoid to repeated discussions that have already occurred in this forum multiple times, this is a good reference:

NJGOAT's guide to the atomic bombings.

OP the above addresses some of your questions addressed in your post #5. I can tell you everything has been discussed ad nausuem in this forum multiple times, every detail and element was debated, and the consensus amongst those posting has always been the same - the dropping of the atomic bomb was justified.
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Old 08-06-2019, 11:30 AM
 
1,754 posts, read 816,492 times
Reputation: 2950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchman57 View Post
A air/sea blockade combined with the Japanese military was in shambles as well as their capabilities to manufacture weapons would have achieved surrender and saved hundreds of thousands lives. Russia was planning to invade if they had China may have joined the effort... i don't buy the cover that we HAD to use the a-bomb to save a million American lives invading Japan. We just wanted to develop a atomic advantage over Russia...that sure didn't work out.
You know this how? The Japanese were not going to surrender. In the campaigns leading to the bombings, Japsnwse military units accepted casualty rates of 97%. On Okinawa, Jaoanese civilians committed suicide r as ther than surrender. An invasion of Japan would have resulted in tens of millions of Japanese deaths, and millions of allied deaths. That's reality.
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